Destroying Resources a Legitimate Tactic?

[madea]

At the risk of exposing myself to derision, I was told the devs read this part of the site, so I figured I'd post it here in the hopes they'll see it. Apologies if it is out of place, I'll post it under the other section meant for specific dev questions if necessary.

So, I log in to find that the area around my tribe's totem has been reduced to a wasteland. All of the trees destroyed, logs destroyed, and stumps destroyed. Based on after action accounts, no attempt to harvest these supplies was made as it was intended as a form of non-direct pvp.

While I didn't expect the game to hold my hand here, seeing as there is nothing we can do about it post-event seems to indicate a significant break in the system.

My main question to the devs is: "Are such slash-and-burn tactics considered viable?"

And, if so, are there any systems in place planned to help mitigate the unmitigated dickery of the tactic?

The problems is that there are literally no cons to doing it, which means that people WILL do it if for no other reason than "teh lulz", meanwhile we suffer and there is no way for us to stop it.

Setting aside the "well, if this were really a post-apocalyptic setting people wouldn't be nice" argument (which is false, because if this were real life nobody could destroy resources that fast and permanent death is either a sufficient deterrent or a permanent solution to the problem), we need something.

While I advocate the ability to replant ourselves, that still faces the problem of forcing "peaceful" players to work hard for resources that take nothing to destroy. And, in fact, harvesting those resources is a significant pain in the ass while destroying them is far, far easier.

I generally don't like to point out a problem unless I have a solution, but in this case I'm not very adept at making balanced game systems.

In which case perhaps the community has some ideas that would allow PvP without leaving non-aggressive players ripe for the abuse which will happen if no checks are in play.

Thanks.

[wolfmoonstrike]

I think the best solution might be a simple one.

Make it so players can't destroy a stump unless its on your land (or tribe's land). So it'll still allow some for some form of "dickory" but after awhile it'll just be too much of a pain in the ass to keep chopping down a tree every respawn cycle for most people.

[Daeish]

I agree with wolfmoon, that this would be a good solution.

Either that, or make trees regrow even without the stump.

[mrcalhou]

Yes, I do think it's a viable tactic. No, I do not think that trees should be able to be cut down so quickly.

[Liil]

I agree with Wolfmoonstrike also - we set up next to a forest deliberately so we would have a wood resource close by. we now have no wood at all anywhere near to our camp due to the spitefulness of other people and the fact that they removed an entire forest overnight. We now need the ability to re-grow said trees or make it so that this cannot continue happen in the future to other tribes.

[Bluebizzer]

Definitely think it needs to be made a lot harder for 1 person to destroy such a large area as they can now. No reason to stop the ability to do it all together imo, but it should be a considerable task to totally destroy everything, giving people an ample chance to try and stop them.

[madea]

And yet more complications seem to arise:

1) "Make it so players can't destroy a stump unless its on your land (or tribe's land)" - The problem here is, as Liil said, we set up next to a forest, not in the forest. Technically, there aren't any trees on "our" land.

2) "No, I do not think that trees should be able to be cut down so quickly." - If they make it hard for people to cut down trees for "PvP" purposes, they make it equally hard for people who need those resources to achieve. It's not really a deterrent.

Further, along those lines, making it prohibitively long to destroy a stump might be an acceptable/possible partial deterrent (if you've ever tried to dig up a stump you know how much that sucks), but since the only thing being claimed there is time it has limited use.

3) "but it should be a considerable task to totally destroy everything, giving people an ample chance to try and stop them. - The problem here is that there is no way to "stop" them. You can drive them off temporarily, but considering that unless a tribe is able to field a watch 24 hours a day, all anyone has to do is wait until off hours before doing what they want to do. Wash, rinse, repeat and it's really only a minor end run for the ones doing it while the people who legitimately want to gather those resources find it even harder to do so. (Resources gathering is -already - hard)

Unless, of course, you meant the destruction of resources part, by which I agree... you wouldn't be able to get rid of a forest full of trees that quickly.



Also, if I understand it correctly, trees already regrow without the stump just randomly. While I'm all for such a thing (maybe just an increased respawn timer), and obviously the solution needs to be a combination sort of thing, the bottom line is motivation. Again, my major concern is that no mechanic rewards PVPers (by letting them engage in behavior they like with little to no effort) while leaving other players vulnerable. And while I'm enjoying the crafting/resourcing/building part of Xsyon, if I just get to be a moving target for PvPers to practice on while doing so, my enthusiasm for the game is seriously dampened.

[Larsa]

... I generally don't like to point out a problem unless I have a solution, but in this case I'm not very adept at making balanced game systems.

In which case perhaps the community has some ideas that would allow PvP without leaving non-aggressive players ripe for the abuse which will happen if no checks are in play. ...

Of course posters are right when they write that trees shouldn't be so easy to destroy. However, if it would be more difficult and would take longer, people would still do it. Just because they can.

In the long run you have no other option than to relocate to a nicer neighbourhood. Even then, the same might happen again and you might have to relocate again. It's the nature of the beast.

The devs made this game with FFA PvP mechanic, thus FFA PvP-er came to play the game. Thus the trees will go down.

[Delvie]

While you can't stop this type of PVP it definitely needs to be slowed down. To completely destroy logs should take a while that's why we have mills in real life - it ain't easy to reduce even a small piece of firewood to sawdust (especially without electricity). Stumps (as mentioned above) should be a royal pain in the butt to destroy - for that matter same with boulders.

Hopefully when agriculture comes in the ability to plant trees also comes in. Though was reading the other day about garden terrorists (in real life) who go around and stealth plant empty lots in big cities. So if you can cut down trees anywhere should you be able to plant trees anywhere?

[Sirius]

Stumps (as mentioned above) should be a royal pain in the butt to destroy

Hey, looky here. I scavenged myself up a case of beer and a case of dynamite. Fun afternoon INC!