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  1. #1

    Stats, skill skill ups, macros and you

    in one of the posts below, it is stated (correctly i believe, i think i remember the same thing) that hps increase with levels.

    with the current skill grind, this system is just begging to be abused by macroers. why?

    design components that rely on the repetition of an action to improve are (typically) easily macrod, and those that utilize the macro usually increase skills at a rate faster than those that don't.

    The fact that character stats (ie. health) are tied to levels, which are tied to skill ups, is very bad news for those of us who are anti-macro. The only real way to defeat the macro advantage is for (drum roll) macroing not to provide an advantage. In myy mind this would equate to (in this environment) faster skill ups, and a fairly rapid means of skill degradation (if it wasn't used)...of course you'd only get xp for skill levels higher than any previously attained. The 'harder' (ie more tedious) you make the skill advancement process, the more benefit you give to those that would automate the process.

    I don't have much of a dog in this hunt, since i doubt i'm much longer for hte community...at least for a while...so, i'm just sayin'...food for thought.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    www.theburninghorde.com

  2. #2
    Pretty much what you said. One thing they could do is to make actions require more input besides click and wait, such as using abilities and timing actions. This would make harvesting and crafting more interesting and less macro friendly. For combat, they could make it so that skill-ups are only rewarded upon the death of something. It wouldn't prevent players from macroing on their friends in PvP, but at least they'll have to keep respawning. There are also solutions that I'm not thinking of. It basically comes down to do developers try to do something different or do they completely stick to the UO-type macro system. They don't need to reinvent the wheel, but not all wheels are built the same.

  3. #3
    basically if there was some sorta of mini game that could of possibly been made for the crafting part of the system you could prevent macroing.

    how ever that might be seen as cheesy to some players.
    TokTok - Axe Welding Basket Weaver

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by xyberviri View Post
    basically if there was some sorta of mini game that could of possibly been made for the crafting part of the system you could prevent macroing.

    how ever that might be seen as cheesy to some players.
    Not if you reward people correctly.

    Ive already said this idea a few times, but pretty much make it a choice for people. Like this.
    Your first choice should be:
    1)Craft all (This gives least chance of success like maybe 33% this is an insta craft using ALL the resources on you.)
    2)Craft 1 (Highest chance with extra options to come 90% base)
    3)Craft until stop. (This gives 90% base with -1% per craft until bottoms out at 50%)

    Next choice with option #2 is that you get extra options. You can do this each time that will increase your chance to not fail, also give you options to maybe yield 2 or 3 etc. Also might increase the QL or durability.
    This option will pop up random boxes that you have to choose the right option. Something like, "This blade needs to be tempered" Then 3 choices pop up, add water, sand, or leather. You would want to choose water.
    This happens as each one crafts. Sometimes more than once. If you pick the right ones, you get bonus stuff, if you pick the wrong ones you get failure stuff.


    Its that simple. I posted this somewhere else, but I cant be bothered to go find it again.
    There are so many ways to make it work well, I dont even really know what to post about it anymore. Seems like its not even going to be put ever into place like this. Which clearly something needs to be done with the boring crafting.
    MrDDT



    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    -Sun-tzu


  5. #5
    beyond the 'prevention gimmicks'...it's just the system itself...any system that rewards extended periods of repetitive 'grind' is ripe for macro abuse...and that is dangerous for a game like this because it gives the macroer a clear advantage over a non macroer.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    www.theburninghorde.com

  6. #6
    Yup...again I agree with the call for a change....and again, I'd love to see something interactive like VG or EQ2 for crafting....

  7. #7
    I'd like to see a game where character stats aren't king. A game where progression isn't climbing the ladder of power so much, but rather opening more options. I really like Eve's system of opening up new pathways. I also like how Eve's ship/equipment system balances out so that there isn't one best ship, but rather a lot of different ships that fill unique roles. It's sort of the opposite of how Darkfall is all about becoming the best at everything because you are everything at one time.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by mrcalhou View Post
    I'd like to see a game where character stats aren't king. A game where progression isn't climbing the ladder of power so much, but rather opening more options. I really like Eve's system of opening up new pathways. I also like how Eve's ship/equipment system balances out so that there isn't one best ship, but rather a lot of different ships that fill unique roles. It's sort of the opposite of how Darkfall is all about becoming the best at everything because you are everything at one time.
    One a soft cap, or skill cap is in place, you will see this change.
    Darkfall has no skill cap. So everyone can be everything.
    Eve is the same way at the end it just takes longer to see it. I would rather see something like UO where people mix and match based on their playstyle.

    Im expecting a softcap to come into play once more things are balanced out and features are put into the game.
    MrDDT



    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    -Sun-tzu


  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by MrDDT View Post
    One a soft cap, or skill cap is in place, you will see this change.

    Im expecting a softcap to come into play once more things are balanced out and features are put into the game.
    Yeah, by the time this happens...Macroers will already be kings.
    The truth will set you free....but first it will realy piss you off !!

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by MrDDT View Post
    One a soft cap, or skill cap is in place, you will see this change.
    Darkfall has no skill cap. So everyone can be everything.
    Eve is the same way at the end it just takes longer to see it. I would rather see something like UO where people mix and match based on their playstyle.

    Im expecting a softcap to come into play once more things are balanced out and features are put into the game.
    Except in Eve, it doesn't matter if you have all the skills capped because only some many will actually affect you at any given time. If I go out in a battleship loaded with missles, none of my frigate and gunnery skills do anything for me. In darkfall I can go out with every sort of weapon and switch them on the fly. You can't do that in Eve. Not without moving away from fights.

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