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  1. #1

    Feedback Request: Skill, Stats, Quest Patch

    I would like some final feedback on the upcoming patch.

    The Test Server is now available with the latest changes and this patch is almost ready for the public. Actions are set to run the skill gain 50 times so that skill balancing can be better seen in action.

    Here is a list of what is ready:

    Combat
    Per player position thread to reduce combat lag
    Creatures can attack in water (animations not implemented)

    Skills
    Skill tracker working
    Resource skills revised for balanced use of all stats
    Terraforming moved to the resources group
    Wainwright moved to the construction skill group
    Schemes can be gained beyond skill 100
    Unlearn based on current skill level (you can unlearn auto learn recipes if your skill has dropped)
    Schemes can be gained on level up
    Working skill soft cap
    Skill balancing reduction after gains beyond soft cap
    Action skills not soft capped
    Construction not soft capped
    Balanced decay on least used 4 skills
    Skill decay chooses skills set to minus first (as if they had 0 recent uses)
    Skill locking system
    - Normal: skill can increase or decrease
    - Minus: skill locked for decay only. Stats will not gain when using this
    - Locked: Can’t change. Stats will gain when using this skill
    - Plus: Can increase only. Stats will gain when using this skill
    - 2 skills can be locked
    Skill recent use count displayed as a tooltip on skill locks

    Stats
    Agility bonuses affect running
    Agility affects combat speed(including bonuses)
    Base movement increased
    Max movement increased
    Strength including bonuses affects encumbrance
    Encumbrance minimum increased
    Encumbrance maximum increased
    Stat gain on all skillactions regardless of setting
    Minor fixes to the statpanel display
    Balanced decay on least used 4 stats
    Stats above normal displayas green in stat panel

    Health
    Health based on stats andskills
    Health (hit points) shows asa value on hover

    Experience
    Gained per action not skillgain
    Stats can be gained through the level up panel for skills that are increased using experience points as if those skill were actually used

    Quests
    Quest expiration
    Expired quest removes questfrom questor
    Quest time limit (in progress)
    Quest quality
    Craft and hunt quest require you to craft and hunt the delivered goal items
    View and drop quests fromTribe Quest Panel
    Improved quest panels
    Quests show tribe and creator
    Quests give experience based on
    - Type of quest
    - Difficulty of item
    - Amount of item
    - Quality of item
    - Distance between tribes
    Experience for both questorand creator

    Scroll bar
    Fixed scroll bars for all panels
    Town member scroll bar
    Town rank scroll bar

    Interface
    New interface panel art implemented (in progress)
    Walk mode default keybind set to G
    Chat reply default keybind set to R

    Chat
    Pressing R allows automatic reply to last whisper
    Whispers show more clear who you are whispering to receiving a whisper from

    Items
    Hunted items give bonus based on power of creature killed
    Material items display possible bonus in tooltip
    Merging stacks should properly balance bonus power (for hunted items). Quality and duration should also balance as usual
    Splitting and merging stacks should properly balance bonus power, quality and duration.

    I would like specific feedback on:

    - Are there any critical issues or problems?
    - Is stat gain and loss too quick / too slow / ok?
    - Is skill balancing too much / too little / ok?
    - Does skill balancing (soft cap) start too early / too late / ok?

    Any other comments are welcome, but please keep comments brief and not as an argument or discussion. We would like to patch this all to the public server this week and are looking for any critical changes that need to be made before we do so.

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    So far, test server shows as up, but I cannot connect (Get to log-in, type in password, 15-20 second pause, then nothing). Ready to test as soon as I can get in.



    edit: Still unable to get in...same situation. Tried with both accounts.

    edit2: However, the new UI stuff that's on live...is GREAT. (The right-click menu is perfect). IMHO, do the whole UI in that style (including tooltips) and you have a winner!! ESPECIALLY THE CHAT WINDOW!!! Give it that border and dark background with a transparency slider....WIN!!!!!

    edit3: Also, not sure if you know or not, but going to test server seems to reset UI on live...makes it kind of a pain to test. Not the biggest deal, but haven't seen it said anywhere, so figured I'd chime up.

  3. #3
    Still cant log in test.
    MrDDT



    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    -Sun-tzu


  4. #4
    Okay...was able to log in for a bit. Started a brand new character. Leveled toolcraft from 5 to 62. Gained approx 95 recipes through autolearning. Seems about right. However, I lost NO points in any other skills in that group during the grind up. Not sure that's intended. Associated stats seemed to be increasing properly and I was gaining xp per action, not level.

    Also, with the new reply function (it's awesome btw). If the last person to whisper you logs off, when you hit R, you autoreply to yourself.

    Added after 56 minutes:

    Also, not sure if this is a recent issue, but it still exists on test (and live). I've noticed plenty of tribes with spaces in their names, but I can't seem to do that with mine. The spacebar doesn't seem to work at all when trying to choose a tribe name.

  5. #5
    I like the new changes.

    Stats locking seems to be working well.
    Stats gain is hard to see due to 50x but seems fine.
    Issues with using a skill that you dont want to mess up your stats. Is there a way to say "lock" a skill and then you dont get any stat gain thus no decay in other stats while using that skill. (No stat gain/loss while skill locked and no stat gain/loss) this will allow people to do things outside their profession without jacking up stats or skills.
    Animals seem to be very weak still. 4 hitting a normal bear, and it didnt even get me to 90% life (I now have only 190HP).
    Training a skill doesnt decay the - skills first, its still decaying from all unless they are locked or set to +.
    Good work on the crafting notice, now can see the recipes you train.
    Love the scroll bars.
    When getting a recipe, or unlocking/locking/+/- skills it resets the recipe window.
    Some stats even when were just used were decaying before other stats. Maybe its because they were not used much but some stats were never used and didnt decay until 10+ points change in other stats. (Only lost .1 SPI even though I changed over 15 points in stats, SPI was never used in any skill)
    AGI is still wicked over powered. You now move very fast because AGI and attack much faster. At 10AGI you move about 1/3 the speed of someone with 100AGI, plus they would attack about 1/3 the speed. That's way tpp good, just the movement speed alone is hella good. I cant see anyone not getting AGI.

    I cant test the soft caps as Im way over them in all pools. I always lose skills when I gain skills in any pool right now.

    All the animals on test seem to be mid or slightly younger age, so I couldnt test the hunting bonuses much, nor could I see how hard things were. Also I saw no mutants after about 2 hours of running around.

    With the new changes to recipes after 100, found recipes are just about worthless.
    MrDDT



    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    -Sun-tzu


  6. #6
    Xsyon Citizen
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Vienna, Austria
    Posts
    194
    I have 75 HP on the test server - so 10% of 170 would be ~23% for my character (crafter with 60 AGI/FOR/STR)
    As my combat is about 30 skill points I miss alot and have slow swings ... so a bear would kill me in about 12 hits ?

    Not sure if that adds up with the experience of MrDDT - but I think hit/damage/armor of animals should be balanced for chars with grass armor and about 70 points in AGI/FOR/STR and damage of about 8 per full swing.
    At the moment I land about 4 hits for each hit I get (mainly because my movement speed is low).
    So an animal that has about 80 HP will land roughly 3 hits on me. Two animals will land about 6 hits in the first fight and 2 hits in the second (so roughly a total of 8 hits).

    So if MrDDT says its too easy - try it with a low char (no/very cheap grass armor)
    - a bear/deer should win against such a player
    - coyote/raccoon/dogs should be manageable (except for very old/experienced ones)
    - rats, chicks, cats, squirell and all the other small animals should be normal difficulty (so win against 1-2, start loosing at 3 at the same time) - (except for very old/experienced ones)

    I know that MrDDT says that a newly created char can beat any animal in the game - I would disagree or be more specific - a "fighter" char could defeat eg a bear even at start up (if the player does not make any mistakes trough out the 5 minutes fight) - a crafter will run out of energy and be sucking in air while beeing beaten to death ...

    So please try to balance the animals so that crafters stand a chance against the smaller animals - if possible
    "Thou shalt not follow the null pointer, for chaos and madness await thee at its end."

  7. #7
    A few quick notes:

    We're doing a new distribution of creatures on the test server right now, which is why they are all relatively weak (currently they are all set to the minimum adult age and none have experienced combat which makes them grow in power as well). We will "age" some of them when patching to the main server.

    Regarding skills set to minus. It should consider them as a 0 use skill. If there are other skills that have not been used or have barely been used they will decay about the same. (The least 4 used skills in the group decay). We will check this more to make sure it's working as intended. Basically if 3 skills are have not been used recently and one is set to minus, they all currently decay the same.

    I am considering setting more schemes so that they are found through scavenging only (this has been an option for all schemes since the beginning. Currently only a few schemes have this setting). I would like some feedback on this.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by tomduril View Post
    I have 75 HP on the test server - so 10% of 170 would be ~23% for my character (crafter with 60 AGI/FOR/STR)
    As my combat is about 30 skill points I miss alot and have slow swings ... so a bear would kill me in about 12 hits ?

    Not sure if that adds up with the experience of MrDDT - but I think hit/damage/armor of animals should be balanced for chars with grass armor and about 70 points in AGI/FOR/STR and damage of about 8 per full swing.
    At the moment I land about 4 hits for each hit I get (mainly because my movement speed is low).
    So an animal that has about 80 HP will land roughly 3 hits on me. Two animals will land about 6 hits in the first fight and 2 hits in the second (so roughly a total of 8 hits).

    So if MrDDT says its too easy - try it with a low char (no/very cheap grass armor)
    - a bear/deer should win against such a player
    - coyote/raccoon/dogs should be manageable (except for very old/experienced ones)
    - rats, chicks, cats, squirell and all the other small animals should be normal difficulty (so win against 1-2, start loosing at 3 at the same time) - (except for very old/experienced ones)

    I know that MrDDT says that a newly created char can beat any animal in the game - I would disagree or be more specific - a "fighter" char could defeat eg a bear even at start up (if the player does not make any mistakes trough out the 5 minutes fight) - a crafter will run out of energy and be sucking in air while beeing beaten to death ...

    So please try to balance the animals so that crafters stand a chance against the smaller animals - if possible

    What are you talking about the 10% of 170?
    Missing has nothing to do with stats or skill points. That's just you being bad. No offense just saying.

    Bears should be very hard vs most players. Even well skilled and armored players. Baby ones shouldn't be hard but adults should. Mutant bears should be 3 to 5 man groups taking to kill.
    Try fighting a bear with an axe or a club. It wont go well, even for the most skilled fighters.

    85HP, 35armed, 35 axes. Killed it while only taking 15 damage. 13 hits on my part. I had over 75% of my life left.
    Bears should be hard, it shouldnt be easy for a solo person to kill and surely not a noob with 35 combat skills. I recorded the fight if you really want to see it I can play it back.

    About fighting small animals. I agree their needs to be better tiers to animals, but that's mostly another topic. Clearly the balance of stats for players was lowered, and it effected animals. Killing animals in 4 hits on a bear is way to low.

    Xsyon, it looks like thats what happened to the decayed of skills that were decaying with the - skill also. I didnt use them so they were set to 0 uses. I thought the - skill would decay, but you explained why. I will test again with using them slightly and then using other skills.

    I logged in to test a bit more, and you guys are running a test on animals, so I was told not to kill them. Mihr was nice enough to spawn a bear for me to kill on my newb. I will test more on that later.
    MrDDT



    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    -Sun-tzu


  9. #9
    Xsyon Citizen
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Vienna, Austria
    Posts
    194
    Quote Originally Posted by MrDDT View Post
    What are you talking about the 10% of 170?
    Missing has nothing to do with stats or skill points. That's just you being bad. No offense just saying.
    Agreed

    Quote Originally Posted by MrDDT View Post
    Bears should be very hard vs most players. Even well skilled and armored players. Baby ones shouldn't be hard but adults should. Mutant bears should be 3 to 5 man groups taking to kill.
    Try fighting a bear with an axe or a club. It wont go well, even for the most skilled fighters.

    85HP, 35armed, 35 axes. Killed it while only taking 15 damage. 13 hits on my part. I had over 75% of my life left.
    Bears should be hard, it shouldnt be easy for a solo person to kill and surely not a noob with 35 combat skills. I recorded the fight if you really want to see it I can play it back.

    About fighting small animals. I agree their needs to be better tiers to animals, but that's mostly another topic. Clearly the balance of stats for players was lowered, and it effected animals. Killing animals in 4 hits on a bear is way to low.
    Agreed!
    "Thou shalt not follow the null pointer, for chaos and madness await thee at its end."

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Xsyon View Post
    A few quick notes:
    I am considering setting more schemes so that they are found through scavenging only (this has been an option for all schemes since the beginning. Currently only a few schemes have this setting). I would like some feedback on this.
    I say yes purely because this is the way I like to play the game, im always out exploring and this would give me new things to find and trade with other players. It would also add additional "rare" items to the game depending what schemes you had in mind to do this with. Personally i dont want to grind thousands upon thousands of tools for instance to unlock every recipe beyond 100 skill.
    Im sure others will disagree but my vote is YES !!!!!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Luthais
    http://www.xsyonmercs.com
    Ur ye Scottish? A um. Ye ken ur a true Scot if ye can properly pronounce Ecclefechan,Auchtermuchty and Aufurfuksake. Yer used tae 4 seasons in wan day. Ye kin faw aboot pished wioot spilling yer drink. Ye kin make hael sentences jist wi swear wurds. Ye know irn bru is a hang-er cure. Ye actually understawn this message

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