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  1. #1

    Raven Question from Weekly Questions thread.

    Original Post moved here...

    With the patch we have well known players bragging in chat that they are maxed on most all skills except fire building and won't be losing any of their skills since you only lose skills when something else raises. They lock the few skills they have below 100 and they never lose anything. My first question is how did you allow this to happen in the first place and the 2nd question is what do you intend to do to correct it? They get to keep all their skills at 100 while the rest of us have caps? Are the rest of us supposed to continue to pay monthly fees while being unable to hope to ever get to their level? With the system in its current state, they could quit today and the rest of us could continue to play for 10 years and we could never hope to get anywhere near where they currently are. How exactly is that fair to everyone else?

    Creators Reply:

    I think you misinterpreted, misread or misunderstood something Raven. Everyone's skills will decay over time. No one is immune to decay, no one. But it will take a little time. There is still skills they haven't maxed that are upcoming, if they want any of those their points will decay. Plus if they don't have stats for the skill, it is kinda useless.
    Rest of the conversation follows on.
    Please us this Thread to discuss the Original Post.

    Thank you.

  2. #2
    I would have to agree 100% with Raven, How did this go SO wrong? and what do you intend to do to fix this?
    Iam a new player and to be perfectly honest this is a huge turnoff to the game to me. It being a PVP game, and your going to tell me, I can go out in the world and there are players that can hand me my arse each and everytime simply no matter how good I get? Will this be corrected or should I just go buy a jar of vaseline?

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by catnips View Post
    I would have to agree 100% with Raven, How did this go SO wrong? and what do you intend to do to fix this?
    Iam a new player and to be perfectly honest this is a huge turnoff to the game to me. It being a PVP game, and your going to tell me, I can go out in the world and there are players that can hand me my arse each and everytime simply no matter how good I get? Will this be corrected or should I just go buy a jar of vaseline?

    Having 100 in every skill has little to no effect on someone handing you your ass, as you put it.

    You can get the same HP, same stats, and do the same damage as a vet that has 100 in all the skills.

    Having said that, no one has 100 in all the skills. Decay is happening and will happen. As new skills are added, decay will happen even more. I agree getting into a game a year after release you will have some catch up to do, the catch up after this patch is a LOT LOT less than before this patch. Its also a lot faster to do it.

    I'm not sure what you want fixed here but I dont care if I lose all the skills I dont want. They are not doing anything for me. I can still scav at 5 skill. I can still terraform at 5 skill and I can still craft weapons at 5 skill.
    Sure they wont be as good as 100 skill, but they also wont be as good as someone with 100 skill AND the right stats, which I wont have because I cant have max stats in all the stats.

    Stats are really the main choice in being good in a craft, just FYI.
    MrDDT



    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    -Sun-tzu


  4. #4
    Hello everyone,

    To answer the concerns:

    - In the next few weeks there will be skill decay on death.
    - In the next round of development we are adding many skills.

    These two additions will balance down the few players with many high level skills. It is just a matter of time.

    Regarding being overpowered:

    - As mentioned above, you need the right stats for skills to be fully useful. Stat distribution is much more balanced and flexible with this patch.

    Regarding combat:

    - Life (hit points) is now independent of leveling. This makes combat power more dependent on skill and stat selection and brings new players much closer to the level of old players.
    - Combat efficiency is the same for someone with the right stats and skills as someone who theoretically has all skills at 100.
    - The power of low level characters has been brought up with these changes and the difference between a low and high level character has been reduced.

    Reaching the same of combat as a veteran player is now easier than before this patch.

    I hope that alleviates the concerns.

  5. #5
    If a player that has all his current skills to 100 decides to not try any of the new skills you add and manages to not die because he is just good at combat or never leaves tribe land, then he will not suffer any skill decay.
    Which is not fair as the OP was trying to say, since no one else will be able to get that many skills to 100 also.
    Combat aside, perhaps there is some way to correct this?

    Unless I am mistaken and skills will decay on their own regardless if you increase one or not.

    Also, if the skill cap is 300-400 then why would you only allow 2 skills to be plus/lock? Now those who have many skills can't decide properly which ones decrease! They can only ensure they don't lose 2. Which makes no sense. If the cap is 300 then you should have 3 plus/locks. If the cap is 400 then you should have 4 plus/locks. No idea why you wouldn't do it that way.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by tlfirster View Post
    If a player that has all his current skills to 100 decides to not try any of the new skills you add and manages to not die because he is just good at combat or never leaves tribe land, then he will not suffer any skill decay.
    Which is not fair as the OP was trying to say, since no one else will be able to get that many skills to 100 also.
    Combat aside, perhaps there is some way to correct this?

    Unless I am mistaken and skills will decay on their own regardless if you increase one or not.

    Also, if the skill cap is 300-400 then why would you only allow 2 skills to be plus/lock? Now those who have many skills can't decide properly which ones decrease! They can only ensure they don't lose 2. Which makes no sense. If the cap is 300 then you should have 3 plus/locks. If the cap is 400 then you should have 4 plus/locks. No idea why you wouldn't do it that way.

    If you had 3 locks then you could have 4 skills at 100. 2 locks means 3 skills at 100.

    Having 300 or 400, makes it a choice for people with 4+ skills and they dont need to be at 100. I think once you understand the system more you might see why they dont just hardcap you at 200 points.

    I dont see any plans to have decay just to decay. Having said that, everyone dies. I dont see this as a problem but I'm more than happy if they want to insta remove some of my skills I dont use. Skills without stats are next to worthless for me.
    MrDDT



    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    -Sun-tzu


  7. #7
    I think it will work out in the end but for the interm it will be rough. But not as bad as say Mortal Online or Darkfall or even old Roma Victor.

    But I am hoping that the skill cap is affected by an attribute, like INT, this would keep combat built toons from being the go to template.

    Example of above...

    There are 38 total skills (quick count).

    If you were to take and give 10skill points max per point of INT. This means a character with 50 INT would have 500 points plus the 5 per skill and the starting skill points max for his skills. Which means he can max maybe two or three skills at most.

    But a character with a INT of 100 would be able to max 5 or 6 skills.

    Which isnt ALL of them, but is a good number. Or use INT + Spirit, or whatever makes sense. And this is just an example.

  8. #8
    Hi all,

    I recently joined the Xsyon community after some RL friends I have known for a fair few years encouraged me to to look at it. How recently? 14 hours before the patch everyone is talking about.

    While I enjoy the freedom and the concepts behind the game itself there are now concerns brought about by these recent changes. My biggest fear of all is the skill cap.

    Before anyone thinks I might just want 100 points in every single skill, I assure you that is not the case. My concerns come down to daily/weekly game play. By introducing a cap such as the current one, it limits the opportunities for doing different things. For example I have taken woodcraft and weaponsmithing, but with the current patch my chances to decide in 6 months i am bored of chopping wood, making weapons all day, every day I would then have to retrain a new area, all over again, but this brings issues of its own.

    In a MMO environment there will always be another player that has max skills in certain skills, lets say Tailoring. As a result anything I could produce would be of little use as a new tailor compared to a tribe tailor with the best skills and able to produce the best quality goods.

    Essentially the recent patch commits players to choose an are and stick with it throughout their Xsyon life, this in itself is discouragement to continue to pay monthly subs. Yes I am aware you can do most things with 5 points skill, but what use would I be scavenging with 5 skill if 4 other people have 100 skills and can obtain the best items.

    Having had a day to consider my options I am currently glad i chose not to pay for a subscription, giving me one month to see if this can be improved somehow (bigger cap, 2-3 characters per account, or anything). As it stands I cannot see a reason to continue playing beyond my 30 days.

    In all my years gaming and beta-testing I have seen caps like this introduced, few ever work, personally I think this needs a serious review.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Alzir View Post
    Hi all,

    I recently joined the Xsyon community after some RL friends I have known for a fair few years encouraged me to to look at it. How recently? 14 hours before the patch everyone is talking about.

    While I enjoy the freedom and the concepts behind the game itself there are now concerns brought about by these recent changes. My biggest fear of all is the skill cap.

    Before anyone thinks I might just want 100 points in every single skill, I assure you that is not the case. My concerns come down to daily/weekly game play. By introducing a cap such as the current one, it limits the opportunities for doing different things. For example I have taken woodcraft and weaponsmithing, but with the current patch my chances to decide in 6 months i am bored of chopping wood, making weapons all day, every day I would then have to retrain a new area, all over again, but this brings issues of its own.

    In a MMO environment there will always be another player that has max skills in certain skills, lets say Tailoring. As a result anything I could produce would be of little use as a new tailor compared to a tribe tailor with the best skills and able to produce the best quality goods.

    Essentially the recent patch commits players to choose an are and stick with it throughout their Xsyon life, this in itself is discouragement to continue to pay monthly subs. Yes I am aware you can do most things with 5 points skill, but what use would I be scavenging with 5 skill if 4 other people have 100 skills and can obtain the best items.

    Having had a day to consider my options I am currently glad i chose not to pay for a subscription, giving me one month to see if this can be improved somehow (bigger cap, 2-3 characters per account, or anything). As it stands I cannot see a reason to continue playing beyond my 30 days.

    In all my years gaming and beta-testing I have seen caps like this introduced, few ever work, personally I think this needs a serious review.

    Can you name a few games that didnt work with caps?
    Can you name a few games that work with no caps?

    Also the playstyle like your playing is still the same as before. If it takes you a year to level up 1 skill and you change your mind, then level up another skill. You will have 3+ skill at 100 before you would even have to worry about a cap. Which is 3 years of game play for you.

    Which even still you could still do those actions they would just be at lower skills.

    You talk about scav about how a 5 skill would be vs 100 skill. Yes it would be better to have 100. However, 5 skill still could do a lot of things in scav that would be useful. Like recipes have no reason to have high scav finding one is just as good at level 5 skill scav as 100. Recipes are also likely the most sold item out of scavenge so your example is a bad one off the get go.

    The recent patch does nothing but change perception of what is good and what not. Before this patch you could do everything. After this patch you can do everything. Nothing has changed other than perception and of a greater effect.

    Before patch if you had 100 in every skill you would still only be good in 2 or 3 per pool due to stats. After patch if you have 100 in every skill (even if you could) you would still only be good in 2 or 3 due to stats. Now you are just worse in more skills because you cant have 100 in all skills.



    Let me sum it up for you. Your example:

    Woodcrafting and Weaponcrafting took you 6 months, and you change your mind.
    Current system (after patch) you would not be effected in changing your skills.
    Old system (before patch) you were not effected in changing your skills.

    You would still have to take another 6 months to train up the new skills, and you would keep both skills in both systems.
    MrDDT



    "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."
    -Sun-tzu


  10. #10

    A bit conserned

    Hi everybody, I just joined the game and am trying to get my head around it.

    Is there a thread somewhere explaining this skill balance stuff in great detail?

    Is there a soft cap -will the least used skills last week decrease even if I don't train any skills above the soft cap? If yes, by how much? Can I never increase my total skill points? If one goes up, another goes down the same ammount?

    What is the soft cap? 90?

    I assume the intention is to prevent people from mastering all skills at the same time, but I must say that is a turn off... I've only played 50 hours ingame, but I've yet to meet an other player. That makes it a bit hard to cooperate. I was looking forward to slowly mastering all the skills, but now it looks like the game will not allow me to. Shame I didn't play it last year instead No, seriously, I hope I can at least get decent in every skill -can someone please confirm if there is a cut-off before I start getting memory-lapses in skills I learnt last week?

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