Coordinates

[Paradox]

Will we have the same zone and XYZ info available once the game is released?

I have heard rumors that it would go away but nothing definite. I find it very useful and hope it stays.

[Virtus]

good reason not to leave it, it may as well be a map

[Kitsume]

It would be nice if the coordinates were replaced with the area name where you are currently located. Sometimes those messages disappear all too fast.

[Ignominus]

odd to be worried about a map.. you can download any map of tahoe and it works fine (I did a lap around the lake and the map I found matched up quite nicely with all the named areas). I think if there isn't going to be any coordinates or zone names popping up, then we need more distinct landmarks. no matter how nice you make the trees and landscape they still won't be unique in the way real trees and terrain are.

[Virtus]

I hope it would be accurate else we have to worry about the G-man modifying our satellite info :blink: :P

As for a map, actually it's more like a GPS system. Leaving the co-ords in permanently would mean that if you find a stash of something then you can just write down the number and return to it whenever you like.

GPS during an apocalypse seems a bit ironic.

Might I also not that Wurm nor Roma Victor had any way of telling exact location.

Once tribes start appearing, buildings built, and you learn the terrain more it will make it easier to navigate around.

For example, when running around Round Hill is a very obvious land mark. I know when i am on the South West side of the lake because there is a smaller lake just off of Tahoe.

[Deacon]

Virtus wrote:

good reason not to leave it, it may as well be a map

Don't go off the deep end with "reality", and make it impossible to play. You want to work on realityu, stop bears from climbing straight up cliff walls.

[REVKhA]

coords will be gone soon , hopefully after the skybox displays sunrises/sunsets properly ;D

[Wizlock23]

gotta be honest a map or cords wouldnt hurt IMO , im really not digging the whole dont know were ur going ..gonna make trades and such VERY hard when u have to "describe " were u are ..lol ..

"im near the lake with the trees near it " :P

[REVKhA]

sun rises in the east, it sets in the west.

We dont know much about navigation yet, but it should not be some generic hand holding casual map for everyone by just pressing M.... no hand holding please this is a true open sandbox.

You are not supposed to know where you are going or where you are, you are supposed to explore and find other tribes yourself. That is why you can make roads and some logistic elements already.

I have no clue how we will navigate, but it will not be with coords.

[aliksteel]

I'm staying lost as hell 99% of the time, The only time I'm not is when I say the hell with it and I'm going to do my thing where ever the hell I am.

This is not WOW,EQ2,LOTRO,SWG,WAR or what ever MMO you played last. Not having a map is part of the game. Immersion factor is one point to no map, But say Jooky caved in on this, And gave us a map. What next? Showing stats on all armor, weapons? Little numbers scrolling up the screen as we fight to tell up what our dps is? When do you stop, When it becomes WOW? How about the big red button that makes you max out on all skill's?

Like I said at the top of this comment, I stay lost, But that also helps in making what land we have feel very large? But think back to the last game you played, How often did yoou run around not even looking around and seeing the world? Most likely you ran around with the map up and missed most of the world.


Come on gang, Let's have fun getting lost together. :)

[Vidar]

Greetings.

I cant find my way out of a mall, but stills agree with You.

One could use a RL Lake Tahoo map and make a grid system on it for tribal use as maps are available all over internet.

Anyone watch tv-serie Lost? They were really lost. We, just have to send out our best tribe scouts :)

regards

aliksteel wrote:

I'm staying lost as hell 99% of the time, The only time I'm not is when I say the hell with it and I'm going to do my thing where ever the hell I am.

This is not WOW,EQ2,LOTRO,SWG,WAR or what ever MMO you played last. Not having a map is part of the game. Immersion factor is one point to no map, But say Jooky caved in on this, And gave us a map. What next? Showing stats on all armor, weapons? Little numbers scrolling up the screen as we fight to tell up what our dps is? When do you stop, When it becomes WOW? How about the big red button that makes you max out on all skill's?

Like I said at the top of this comment, I stay lost, But that also helps in making what land we have feel very large? But think back to the last game you played, How often did yoou run around not even looking around and seeing the world? Most likely you ran around with the map up and missed most of the world.


Come on gang, Let's have fun getting lost together. :) :)

[Paradox]

Virtus wrote:

good reason not to leave it, it may as well be a map


But in the real world we have things like rope and levels to measure things in addition to maps. Even building the pyramids they had tools for working out angles, height, and distance. Coordinates simply represent the abilities and sense we would normally have.

[Virtus]

Paradox wrote:

Virtus wrote:

good reason not to leave it, it may as well be a map


But in the real world we have things like rope and levels to measure things in addition to maps. Even building the pyramids they had tools for working out angles, height, and distance. Coordinates simply represent the abilities and sense we would normally have.

yes, but that and being given the exact GPS co-ords are two completely different things

[Paradox]

I agree. Think there should be a happy median. We wouldn’t need XYZ if we had other more fitting ways of determining this. Thing is, going completely dumb and blind is just as bad as having a GPS in your head. That’s just going from one extreme to the other.


Not too worried about navigating the world. I have the sun, stars, and a map.

What I would like is a way to construct cities accurately.





Virtus wrote:



yes, but that and being given the exact GPS co-ords are two completely different things

[Virtus]

agreed, to a point.

As I said in my earlier post in Roma Victor and Wurm people, after a bit of time, were able to find their way around with no map.

RV was a bit easier cuz each board was square and named something different.

Maybe a map of regions....regions are not square and they have nothing to do with what board you are on. Someone could make a map started from the lake and working in and guesstimating where a zone begins/ends. It would not be perfect, which i wouldn't expect it to be, but it would help somewhat.

[CrazyJ]

I think my tribe mates might be concerned with terraforming and building. The coordinates give exact postions allowing for precise layouts. Prehaps a system where two toons use some string, or something to determine distance. Maybe a pop up window which tells the distance apart, or a predetermined length which would stop a toon from moving when the desired distance was reached.

Oh and another thing, how about a compass! Even if it's just a couple leaves, some water and a magnatized needle.

[Ignominus]

I agree that a precise coordinate system is a bit much. I would just like to see some of the landmarks be more prominent. Some of the peaks perhaps a bit more pronounced or some areas with a predominance of a particular sort of tree or grass, rock formations, even dirt color or type of animals. Between these sorts of things and the stars I think we would have enough to go on.

[Virtus]

CrazyJ wrote:

I think my tribe mates might be concerned with terraforming and building. The coordinates give exact postions allowing for precise layouts. Prehaps a system where two toons use some string, or something to determine distance. Maybe a pop up window which tells the distance apart, or a predetermined length which would stop a toon from moving when the desired distance was reached.

Oh and another thing, how about a compass! Even if it's just a couple leaves, some water and a magnatized needle.

I think compass and in game player made map is part of the plans somewhere down the road.

Don't forget, to measure distance you can use the width of your body. The average person is about 2 feet wide shoulder to shoulder. Ok, so it's not a great way for huge jobs, but it is a way for now at least.

[Paradox]

CrazyJ wrote:

I think my tribe mates might be concerned with terraforming and building. The coordinates give exact postions allowing for precise layouts. Prehaps a system where two toons use some string, or something to determine distance. Maybe a pop up window which tells the distance apart, or a predetermined length which would stop a toon from moving when the desired distance was reached.

Oh and another thing, how about a compass! Even if it's just a couple leaves, some water and a magnatized needle.


Exactly,

How about a tube with some water for leveling? Stuff like that would be great and very fitting for the level of technology we should have.





Virtus wrote:


Don't forget, to measure distance you can use the width of your body. The average person is about 2 feet wide shoulder to shoulder. Ok, so it's not a great way for huge jobs, but it is a way for now at least.

Looking down a gun sight at a person I can judge 300m very closely this way ;)

[naktos]

I like to see a personal map.where you can put you own points into a outline of the area your in.Maybe its a good dump there or a tribe.Find it mark it.

[Ignominus]

I think we have two related but separate issues here. While coordinates can be used for terraforming/construction I think the idea of a skill (I put up a thread about a surveyor skill in the tweaks area) could take care of this locally without giving everyone a built in gps.

[Vidar]

That would be a great tool ingame.
You need to find the magnetic needle on a junkyard, pick a leave and expect a certain delay to read "compass, illustrated by a leave with the needle floating in a box of water. And there you get the direction of north?




And what about ant hills for navigation?
Our scouts must have some challenges.




CrazyJ wrote:



Oh and another thing, how about a compass! Even if it's just a couple leaves, some water and a magnatized needle.

[Vidar]

Ignominus wrote:

I think we have two related but separate issues here. While coordinates can be used for terraforming/construction I think the idea of a skill (I put up a thread about a surveyor skill in the tweaks area) could take care of this locally without giving everyone a built in gps.

Youre right about that. Perhaps a mod could split them into their diffrent themes?

Could a toolmaker make those measuring objects?

i.e. a piece of wood thats 1 meter.

When you carrying this and pushing a button you would see a 2 or 3d grid ?

[aliksteel]

The grid worked great in Wurm, But not sure that it will work with the way we terraform here in Xsyon.

[Aiken]

Maybe a surveyor skill in terraforming where you can only use it inside your tribe zone to get some exact (more exact the higher your surveyor skill) coords to use in building, but once you step outside your zone, you have no coords(you won't be building there). It wouldn't even have to be world coords, each tribe zone could have it's own set specific to the zone with (0,0) being the exact center of the zone. This would take care of the mathematics needed for building. Then you would need Cartography skill to make a player made map of the world, the better the skill, the better the map, but you would need papyrus and charcoal to draw the map, then if traded or sold to another player, they would then be able to look at it also.

[Deacon]

I'm not too concerned about getting lost. My concern was leveling the terraforming. I cant see Xsyon putting in an all new system to terraform with. Leveling is tedious as it is with altitude ...cant imagine how insanely impossible it will be without it.

Dont make the game impossible to enjoy.

[aliksteel]

I think Aiken had it right when he was talking just tribe land

Aiken wrote:

Maybe a surveyor skill in terraforming where you can only use it inside your tribe zone to get some exact (more exact the higher your surveyor skill) coords to use in building, but once you step outside your zone, you have no coords(you won't be building there). It wouldn't even have to be world coords, each tribe zone could have it's own set specific to the zone with (0,0) being the exact center of the zone. This would take care of the mathematics needed for building. Then you would need Cartography skill to make a player made map of the world, the better the skill, the better the map, but you would need papyrus and charcoal to draw the map, then if traded or sold to another player, they would then be able to look at it also.

Not sure just how much work it would take, Or if it would mean another terraforming revamp. But I do like the idea of it.

[joexxxz]

Here is Easy solution. Really easy solution. Lets use cordinates in a tribal zone only. It will make Shinra happy, and the rest of you folks also.

[REVKhA]

LOL @ carebears wanting hand holding features in retail like coords.

[Snake]

aliksteel wrote:

Come on gang, Let's have fun getting lost together. :)

I absolutely agree Alik.
If - on some day - the coords are patched away there will be another increasement of joy in my eyes. If you need measurement systems - well then build them. You can position logs, you can count steps if only walking, exactly the rough tools that have to be used make the charm of this game. I do not really need anything additional. Just that the areas are different, the trees are not everywhere the same, the waterfalls look distinct. Of course this is only my view, like always in game (and life ^^).
Cheers.