Modern Weapons - Really?

[Pino]

Really?
Will there be give modern weapons in the world??

Sorry, but this is not right for Xsyon!
These weapons would "make happy" only the PvP.
But not the ATMOSPHERE of Xsyon...


Terraforming, Craftsystem and co. is better for bow/crossbow or melee...


Please say it will not come :(

[Xx1327]

well doesn't that bring a tear to ones eye

[Jadzia]

Pino wrote:

Really?
Will there be give modern weapons in the world??

Sorry, but this is not right for Xsyon!
These weapons would "make happy" only the PvP.
But not the ATMOSPHERE of Xsyon...


Terraforming, Craftsystem and co. is better for bow/crossbow or melee...


Please say it will not come :(
From the homepage of this site:

The lords of nature have revived the wastelands, eradicating and subverting the remnants of modern technology. Creatures of mutation and mythology now populate the land. The ways of swords and sorcery have replaced the path of science and progress.
So no, no modern weapons...at least not for a while, we will see if we can discover modern technology in the future.

[Paradox]

I don’t think we will see any modern stuff soon. Were still picking berries and killing critters with sticks. But some point, yeah.


From the concept art


http://www.xsyon.com/components/com_joomgallery/img_originals/concept_art_3/mmorpg_xsyon_concept_025_20100216_1917120001.jpg

[Virtus]

I think you will start to find guns a bit after prelude has ended, maybe.

They will be very rare to find so don't expect everyone to have one and if your worried about getting shot while you use a spear don't forget ammo will be very limited.

[Pino]

Thanks Virtus :)

[Cradlejoe]

You say it would be better to have Crossbows and Bows but won't they work in the same way as guns? They're ranged weapons that need to be reloaded and need ammo... So I really don't see your problem

[mrcalhou]

So, wait. We're going to be able to do magic? I didn't really read up on the lore. I just assumed it was going to be post-apocalypse with a Native American theme.

Edit: OMG I think I'd be in heaven if I could cast lightning spells and summon localized electrical storms. My enemies will fear me and my friends will stay away from me [in combat]!

[REVKhA]

I can endure this tribal era if it has a good variety of weapons from pistols to rifles to bow's and arrows, poison, blowguns and melee. But after a year if the game does not progress to a modern, post modern, and sci-fi era than i'll just quit.

I came here because of progression, i will not stay if we keep killing each other with axes and knives after a whole year, besides, the concept art shows magic staffs and rifles and pistols.

*Terraforming, Craftsystem and co. is better for bow/crossbow or melee...*

That's a pretty retarded statement imho.

[REVKhA]

This game needs hackers, fixers, reppers, maintenance, pokers, scouts.

Mini games and lowtech/hightech stuff .

Seriously if this game turns out in a `dance around fires' kind of faggotry i'll be leaving quick. This is a fucking open world pvp game, a true open sandbox.

Stop trying to turn it into hello kitty online with wow lore.

[Wizlock23]

lol @ hello kitty

[mrcalhou]

Rev empties assault rifle clip at Mrcalhou.
Mrcalhou throws up electromagnetic field and wildly deflects bullets.
Mrcalhou launches Arc Lightning at Rev.
Rev twitches on ground paralyzed.
Pino shoots mrcalhou with wooden bolt.
Mrcalhou dies.

[REVKhA]

Sounds good to my ears... variety please. It's not because we got plasma gatling that a poisoned blowgun dart will be completely ineffective.

[mrcalhou]

Plasma gatling? I think that's going to be my nickname if we do get magic...

[mrcalhou]

I think it'd be so cool if we could have engineering skills and be able to craft auto turrets.

Could have some sort of craftable "logic chip" so they don't attack tribe mates and/or allied tribes or something.

[REVKhA]

yes we do need implants and hightech gear , they will need to upgrade the UI and add brain/chest implants and such.

[REVKhA]

I think the devs are scared to trow some stat items in there so i suspect they will have a function instead (skill)

[mrcalhou]

What I was suggesting was more along the lines of a craftable component that could be used when crafting a turret to change it's behavior (or must always be used if that's how crafting works).

But yes, I'd like to see stat items, or items that when crafted have additonal and/or special properties. Like the shishkabob from Fallout 3 adds fire damage.

[Cunk]

REVKhA wrote:

I can endure this tribal era if it has a good variety of weapons from pistols to rifles to bow's and arrows, poison, blowguns and melee. But after a year if the game does not progress to a modern, post modern, and sci-fi era than i'll just quit.
You're nuts if you expect this game to transform that much within a year. Unless the pace of development ramps up dramatically.

[Jadzia]

REVKhA wrote:

I can endure this tribal era if it has a good variety of weapons from pistols to rifles to bow's and arrows, poison, blowguns and melee. But after a year if the game does not progress to a modern, post modern, and sci-fi era than i'll just quit.

Rev, you could have saved some money and a lot of frustration for yourself if you have read the game homepage and features before buying it. I wonder what gave you the idea that Xsyon is going to evolve into a sci-fi game.

This is from the Features page, evolution section:

Agriculture.
Evolved cooking. Character created recipes.
Animal breeding and pets.
Trade with tribes beyond the impenetrable mist.
Armor decoration system which can indicate achievements and status.
New weapons, armor and tools.
Religion.
This doesn't sound as a high tech sci-fi theme for me.
It's like going to EVE and demanding to have fairies asap.

[REVKhA]

I'd like to remind you that i'm here since more than half a year and we have not launched yet, i remember the may 15th date. Once they are settled i bet the pace will go up dramatically, they have had obvious problems with programmers and the code they did.

New weapons armors and tools... yep that's what i mean. Who said i wanted plasma guns in a year or i will leave... it's called progression, tribal/modern/postmodern/lowtech/hightech/sci-fi/wtfbbq is a lot of tiers to me.

I will always be against religion , that feature needs to be very well though or else it might be the end of Xsyon, just like wurm online died when they implemented that shitty ass feature. Religion has no place in games, its a fucked up retarded feature and i would prefer having something else than that.

It will probably take a week before we get the grand master crafters from all the botting they did 24/7 so the achievement whores are gonna whine about that much sooner than you think.

Point is there is a satellite dish at the bottom of the tribe totem, so you and your fairy tribe are the only things close to fairies in this game.

[REVKhA]

Cunk wrote:

REVKhA wrote:

I can endure this tribal era if it has a good variety of weapons from pistols to rifles to bow's and arrows, poison, blowguns and melee. But after a year if the game does not progress to a modern, post modern, and sci-fi era than i'll just quit.
You're nuts if you expect this game to transform that much within a year. Unless the pace of development ramps up dramatically.

The game ain't even launched yet, so 12 months after launch then we'll see

[dezgard]

i think you'll be surprised how much will get done after release

[REVKhA]

dezgard wrote:

i think you'll be surprised how much will get done after release

I agree, once this game launches i bet they will implement things much faster and the people will whine even more than me.

Religion is just about the only thing i do not want to see in this game, there is already enough of it in the real world and in these forums. Politics we can create our own, religion is too hard coded usually and might destroy this game like it did destroy Wurm.

We need to provide feedback so they can launch asap , Notorious games needs money and if this game dies then i lose hope in pc gaming, fallout new vegas is all nice but it's a console port and single player. We are in 2010 and soon 2011 and i want to play a real mmorpg true open sandbox and this is as close as it gets.

Who the fuck would want to leave such a grand project like this, it has rpg/rts/fps elements and one of the most hard core pc game to ever be created. I'm just hoping it stays that way and does not drift into a realm of softness and carebear ideals.

They have been doing great except the game has no blood/gore yet and that annoys me, i want to see blood when i hit someone and when i skin animals it needs to pour out.

I can't see myself leaving this game except if they implement some religion biased hard coded crap or if this game stays in the tribal era after 12-18 months. Nobody wants to collect bones when there are satellite dishes in the loading screen.

[dezgard]

Nicely said its nice to have a game evolve and to be part of it

[Cunk]

REVKhA wrote:

I will always be against religion , that feature needs to be very well though or else it might be the end of Xsyon, just like wurm online died when they implemented that shitty ass feature. Religion has no place in games, its a fucked up retarded feature and i would prefer having something else than that.
Religion is usually just a way to wrap a magic system in a different form. I don't see what's inherently wrong with "religion" in a game.

Wurm's system was broken for years because there were only a couple of useful spells and priests were too restricted in what they could do. So priests only existed as alts. But in the last year or so he's addressed that and added a large number of spells (some of them fairly useful) to each priest type, reduced the restrictions to a reasonable level, and added another path (meditation) to magic-like abilities. Frankly I think Rolf deserves credit for at least trying to do something unique and different from how most games do it. And I hope Xsyon is just as willing to experiment.

[Jadzia]

REVKhA wrote:

I'd like to remind you that i'm here since more than half a year and we have not launched yet, i remember the may 15th date. Once they are settled i bet the pace will go up dramatically, they have had obvious problems with programmers and the code they did.


I didn't say its not possible to develop a game in a year, I was asking that what made you think the direction of the development would be hightech/sci-fi. Nothing shows that for me.

Don't get me wrong, I love sci-fi, I'd prefer a sci-fi setting than a post apocalyps/primitive culture/religion-magic setting in the game, I just don't see it coming.

[Shrimps]

I see this game going more the way of Mad Max than of scifi laser gatling auto turrets. But we'll see what they wanna do with it.

By the way Revkha didn't you wanna get banned? Either way you cry too much.

[Yum]

Shrimps wrote:

I see this game going more the way of Mad Max than of scifi laser gatling auto turrets. But we'll see what they wanna do with it.


This!

[dezgard]

I see this game going more the way of Mad Max than of scifi laser gatling auto turrets. But we'll see what they wanna do with it.


This!


with cherrys ontop

[Venciera]

I feel Xsyon's combat could benefit a lot from ranged combat with bows and guns. If you make it difficult to use bows, and give guns slow reload times along with expensive/rare ammo things should balance out. Either way melee combat should be more powerful than ranged.

I envision fighters shooting from a short range, then engaging in hand to hand combat. That would be lots of fun.

[Shrimps]

With guns being rare it'll add a bit of hesitation before each fight.

Does he have a gun? If he does, does he even have ammo for it? Is he willing to waste his ammo to protect what he has with him?
If he is willing to use his precious ammo to defend his belongings how valuable are they?

However profficiencies should play a large role in the accuracy and damage of bows or thrown spears etc.

[mrcalhou]

Shrimps wrote:


However profficiencies should play a large role in the accuracy and damage of bows or thrown spears etc.

With the manual aim system I don't think that accuracy should be determined by to-hit rolls.

[Shrimps]

While I would usually agree with you, I would say that in order to make specialization viable you need to have some degree of drift or inaccuracy to the arrow unless you practice with it and get the skill up.

Someone who has never used a bow should not be able to pick it up and use it to the same range and accuracy as someone with some skill with it. Otherwise there is no reason at all to skill with it and specialization becomes pointless. It wouldn't have to be a huge margin of inaccuracy but just enough that it is noticable and effects combat. Having skill just affect damage wouldn't make much sense and unless the damage difference is going to be substantial such as 10-60 I don't really see the point.

I think both range and accuracy should increase with skill just as it would in life. They would both also be dependant on the bow of course.

[mrcalhou]

Shrimps,

I agree that skill should play a part in how you handle your weapon. I also think that damage should be dependent on skill also. When it comes to accuracy though, instead of a to-hit roll it could be your weapon sways some as you try to aim it. And as you gain skill you are able to aim more and more steadily. That's the way I'd do it so it gives the players the feeling of being in control. Games with to-hit rolls have their place, but I don't like it in a manual aim game.

[Shrimps]

I'm not sure where you get to hit roll from, I certainly never mentioned it.

I'm talking about your bow being unsteady while pulled back and moving at lower skill, Your arrows having a degree of sway and moving off target a bit after firing at lower skill.

I could see damage being affected greatly by skill for spears or thrown weapons but much less on bows.

[Hodo]

REVKhA wrote:

This game needs hackers, fixers, reppers, maintenance, pokers, scouts.

Mini games and lowtech/hightech stuff .

Seriously if this game turns out in a `dance around fires' kind of faggotry i'll be leaving quick. This is a fucking open world pvp game, a true open sandbox.

Stop trying to turn it into hello kitty online with wow lore.

I think everyone wants PvP. But we dont want a even worse version of Fallen Earth or Fall Out.

I dont understand how the location will work out for us. I mean if I were to get that weapon in the concept art drawing, which looked like a cheap knock off of the L85A2 (SA80) assault rifle with a extended barrel, or maybe the LSW version. Eitherway, I cant imagine ammo being too hard to come across if it becomes craftable. Much like they said in Fallen Earth, "guns will be powerful, but ammo will be rare."... 1 month after release, you couldnt go 10ft without finding someone selling ammo for any gun.

[Rudder]

Nicely done artwork. However, it's not showing that the rifle is actually a club since she has no ammunition for it.

If you find whole weapons there is a very good chance it's broken or empty and was dropped on purpose. Even if you find one you won't have the skill to use it without shooting yourself.

Then we come to the question of ammunition - Has anyone seen any bats flying around? Can't make gunpowder without Salt Peter. No scales to measure power to put in the cartridges. The list can go on forever.

[aliksteel]

I loved the way Fallen Earth did the skill, When you went to aim, You could see the sway and moving off target, It was done great in that game. The more skill points the more steady your hand became.

[Otter]

I kind of wanted the guns to be done in the style of either slow loading hunting rifles or "western" rifles. As another posted, it would be great to give bows a hard to use quality but make them way quicker reloading, while a rifle should have more power but be much slower. I also don't really want to see ammo as craftable. I know it is possible and people do it but then the game would turn to FE, where everyone has a gun. I personally would much prefer if I have a gun to have it be precious to me and only bring it out when I need to. No matter what, I never want to see machine guns, that would simply be overkill. Adding single shot rifles/pistols would still give melee a chance to charge, I just cant imagine attacking a village where every member has an AK47 and we are mostly melee based.

Fallen Earth did some gun combat correctly but made the mistake of making ammo far too easy to acquire. I produced ammo by the truckload, which is possible I suppose but really ruined the experience for me. This is a survival post apoc, not mad max.

[aliksteel]

Yea, I get you otter, I would hate to see that in PVE as well. Would suck to see 10 people all shot one time and kill a big ass bear. I'm hoping for some epic fights like back in the day of EQ when most fights you had no idea who may come out on top. That's one of the reasons I look for games like Xsyon, And your right if they was to make it where it was nothing to use and get ammo by the butt load. It will kill the game and we would just be playing wow with guns.

But all that aside, Didn't Jooky say there would NOT be any guns?

[Dontaze_Mebro]

I'm going to make death-rays from old satellite dishes and pieces of mirror for settlement defense.

[Zarma]

It's modern time, so modern weapons make sense.

But what I'd REALLY like is pneumatic weapons that fire quarters and such >.>

Afaik bows are already planned.

[overhated696]

As above, its modern time, for me, makes more sense then magical powers... Anyways, i dont want a HK or any kind of sniper rifle, but what about some handmade mechanical weapons, or some handmade bombs, that could be fun and dangerous too xD.

[chaotix999]

Im game for even a sling to get rid of the thousands of coins I have gotten, at least until they maybe become a currency to my own tribe or a friendly neighbors... Though even then the sling or other propulsive weapon firing coins could be fun

[aliksteel]

From the home page http://www.xsyon.com/

Modern technology has consumed itself. War has ravaged the planet, opening a rift to another reality. The survivors of the grisly destruction rise from the ashes of ruin to encounter a world that has changed. A world that once existed only in the realm of mythology, legend and imagination has become concrete and very real. You have forgotten the past and are welcomed by a new primitive future.

[Zekeen]

That's why it's post apocolyptic, it's all gone, but the fun is rediscovering it. It makes a bad judgement to have it all medieval with salvage swat team armors. You need to have something to brings the feeling of jury rigged technology or else it just turns into another non sci fi, magic based game. People complain about guns ruining a game, but never complain that summoning lightning or fireballs or other spells with. Lots want harsh melee and bows, lots want magic, and lots of us want some tech to feel like it IS in fact a forgotten future of humanities next step.

Pneumatic weapons are probably the best way to go, gunpowder is taboo to magic fans and hippies, and it's still guns so us techies will be happy, everyone is happy, nice raw old tech without fire and kaboom.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

It's 2012... How much technology has been lost in one year? Maybe the devs could rethink the lore a bit and set it a bit farther ahead in the future. Did they start planning this game back in the 80's or something?
I think it's funny people are saying no to guns and yes to lightning magic. Pneumatic weapons are a good idea, and It pains me that there is going to be a poisoning skill and no blowguns. I don't think that guns would ruin the lore of this game in any way. As long as they keep ammo a scavenged material and rare I see no problem. Now if every person is running around with an AK-47 it would get a bit redundant. Guns in my opinion will be a welcomed part of the game as long as melee and simpler types of ranged combat remain effective as well.

[Jadzia]

It's 2012... How much technology has been lost in one year? Maybe the devs could rethink the lore a bit and set it a bit farther ahead in the future. Did they start planning this game back in the 80's or something?
I think it's funny people are saying no to guns and yes to lightning magic. Pneumatic weapons are a good idea, and It pains me that there is going to be a poisoning skill and no blowguns. I don't think that guns would ruin the lore of this game in any way. As long as they keep ammo a scavenged material and rare I see no problem. Now if every person is running around with an AK-47 it would get a bit redundant. Guns in my opinion will be a welcomed part of the game as long as melee and simpler types of ranged combat remain effective as well.
You misunderstood it, its not 2012, that is the date when the war destroyed the world, but we don't know how much time has been spent since then.
" Your youth was spent lost in times of war."

[pluzoid]

Maybe it hasnt accurred to you, but maybe the art of making fire weapons was lost in the Apocalypse. I mean how many people actually have knowledge to make guns from scratch without importing parts.
Just because one civilisation created modern weaponary doesnt mean the second will.

Also from bows and arrows to modern weapons happened over centuries. Thats erm, past your chars lifetime :P Since this game plays out over real time.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

Maybe it hasnt accurred to you, but maybe the art of making fire weapons was lost in the Apocalypse. I mean how many people actually have knowledge to make guns from scratch without importing parts.
Just because one civilisation created modern weaponary doesnt mean the second will.

Also from bows and arrows to modern weapons happened over centuries. Thats erm, past your chars lifetime :P Since this game plays out over real time.

In Pakistan they make fully functional replicas of modern day firearms by hand. http://www.vbs.tv/watch/the-vice-guide-to-travel/the-gun-markets-of-pakistan

[mgilbrtsn]

I sort of picture it like Thundar the Barbarian. Mainly swords and sorcery. But a very rare modern technology drop. Once the game expands, you can find a lost city or museum or some such that you can explore and find those mutants and such.