Turning Evil

[Millstone]

Hello,

I have read about turning evil in a few threads. From what I gather, this means others can kill you w/o penalty and when you die you respawn back at your tribe area, instead of where your ghost is. That is all well and good.

My question is fourfold...

One, if someone attacks me outside of a tribe zones, and I defend myself and kill him, do I become evil?

Two, once I am evil, how do I know I am evil, is there some flag on your character somewhere?

Three, once evil, can I become good again? What if it was a mistake or a defending myself kill?

Four, how do I know if you are evil? Will there be something like in UO where the player is red vs blue vs gray?

[yoori]

1. I'd like to know myself

2. don't know

3. Yes, as far as I know, but it'll be hard.

4. Evil players will have red names, known evil players(marked as foes I guess) should have their name always visible(not sure about last part).

[KeithStone]

1. If you get attacked by a good or neutral player they will be flagged as evil or rogue and defending yourself will not penalize you, but it's not implemented yet.

2. Yes, but not implemented yet.

3. Not Sure

4. There will be a clue in their name tag, but not implemented yet.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

What's to keep me from being an evil player and abusing the teleport on death. Say I murder, and loot your corpse. I then jump into the water knowing full well that you are a ghost who is waiting to kill me. Then I simply let you kill me in the water. I am unlootable and I will fast travel with all of your items back to my totem to start the cycle over again.

[Haunt]

What's to keep me from being an evil player and abusing the teleport on death. Say I murder, and loot your corpse. I then jump into the water knowing full well that you are a ghost who is waiting to kill me. Then I simply let you kill me in the water. I am unlootable and I will fast travel with all of your items back to my totem to start the cycle over again.

Instant fast travel. I LOVE this, thanks for the idea.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

Even if you don't kill em afterwards I can have a bear do it or just jump off of a few cliffs. This system is seriously flawed.

[KeithStone]

What's to keep me from being an evil player and abusing the teleport on death. Say I murder, and loot your corpse. I then jump into the water knowing full well that you are a ghost who is waiting to kill me. Then I simply let you kill me in the water. I am unlootable and I will fast travel with all of your items back to my totem to start the cycle over again.

it's obviously an exploit and will be fixed at some point.

[Jadzia]

What's to keep me from being an evil player and abusing the teleport on death. Say I murder, and loot your corpse. I then jump into the water knowing full well that you are a ghost who is waiting to kill me. Then I simply let you kill me in the water. I am unlootable and I will fast travel with all of your items back to my totem to start the cycle over again.

Death will result skill/stat loss (not implemented yet), so its not recommended to commit suicide :)

[Dontaze_Mebro]

At some point doesn't really cut it. I've asked the guides if they plan to fix the unlootable swimming corpses and they said they don't know. I say following someone who killed you as a ghost and repeatedly attacking them is an exploit as well. Maybe unlootable swimmers are intended to combat angry ghosts.

Skill loss isn't really an issue to griefers. They will prey on weak gathererrs and crafters.

[Haunt]

Death will result skill/stat loss (not implemented yet), so its not recommended to commit suicide :)

Link to that little tidbit of info please... I love that idea too, so when I kill the crafter, he not only gets pissed and loses some items to me, but I will be taking his stats and skills permanently also? This is getting better all the time. :)

[fflhktsn]

i saw somewhere else that people were talking about anyone who is evil losing stats and skills on death permanatly.....is this true?

So if i choose an evil tribe i choose permanat stat and skill losses upon death....what is that shit?

Perhaps good alignment players should permantly lose stats and skills upon failing a crafted item....

[yoori]

In an old thread about alignment system and PvP Jooky stated there will be stat and skill loss as death penalty, he didn't specify it will be only evil players that will loose them.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

The whole labeling of good and evil is complete BS anyway. "Good" clans will do horrible things as long as it doesn't lower their rep.

[furanku]

Death will result skill/stat loss (not implemented yet), so its not recommended to commit suicide :)

I think that came out of your ass -_- but I'd love to see that information.


i saw somewhere else that people were talking about anyone who is evil losing stats and skills on death permanatly.....is this true?

So if i choose an evil tribe i choose permanat stat and skill losses upon death....what is that shit?

Perhaps good alignment players should permantly lose stats and skills upon failing a crafted item....


To be honest I think that would be a good idea, Back in Ultima Online we had a color system (racist I know). The system was Blue (Good), Grey (Criminal) and Red (Murder) and how the system worked is that all major cities were under "guards" so Greys and Red would get "Guard Wacked" and cause instant death. However, at one solid time when you were red it would cuase your stats to decrease the more and more you get killed. However the shut that system off since the game didn't have the same type of revivial system as this. But it might be a nice way to pervent PVP in a way but, I doubt it will really stop anyone.

[byrgar]

I think that came out of your ass -_- but I'd love to see that information.




To be honest I think that would be a good idea, Back in Ultima Online we had a color system (racist I know). The system was Blue (Good), Grey (Criminal) and Red (Murder) and how the system worked is that all major cities were under "guards" so Greys and Red would get "Guard Wacked" and cause instant death. However, at one solid time when you were red it would cuase your stats to decrease the more and more you get killed. However the shut that system off since the game didn't have the same type of revivial system as this. But it might be a nice way to pervent PVP in a way but, I doubt it will really stop anyone.

Here you go

http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/32-Conflict-Death-Consequences-and-Decisions


A few people have posted questions regarding PVP and death in Xsyon. I will explain the system a little more.

PVP is open, but it has severe consequences.

In the Prelude:

Death results in some stat and skill loss and allows the victor to fully loot the player. This is not without complications and consequences for the victor.

[fflhktsn]

I think that came out of your ass -_- but I'd love to see that information.




To be honest I think that would be a good idea, Back in Ultima Online we had a color system (racist I know). The system was Blue (Good), Grey (Criminal) and Red (Murder) and how the system worked is that all major cities were under "guards" so Greys and Red would get "Guard Wacked" and cause instant death. However, at one solid time when you were red it would cuase your stats to decrease the more and more you get killed. However the shut that system off since the game didn't have the same type of revivial system as this. But it might be a nice way to pervent PVP in a way but, I doubt it will really stop anyone.

But its suppose to be the apocolypse...theres no laws to break, no body of law in which to label you as a murderer, and no way to tell if that guy on the horizon is good or evil. I like it that way, its all a big surprise.

If evil aligned players get permanat stat nerfs good aligned should do the same for crafting failures. Unless the developers are activly seeking to force players to be good in a sandbox.

I wont be interested in a game that tries to prevent pvp though means other than the community trying to self enforce. I know many would want me to leave anyway, but at this point im starting to think the community should just be happy people are in fact sticking with the game, at least if they want it to last very long.

[Dubanka]

implementation of some type of npc guards (at some point) would be nice...

THen if you're setting up your handy dandy super craftomallofallkindsofstuff you can post some guards at the entrance.

while this would not deter an enemy focused on your destruction, it would help alleviate the one off ganker.

shadowbane had thriving merchant cities, completely player built, run, and defended...roaming guards helped keep the riff raff at bay (basically if you become a nuissance you got banned fromt he city and the guards kos'd you).

we're not talking super storm trooper guards here, but npcs that are about as strong as a player who would attack interlopers and shout warnings of their arrival so that the protected populace at least had an alarm to store their goodies and prepare to scalp somebody.

[furanku]

Here you go

http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/32-Conflict-Death-Consequences-and-Decisions

Thanks ^_^


implementation of some type of npc guards (at some point) would be nice...

THen if you're setting up your handy dandy super craftomallofallkindsofstuff you can post some guards at the entrance.

while this would not deter an enemy focused on your destruction, it would help alleviate the one off ganker.

shadowbane had thriving merchant cities, completely player built, run, and defended...roaming guards helped keep the riff raff at bay (basically if you become a nuissance you got banned fromt he city and the guards kos'd you).

we're not talking super storm trooper guards here, but npcs that are about as strong as a player who would attack interlopers and shout warnings of their arrival so that the protected populace at least had an alarm to store their goodies and prepare to scalp somebody.


That would be player driven in this game not NPC driven but yeah it would be over all interesting how players attempt to prevent ^_^ raids.

[Jadzia]

I think that came out of your ass -_- but I'd love to see that information.


There you go:
http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/2274-PVP-rules/page2/#16

http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/32-Conflict-Death-Consequences-and-Decisions

[Jadzia]

But its suppose to be the apocolypse...theres no laws to break, no body of law in which to label you as a murderer, and no way to tell if that guy on the horizon is good or evil. I like it that way, its all a big surprise.

If evil aligned players get permanat stat nerfs good aligned should do the same for crafting failures. Unless the developers are activly seeking to force players to be good in a sandbox.

I wont be interested in a game that tries to prevent pvp though means other than the community trying to self enforce. I know many would want me to leave anyway, but at this point im starting to think the community should just be happy people are in fact sticking with the game, at least if they want it to last very long.
If you feel like this I have no idea why did you buy the game. It was told it has safe zones, sever consequences for being evil, and griefing/ganking won't be allowed. The devs want to keep the 80% of the players good/neutral and like 20% evil. So yes, they are trying to force them to be good.

Did you read the feature list and the FAQ before you bought it ?

[jumpshot]

implementation of some type of npc guards (at some point) would be nice...


Negative.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

Then they really need to not advertise this as a sandbox game because sandbox should be about player politics and policing not developer instigated punishments for playing the way you want.

[Dubanka]

Negative.

why not? as long as they are not super guards, and have a limit on their number, it's just another mob.

when they pull the safety switch on homesteads, the ability to have something to give you some warning when you've got company would be nice.


Then they really need to not advertise this as a sandbox game because sandbox should be about player politics and policing not developer instigated punishments for playing the way you want.

if there are penalties for death, they should go across allignment lines...i mean dying is dying right?

I don't even mind a temporary stat drop for 'evil' death...5 minutes? 10? but permanent stat drops meh.

how the devs handle this balance will really determine how this game plays out.

*hint* how much pve market share is there actually left to grab? how much pvp focused market share is out there and untapped?

[furanku]

Then they really need to not advertise this as a sandbox game because sandbox should be about player politics and policing not developer instigated punishments for playing the way you want.

Um.. just to ask you understand what SANDBOX STYLE is right?...

[Dontaze_Mebro]

We really are just going to see how this alignment system works before anymore speculation is made. Most games you aren't permanently evil so people will do bad things then make up for it to become good again. Which in my opinion makes them more evil than the dedicated evil players.

[bruisie159]

Then they really need to not advertise this as a sandbox game because sandbox should be about player politics and policing not developer instigated punishments for playing the way you want.

Could you show me the advertisment that describes xsyon as a sandbox in the first place. There is no mention of it on the home page or features list. Besides as far as im aware they have not advertised this game yet at all.

One thing that Jooky (xsyon) has always made clear and its mentioned on many of his posts is that he does not want pvp to be the focus of this game and he will make design decisions to ensure that doesnt happen. Just read well before you buy is all i can.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

Could you show me the advertisment that describes xsyon as a sandbox in the first place. There is no mention of it on the home page or features list. Besides as far as im aware they have not advertised this game yet at all.

I think the entire internet may have a big misconception of this game then...
http://www.google.com/search?source=ig&hl=en&rlz=&q=xsyonsandbox&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=#hl=en&safe=off&sa=X&ei=dJRmTeWzH4T48AbWxqXfCw&ved=0CBYQvwUoAQ&q=xsyon+sandbox&spell=1&bav=on.1,or.&fp=19d8439716407a1a

[Zephyr]

Instant fast travel. I LOVE this, thanks for the idea.

It's called "Bloodgating." The idea's been around since 2002 in DaoC.

[byrgar]

Could you show me the advertisment that describes xsyon as a sandbox in the first place. There is no mention of it on the home page or features list. Besides as far as im aware they have not advertised this game yet at all.

http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/01/06/massively-exclusive-jordi-grau-davis-answers-our-xsyon-question/

Check the interview with Massively from Jan this year, the interviewer refers to Xsyon as a sandbox a few times, and Jooky does not correct him in anyway, therefore, it has been described as a sandbox.

but you can nitpick and claim otherwise if you want.

[bruisie159]

as the debates here show just because the internet says it is doesnt make it so. DF was also described as a sandbox by the internet generally as was MO. I suppose more to the point is as far im aware there is no generally accepted definition of what as sandbox game really is but thats a different argument altogther.

[bruisie159]

http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/01/06/massively-exclusive-jordi-grau-davis-answers-our-xsyon-question/

Check the interview with Massively from Jan this year, the interviewer refers to Xsyon as a sandbox a few times, and Jooky does not correct him in anyway, therefore, it has been described as a sandbox.

but you can nitpick and claim otherwise if you want.

"Recently there seems to be a bit of a trend toward independently produced open-world games with sandbox elements and a heavy focus on PVP. What sets your game apart from titles like Darkfall or Mortal Online? Do you see PvP conflict as the driving force behind Xsyon?"

that is what was said. to me thats a question about pvp and how xsyon compares to other games with sandbox elements. It doesnt describe xsyon as a sandbox.

and actually another quote for those arguing about the importance of pvp in xsyon.

"What sets Xsyon apart is a focus on building and creating a new world and not relying on PvP as the driving force"

[yoori]

if there are penalties for death, they should go across allignment lines...i mean dying is dying right?

I don't even mind a temporary stat drop for 'evil' death...5 minutes? 10? but permanent stat drops meh.

how the devs handle this balance will really determine how this game plays out.

*hint* how much pve market share is there actually left to grab? how much pvp focused market share is out there and untapped?

5 or 10 min stat loss isn't really a penalty, permament loss isn't permament either you gain stats and skill anyway by doing things. It should be there to make people don't want to die or risk it. It's not fast paced PvP game, you have to work for what you get.

[KeithStone]

Then I simply let you kill me in the water. I am unlootable and I will fast travel with all of your items back to my totem to start the cycle over again.

right now you can't be killed in the water, you would have to die on impact. but like i said in my last post, if it turns out to be an exploit they will fix it.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/01/06/massively-exclusive-jordi-grau-davis-answers-our-xsyon-question/

Check the interview with Massively from Jan this year, the interviewer refers to Xsyon as a sandbox a few times, and Jooky does not correct him in anyway, therefore, it has been described as a sandbox.


but you can nitpick and claim otherwise if you want.

Oh Snap!

[bruisie159]

Oh Snap!

"Recently there seems to be a bit of a trend toward independently produced open-world games with sandbox elements and a heavy focus on PVP. What sets your game apart from titles like Darkfall or Mortal Online? Do you see PvP conflict as the driving force behind Xsyon?"

that is what was said. to me thats a question about pvp and how xsyon compares to other games with sandbox elements. It doesnt describe xsyon as a sandbox.

and actually another quote for those arguing about the importance of pvp in xsyon.

"What sets Xsyon apart is a focus on building and creating a new world and not relying on PvP as the driving force"

[byrgar]

"Recently there seems to be a bit of a trend toward independently produced open-world games with sandbox elements and a heavy focus on PVP. What sets your game apart from titles like Darkfall or Mortal Online? Do you see PvP conflict as the driving force behind Xsyon?"

that is what was said. to me thats a question about pvp and how xsyon compares to other games with sandbox elements. It doesnt describe xsyon as a sandbox.

and actually another quote for those arguing about the importance of pvp in xsyon.

"What sets Xsyon apart is a focus on building and creating a new world and not relying on PvP as the driving force"

I can play the "pick bits that support my view" game too ;P


The Xsyon website lists a huge number of features and ultimately makes the game sound like a sandbox fan's dream. Is there any particular feature that you're the most proud of or that you'd like to call attention to?

I am proud of all that we've accomplished with such a small team and overcoming some huge hurdles, especially in this past year!

If I had to single out one feature, it would be the terraforming system. This has become a much more interesting feature than I anticipated and I've enjoyed seeing what players do with it. One of my goals with Xsyon is to provide players with the tools and systems and evolve them according to how players react.

Sandbox fan's dream eh ;P

[bruisie159]

I can play the "pick bits that support my view" game too ;P



Sandbox fan's dream eh ;P

Of course becasue it has a lot of sandbox elements - i really dont see that he is decieving anyone by talking about a terraforming system appea;ling to those that like sandboxy games??

[byrgar]

Of course becasue it has a lot of sandbox elements - i really dont see that he is decieving anyone by talking about a terraforming system appea;ling to those that like sandboxy games??
as I said a few post's back, nitpick if you want, but that interview show's Xsyon as a sandbox game, Jooky does not say otherwise.

Also, if you need further evidence, how about


Notorious Games Set to Launch MMORPG XSYON Prelude on March 1st, 2011!

Xsyon is a unique fantasy role playing sandbox MMOPRG that allows players to create their own virtual realities as they form tribes, build towns, shape landscapes, create quests and build an economy.

taken from "The Press" page of the Xsyon site ;P

[Dontaze_Mebro]

as I said a few post's back, nitpick if you want, but that interview show's Xsyon as a sandbox game, Jooky does not say otherwise.

Also, if you need further evidence, how about



taken from "The Press" page of the Xsyon site ;P

Oh Snap!

[bruisie159]

as I said a few post's back, nitpick if you want, but that interview show's Xsyon as a sandbox game, Jooky does not say otherwise.

Also, if you need further evidence, how about



taken from "The Press" page of the Xsyon site ;P

lol ill stand by my point xsyon has many sandbox elements, more than lots of other games that really do claim to be sandboxes. You still havent really provided any real evidence for your point the intervoew DOES NOT say at any point that xsyon is a sandbox game so how can jordy agree with it??

[byrgar]

lol ill stand by my point xsyon has many sandbox elements, more than lots of other games that really do claim to be sandboxes. You still havent really provided any real evidence for your point the intervoew DOES NOT say at any point that xsyon is a sandbox game so how can jordy agree with it??
Ah, I see, so you just ignore the quote from the Xsyon site completely......which DOES say it IS a sandbox MMORPG (though there is a spelling error and they have it as MMOPRG ;P)

(on a side note, please please please get the server back up lol we are reduced to discussing (argueing if you like) the sandboxyness of Xsyon...save us!!!)

[Jadzia]

A Tale in the Desert is a sandbox, and it has no combat at all. FFA PvP is not a requirement for a sandbox game.

[furanku]

A Tale in the Desert is a sandbox, and it has no combat at all. FFA PvP is not a requirement for a sandbox game.

I deem this True ^_^

[Dontaze_Mebro]

It's the one "sandbox" without it. Face it the terms we gamers live by are vague at best. Guess what though? This game has FFA PVP. Love it or leave it.

[FabricSoftener]

It's the one "sandbox" without it. Face it the terms we gamers live by are vague at best. Guess what though? This game has FFA PVP. Love it or leave it.

lol.

you must love crafting

[Doc]

Meh, we onto sandbox again? This is sandbox:

- kill anyone, anywhere, anytime with 0 consequences
- terraform anywhere you want
- all containers are set to public
- pretty loose grief rules that only go to RL limit - racism and such
- destroy any totem anytime you want
- buildings can be destroyed anywhere, anytime

And let playerbase police themselves, absolutely no rules. no dev interventions. no protections of any kind. no restrictions.

Nobody wants it. Shoo.

[FabricSoftener]

reason I try not to argue over the word sandbox is because gamespot a few times refered to GTA series as a sandbox and GTA was (maybe still is) listed as an example of a 'non-lineral game' in wikipedia.
After that, I was done with the subject and the word.

[r4NGe]

Meh, we onto sandbox again? This is sandbox:

- kill anyone, anywhere, anytime with 0 consequences
- terraform anywhere you want
- all containers are set to public
- pretty loose grief rules that only go to RL limit - racism and such
- destroy any totem anytime you want
- buildings can be destroyed anywhere, anytime

And let playerbase police themselves, absolutely no rules. no dev interventions. no protections of any kind. no restrictions.

Nobody wants it. Shoo.

It's a sandbox.

[furanku]

Meh, we onto sandbox again? This is sandbox:

- kill anyone, anywhere, anytime with 0 consequences
- terraform anywhere you want
- all containers are set to public
- pretty loose grief rules that only go to RL limit - racism and such
- destroy any totem anytime you want
- buildings can be destroyed anywhere, anytime

And let playerbase police themselves, absolutely no rules. no dev interventions. no protections of any kind. no restrictions.

Nobody wants it. Shoo.


Speak it Sister. SPEAK IT!

[Larsa]

5 or 10 min stat loss isn't really a penalty, permament loss isn't permament either you gain stats and skill anyway by doing things. It should be there to make people don't want to die or risk it. It's not fast paced PvP game, you have to work for what you get.I believe you are right, and, somehow, I believe too that Xsyon will address the death penalty and alignment topics once the more pressing technical issues with the server are dealt with.

I believe a stinging death penalty is needed for this game and a penalty to stats and skills sounds good to me. And with that I mean an actual loss of stat or skill points, thus no temporary one. Additionally, death could cause that a player "cannot remember" a crafting recipe or two after the death experience. :)

I envision a system that - while FFA PvP is possible - causes that FFA PvP seldom is chosen as the most appropriate action by the players, just because the penalty for death is hurting so much.

Also, just imagine a death penalty that is dynamic, possibly after religion is introduced into the game. Here the death penalty could be a light to moderate one when, for example, there have been less than 5 player-killings server-wide in the last 24 hours, climbing to a very steep death penalty if we had more than 100 player-killings during the last 24 hours or so.

[fflhktsn]

I believe you are right, and, somehow, I believe too that Xsyon will address the death penalty and alignment topics once the more pressing technical issues with the server are dealt with.

I believe a stinging death penalty is needed for this game and a penalty to stats and skills sounds good to me. And with that I mean an actual loss of stat or skill points, thus no temporary one. Additionally, death could cause that a player "cannot remember" a crafting recipe or two after the death experience. :)

I envision a system that - while FFA PvP is possible - causes that FFA PvP seldom is chosen as the most appropriate action by the players, just because the penalty for death is hurting so much.

Also, just imagine a death penalty that is dynamic, possibly after religion is introduced into the game. Here the death penalty could be a light to moderate one when, for example, there have been less than 5 player-killings server-wide in the last 24 hours, climbing to a very steep death penalty if we had more than 100 player-killings during the last 24 hours or so.

I fully agree, however think it should be more stinging.

For instance, whenever you faile to craft an item your stats and skill should be permanatly lost.

When you fail to find something foraging or scavanging it should take away health

Also i think permanant death is a good idea, but you can just make a new character...how about account ban upon death?


Im looking forward to being totaly nerfed for being evil, now i dont feel so bad camping new player spawns and being brutal on new players in general.

[FabricSoftener]

I fully agree, however think it should be more stinging.

For instance, whenever you faile to craft an item your stats and skill should be permanatly lost.

When you fail to find something foraging or scavanging it should take away health

Also i think permanant death is a good idea, but you can just make a new character...how about account ban upon death?

no that is not hard core enough. Basically if you fail at harvesting berries your computer should explode.

[fflhktsn]

perhaps upon death, jookie should come to your house and kill you for real...i think that is a stinging enough death penalty

[fflhktsn]

honestly though, there shouldnt be a penalty built into the game for choosing a faction, or participating in any part of the game, pvp included. sandbox = players enforce any rules they choose though the game not though crying to the developers to make it all better.

[FabricSoftener]

perhaps upon death, jookie should come to your house and kill you for real...i think that is a stinging enough death penalty

I really think there is a higher than average number of people in the gaming community who were abused as childern

[GLiMPSE]

I will say this and regardless of which side of the issue you are on you will agree.

Being bad doesn't mean anything if there's not consequences to being bad....

I am all for the harshest punishments up to and including permadeath for murderers... that doesn't stop the fact that I will still be one of the few that will choose to live my life like this. It's more rewarding when not everyone is willing to murder their neighbor.

[Dubanka]

what's funny about the whole militant carebear movement is they don't even realize that the pvp side is the least ugly aspect of what an angry opponent can do. So situation:

I don't like you. You took the the spot i wanted and now you will pay.
- My tribe will strip the area in the vicinity of your pathetic excuse for a town of resources. Trees, grass, stone, whatever...we'll deplete it.
- The farther afield you move, well, we'll strip that too.
- We'll plant spies in your ranks to tear you up from the inside. stealing, deleting...generally causing distrust among your members (hehe maybe we're already there :) )
- We'll make sure that when we attack you, that you do not have a hope of winning. 3, 4, 5 v 1 odds...since death is too painful to risk.

When you take away a fair minded pvp 'solution' and create a system that does not equitably treat player behavior...that's a slippery slope to making a game that no one playes.

oh, and I know, the response to the above will be, 'thats griefing, you'll be banned'...well not really. If i plant homestead nearby, i'm merely harvesting for my homestead. Sorry if it bothers you. Or is there a rule that i can't take resources near your town? It's unfair that you're attacking me with those odds...that's griefing! BAN BAN BAN. Where is there a rule that i have to fight fair...the rules (as you'd have them) give me every incentive to NOT fight a fair or disadvantaged fight. And, SPYING IS GRIEFINGING BAN BAN BAN. *shrug* throwaway account...it was made to be banned...if you catch me.

So in general, the careabear militia really needs to start playing connect the dots on what happens when restrictions and penalties become too severe...

Of course yes, you can say just eliminate the pvp all together...but then you probably lose over 50% of your population right off the bat and more over time...We (the pvp community) have a fairly large playerbase (300-500K?) that is out there waiting for 'the game'...that are currently biding timing playing something less than ideal. How many players are waiting in the wings for the 'ultimate crafting game'?

[FabricSoftener]

what's funny about the whole militant carebear movement


lol

there used to not be any QQ posts now every QQ swinging dick who wants to proove their manhood by playing Xsyon pvp has been posting hyterically as if they are going to loose their marbles for the past few weeks.

[Haunt]

I will tell you right now, if death penalty is as severe as some want it, I will simply continue to roll new toons with 90 STR and such and use my Pre-Order weapon to kill people, not worrying about skilling up at all. And I have about 5 friends that will do the same. You may say that your armor and skills will out match mine, but we will see how you handle an angry mob of 5 or 6 dedicated reroll thugs that come at you night after night.

This of course is not my chosen method to play this game, in fact I much rather be a part of society that enjoys pking and griefing on the side. Frak, I would consider a 2nd acct so I could also play for keeps and enjoy the other aspects of the game, but if death hurts really bad and stat/skill loss is part of it, I will be willing to have two active accts so one of them can be dedicated to rebelling against such a harsh penalty and making as many people feel the pain with me that I can. And I can think of a few others that would go the 2 acct route.

I'm just sayin'

[yoori]

I will tell you right now, if death penalty is as severe as some want it, I will simply continue to roll new toons with 90 STR and such and use my Pre-Order weapon to kill people, not worrying about skilling up at all. And I have about 5 friends that will do the same. You may say that your armor and skills will out match mine, but we will see how you handle an angry mob of 5 or 6 dedicated reroll thugs that come at you night after night.

This of course is not my chosen method to play this game, in fact I much rather be a part of society that enjoys pking and griefing on the side. Frak, I would consider a 2nd acct so I could also play for keeps and enjoy the other aspects of the game, but if death hurts really bad and stat/skill loss is part of it, I will be willing to have two active accts so one of them can be dedicated to rebelling against such a harsh penalty and making as many people feel the pain with me that I can. And I can think of a few others that would go the 2 acct route.

I'm just sayin'

Why losing one point is such a big penalty. Especially when it's for good and evil players. You just have to make sure you won't die. It leaves evil tribes with people that like harder gameplay and want to be evil.

I don't want to run away from anyone I see, especially when combat system is more like lottery. PvP would me mostly in war system where there would be no penalty. And open PvP would be there to give you the thrill that you may die today like it supposed to be.

We don't want to ruin the game for PvP'ers, PvP will be there with or without you and we'll have to fight at some point. We don't want this game to become PvP arena couse it would ruin the game for us.

[kombi]

Personaly i hope there is a big penalty for death... it will make the pvp aspect more of a challenge. That way you wont have a bunch of powerfull pvprs runing about like babboons killing every crafter..

and while i play pvp ill have to make a choice and decide wether the risk of attacking the current target is worth it or not... as in is he alone.. is he really a unlucky crafter im watching or a fighter.. cathering crap for a friend.. can i kill him loot him and run for cover before his buddies make it to me...

if you dont have the penalty you will have a bunch of gankers just running around killing everyone like you have now... where is the fun/challenge in that

[bruisie159]

and a pvp arena is the one thing this game will not become. That for sure is an aim of the devs. I totally agree there will be plently of pvp in this game you want it, if its not to your taste just find something else. To be honest though there is not much out there with the ruleset (or lack of) that you seek because very few people would play it.

[fflhktsn]

http://www.dragoart.com/tuts/pics/8/1449/how-to-draw-a-care-bear,-tenderheart-bear.jpg
Personaly i hope there is a big penalty for death... it will make the pvp aspect more of a challenge. That way you wont have a bunch of powerfull pvprs runing about like babboons killing every crafter..

and while i play pvp ill have to make a choice and decide wether the risk of attacking the current target is worth it or not... as in is he alone.. is he really a unlucky crafter im watching or a fighter.. cathering crap for a friend.. can i kill him loot him and run for cover before his buddies make it to me...

if you dont have the penalty you will have a bunch of gankers just running around killing everyone like you have now... where is the fun/challenge in that

[Tehroth]

This kinda pisses me off. People that will abuse the system just to grief. Perhaps to make it fair blue players lose .05 stat on death and Reds 1 stat point on death. The more I think about it we might need to keep tribal areas safe zones from dumbasses like this guy. Until after prelude.

Perhaps just have a timed stat reduction based on the number of times you die. Once for 10 minutes twice 20, 30, 40, then perma stat loss after that.

[furanku]

You know I hope someone makes a character called "Yogi" and fucks you all up and ends "CARE BEAR THAT SMUCK! " lol

also youtubes it witht he title " YOGI FIGHTS BACK "with episodies named " HARDCORE YOGI"

[fflhktsn]

This kinda pisses me off. People that will abuse the system just to grief. Perhaps to make it fair blue players lose .05 stat on death and Reds 1 stat point on death. The more I think about it we might need to keep tribal areas safe zones from dumbasses like this guy. Until after prelude.

Perhaps just have a timed stat reduction based on the number of times you die. Once for 10 minutes twice 20, 30, 40, then perma stat loss after that.

but...but...then theres no risk in crafting.....everyone will just be running around crafting like baboons

permant stat and skill loss for crafting failures is the only way to prevent this.

[BigCountry]

but...but...then theres no risk in crafting.....everyone will just be running around crafting like baboons

permant stat and skill loss for crafting failures is the only way to prevent this.

rofl

[FabricSoftener]

whats funny about this is people running around trying to steal things from harvesters when all they really need to do is bend over and pick it up off the ground.

[fflhktsn]

no...we are not stealing things from harvesters...we usually delete those items on the spot anyway.

i do it for all the wonderful things people like you send me in whisper chat afterwards.

[jokhul]

<snip>
Of course yes, you can say just eliminate the pvp all together...but then you probably lose over 50% of your population right off the bat and more over time...We (the pvp community) have a fairly large playerbase (300-500K?) that is out there waiting for 'the game'...that are currently biding timing playing something less than ideal. How many players are waiting in the wings for the 'ultimate crafting game'?

Well, given the fact that this will never be "the ultimate PvP game", I guess we don't have to worry too much about the "pvp community" anyways, given that they'll all be moving on once the next awesome PvP game launches ? :D

[fflhktsn]

Well, given the fact that this will never be "the ultimate PvP game", I guess we don't have to worry too much about the "pvp community" anyways, given that they'll all be moving on once the next awesome PvP game launches ? :D

QFT

im already looking at earthrise, wich has similair problems but the game is running....and its the full game, not a beta prelude with the full content a year away....and the world actually looks like an apocalypse happend...

[bruisie159]

QFT

im already looking at earthrise, wich has similair problems but the game is running....and its the full game, not a beta prelude with the full content a year away....and the world actually looks like an apocalypse happend...

can i have ur stuff?

[Haunt]

Why losing one point is such a big penalty. Especially when it's for good and evil players. You just have to make sure you won't die. It leaves evil tribes with people that like harder gameplay and want to be evil.

I don't want to run away from anyone I see, especially when combat system is more like lottery. PvP would me mostly in war system where there would be no penalty. And open PvP would be there to give you the thrill that you may die today like it supposed to be.

We don't want to ruin the game for PvP'ers, PvP will be there with or without you and we'll have to fight at some point. We don't want this game to become PvP arena couse it would ruin the game for us.

It is all about balance, a small penalty is acceptable.

[Doc]

I will tell you right now, if death penalty is as severe as some want it, I will simply continue to roll new toons with 90 STR and such and use my Pre-Order weapon to kill people, not worrying about skilling up at all. And I have about 5 friends that will do the same. You may say that your armor and skills will out match mine, but we will see how you handle an angry mob of 5 or 6 dedicated reroll thugs that come at you night after night.

This of course is not my chosen method to play this game, in fact I much rather be a part of society that enjoys pking and griefing on the side. Frak, I would consider a 2nd acct so I could also play for keeps and enjoy the other aspects of the game, but if death hurts really bad and stat/skill loss is part of it, I will be willing to have two active accts so one of them can be dedicated to rebelling against such a harsh penalty and making as many people feel the pain with me that I can. And I can think of a few others that would go the 2 acct route.

I'm just sayin'

Ok, we will make it more realistic for ya, since you are such a fan of realism. There is a jail building good/neutral tribes can build, and if "red" player dies, tribes that he has commited crime against sentece him to jail punishment they see fit. Character in jail cannot be deleted. Satisfied?

[fflhktsn]

It is all about balance, a small penalty is acceptable.

Thats not balance, giving my combat character a nerf because i didnt want to stay in my totem safezone and craft baskets.

I have the risk of living outside the safe zone, im an enemy to all, meaning there is no saftey...now i gotta deal with stat losses because i chose the hard route?

fine you want balance, give me the death penalty but you have to give crafters a stat loss pentaly when they fail a crafted item while protected by their magical safe zone.

[fflhktsn]

Ok, we will make it more realistic for ya, since you are such a fan of realism. There is a jail building good/neutral tribes can build, and if "red" player dies, tribes that he has commited crime against sentece him to jail punishment they see fit. Character in jail cannot be deleted. Satisfied?

If your satisfied with a majority of the popluation leaving the game, and the game going under, inorder to protect your carebear ways..i can live with that.

Im not the one who joined a ffa full loot game to cry about pvp.

Hopitroll..

[FabricSoftener]

If your satisfied with a majority of the popluation leaving the game, and the game going under, inorder to protect your carebear ways..i can live with that.

Im not the one who joined a ffa full loot game to cry about pvp.

Hopitroll..

lol..classic hidden QQ move.

'daddy made promises' and 'I will leave you if you dont ...' are dead give aways.

need any help packing?

[byrgar]

If your satisfied with a majority of the popluation leaving the game, and the game going under, inorder to protect your carebear ways..i can live with that.

Im not the one who joined a ffa full loot game to cry about pvp.

Hopitroll..

but you did join a game that does not have pvp as its main focus ;P

[Doc]

If your satisfied with a majority of the popluation leaving the game, and the game going under, inorder to protect your carebear ways..i can live with that.

Im not the one who joined a ffa full loot game to cry about pvp.

Hopitroll..

Lol, point to where have i cried of PvP? Full loot? FFA? Anywhere? Its you crying against consquences to your actions. You know, thats realism for ya, be careful what you wish for, you might get it.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

Ok, we will make it more realistic for ya, since you are such a fan of realism. There is a jail building good/neutral tribes can build, and if "red" player dies, tribes that he has commited crime against sentece him to jail punishment they see fit. Character in jail cannot be deleted. Satisfied?

Only if reds can take you as slaves. To hold as long as they want. I've already played this game it's called starquest online, and trust me I'm better at capturing and keeping people in cages than you are.

Funny how you want to be able to keep them forever while you carebears complain about us forcing our play experience on you. You would want to keep someone in a cage forever because they stole your shears. Truly hypocritical.

[Viper66]

You want Balance here it is,,

Evil attacks Evil the victor gets some perks,, (why not they are making it safe for all)
Evil attacks Neutral ..Evil wins he gets little perks, Neutral wins he gets most perks (its for the swing both ways folks)
Evil attacks Good .. Evil wins contest he gets nothing except what is carried that was not given the good guy at character build, Good wins he gets major perks, and Evil has to pay Goods next month bill,,but here is the catch Good cannot attack Evil but can offer to trade a very nasty axe for some food...lol.

My problem is if the Tribe iam in is Evil,, and I log in by myself because lets say the other 12 folks are still at work or to drunk to play,, Iam at a strict disadvantage and cant go gather any items around the area as a lone Evil type dude without being accosted by every one who is pissed at Evil folks.. How does one get around that ,,??,, There is of course no problem when all 12 of us are on at any given time... Can I change to Good lets say for a 4 or 5 hr period even though my Tribe is set at Evil?.. Maybe we need a system that lets anyone be what they want for only a period of time (more than 15 min ...lol) ??.. Don't know how to begin this idea.. tks all ..

[Dontaze_Mebro]

The "good" clans will hunt the evils into extinction. Attacking their villages when everyone is offline.

[Aramanu]

Thats the risk you take for being evil.

[MrKrueak]

QFT

im already looking at earthrise, wich has similair problems but the game is running....and its the full game, not a beta prelude with the full content a year away....and the world actually looks like an apocalypse happend...

honestly, you want be happy with earthrise, people are leaving that one in droves, they have huge issues and the devs are not doing anything, if they are they are not communicating and showing any evidence of doing so. you only have to take one look at their forums to see.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

Why should evil have more risk than anyone else? What benefit will there be to being evil? Don't give me some idiotic answer like "Evil don't deserve anything." because that's just stupid.

[Aramanu]

well for starters you don't have to worry about being automaticly booted from a good tribe for being evil, also being evil means you don't have to worry about alignment?
I'm sure there are more.

[bruisie159]

Why should evil have more risk than anyone else? What benefit will there be to being evil? Don't give me some idiotic answer like "Evil don't deserve anything." because that's just stupid.

evil dont deserve anything

[Jadzia]

Why should evil have more risk than anyone else? What benefit will there be to being evil? Don't give me some idiotic answer like "Evil don't deserve anything." because that's just stupid.

Because the Big Boss said so. He doesn't want his game to turn into a gankfest. Live with it, or leave. I'm tired of all these QQing, its getting ridiculous. You should have read the feature list and the FAQ before buying the game.

[yoori]

Why should evil have more risk than anyone else? What benefit will there be to being evil? Don't give me some idiotic answer like "Evil don't deserve anything." because that's just stupid.

Becouse they can attack anyone. It'll be very hard to keep good alignment. Other good and neutral tribes can "steal" resources near your area and you can't do anything about it.

[Dubanka]

Just out of curiousity...question for the Carebear Militia:

Regarding the rallying cry of '...PVP IS NOT THE MAIN FOCUS OF THE GAME!!!...'

How do you make this statement in a game that is designed to have limited and depleteable resources?

Yes, crafting is the fuel that runs the bus, but the driver is pvp...because eventually (quickly) conflict will arise over those rapidly depleting resources.
scarcer the resource the greater its value, the greater it's value the more conflict that will arise over its possession.

So how can you say that pvp is not the primary focus in the game, when every game mechanic sets you down a path that will ultimately lead to smashing the other guy's head in with a mallet?

[JCatano]

For the record...

Respawning at your totem is going to happen to everyone, fortunately. It was talked about in a thread from a few months ago, and he agreed with it. It was confirmed a few days ago, too. He just hasn't had time to change it because of the server issues. I'd also suggest that if no totem is available to you, respawn should happen at the nearest starter area.

As far as water exploiting... That needs a fix ASAP. Not only is it difficult to hit anyone in the water, you can't loot them. After death, whatever is on you at the time should show up in a 25 slot copy of the starter backpack and stay there for 60 minutes or until fully looted. That would be the "grave" where people can loot from.

- Every item should drop no matter your alignment if death occurred from PvP.

- Good/Neutral alignment characters should only drop what is in their backpack after PvE death. Anything equipped onto their paperdoll could respawn with them at the totem.

- Evil players drop all items after a PvE death.

Not too sure about skill loss. If it stays in, it should be very close to the same value for each alignment setting.

Anyway... Good, Neutral, and Evil all need to have accountability. There has to be perks and drawbacks for each.

[Dubanka]

For the record...

Respawning at your totem is going to happen to everyone, fortunately. It was talked about in a thread from a few months ago, and he agreed with it. It was confirmed a few days ago, too. He just hasn't had time to change it because of the server issues. I'd also suggest that if no totem is available to you, respawn should happen at the nearest starter area.

As far as water exploiting... That needs a fix ASAP. Not only is it difficult to hit anyone in the water, you can't loot them. After death, whatever is on you at the time should show up in a 25 slot copy of the starter backpack and stay there for 60 minutes or until fully looted. That would be the "grave" where people can loot from.

- Every item should drop no matter your alignment if death occurred from PvP.

- Good/Neutral alignment characters should only drop what is in their backpack after PvE death. Anything equipped onto their paperdoll could respawn with them at the totem.

- Evil players drop all items after a PvE death.

Not too sure about skill loss. If it stays in, it should be very close to the same value for each alignment setting.

Anyway... Good, Neutral, and Evil all need to have accountability. There has to be perks and drawbacks for each.

+1

[orious13]

For the record...

Respawning at your totem is going to happen to everyone, fortunately. It was talked about in a thread from a few months ago, and he agreed with it. It was confirmed a few days ago, too. He just hasn't had time to change it because of the server issues. I'd also suggest that if no totem is available to you, respawn should happen at the nearest starter area.

As far as water exploiting... That needs a fix ASAP. Not only is it difficult to hit anyone in the water, you can't loot them. After death, whatever is on you at the time should show up in a 25 slot copy of the starter backpack and stay there for 60 minutes or until fully looted. That would be the "grave" where people can loot from.

- Every item should drop no matter your alignment if death occurred from PvP.

- Good/Neutral alignment characters should only drop what is in their backpack after PvE death. Anything equipped onto their paperdoll could respawn with them at the totem.

- Evil players drop all items after a PvE death.

Not too sure about skill loss. If it stays in, it should be very close to the same value for each alignment setting.

Anyway... Good, Neutral, and Evil all need to have accountability. There has to be perks and drawbacks for each.

+1

+1

also ... are you more feeling like this:
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or this:
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?