FFA PvP should be like "Salem"

[StarvingSteve]

Here is the plan:

At first all tribal areas will be safe then, at some point down the road, tribal safe zones will be optional.

If your tribe wishes to play more realistically with the chance of being attacked at any point you may do so. However, if you wish to be more of a crafting tribe and not have to look over your shoulder all the time you may keep the safe zone on.

Imo very bad idea. It's an artifical rule that takes away from immersion and sandboxyness while adding nothing to the game. Also, playing "more realistically" means being the only who gets ganked, because you were the only one stupid enough to disable your safe zone.

I don't really like alignment systems either.


Have a look at Salem (by the guys who made Haven & Hearth):
http://pc.ign.com/articles/114/1148989p1.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nkn2tipREYk

It features unrestricted PvP with full loot and perma-death. Every crime leaves behind a "crime scene". If a player investigates it, the criminal can be tracked down and dealt with one way or another. You can even lynch criminals while they are offline.

edit:
Just to clarify, I'm not arguing for perma-death, although I wouldn't mind it, either. Anyway, the system just needs some kind of punishment.


Known for its controversial permanent death feature, an essential game mechanic that introduces risk as players progress in the new world, Salem is a fresh twist on the MMO genre giving players control of their towns in the game and introducing frontier justice in the open Player-versus-Player (PvP) environment.
[...]
The concept of revenge and towns policing themselves and even sanctioning hits on griefers is going to be a really compelling aspect. We know we'll see some interesting things when the community finally has a chance to play Salem later this year.

[Redemp]

Perma death has never been done well, nor will it ever be done well.

In response to the meat of the rule set your proposing. I do not believe it would be beneficial nor an easy undertaking to implement, we are trying to survive and get back onto our feet.... Now perhaps when the game moves into the next phase it might be worth a second look.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

It's done quite well in Haven and Hearth. Xsyon has already stated there will be permadeath in the form of old age.

[Redemp]

A character dieing of old age, which is speculated to take real life years is vastly different than perma-death if one is pked.

[Garack]

It's done quite well in Haven and Hearth. Xsyon has already stated there will be permadeath in the form of old age.

means you play this game get your skill developed and then booom. toon is dead? lol

[ozmono]

Considering details on Salem are very scarce it's not a good idea to base a poll on a line off a feature list.

[ozmono]

Perma death has never been done well, nor will it ever be done well.
Perma death hasn't really even been done, let alone good or bad. Haven and hearth is the only mmo I've played with permadeath. It would change the climate of the game and depending on the game that could be a good thing. I welcome a game experimenting with perma death.

[StarvingSteve]

Considering details on Salem are very scarce it's not a good idea to base a poll on a line off a feature list.

Well, Salem's system is very similar to Haven & Hearth, and it worked pretty well there.

On the other hand, H&H never got much attention from the DF & MO PvP crowd, unlike Xsyon. Most players are pretty peaceful. If you have a lot of players specifically looking for FFA PvP, things could turn out worse. But still, I just like all the stuff that can happen with such a system, while "toggle-your-safezone" sounds rather stale and boring...


means you play this game get your skill developed and then booom. toon is dead? lol

Yes, but it's not as hardcore as it sounds.

You're not going to die unless you run around in a forest poking bears with a stick, or do something equally stupid. In 3-4 months, I died only once in the first month, and that was my own fault, really. Charged at a stranger with badass combat gear, trying to hug him. Turned out he wasn't into hugging -.-

[Farseer]

I played Haven and Hearth a lot.

If Salem is anything like Haven & Hearth, it might not be a good idea. All it resulted in was people slaughtering entire villages so they couldn't be tracked down and murdered instead of just killing one or two people.

[Farseer]

Weird doublepost.

[StarvingSteve]

If Salem is anything like Haven & Hearth, it might not be a good idea. All it resulted in was people slaughtering entire villages so they couldn't be tracked down and murdered instead of just killing one or two people.

Then those villages really lacked connections and allies. Players should network and stick together.

The only flaws i see are:
- It's hard to get rid of powerful and organized guilds of criminals without starting an all-out war.
- If there are too many of those guilds, the wars never stop and no place is ever safe. The game can get kinda tedious.

[Lerxst]

Perma-death is good... to a point. Between MMO's I played games like Travian and Tribal Wars. Essentially, they all involve perma-death too.

Basically, in the early stages, dying should be a set-back but not game-breaking. In the mid stages, dying should be more of a burden but be much less common. IE - you're stronger, more equipment, more defense, more allies. In the later stages dying should have an option that doesn't require you to go through the first 2 stages all over again (could be talking about a year of game-time).

Those other games I mentioned got around the late-game perma-death by resetting servers every several months and having server start times overlap. I can't see that working for Xsyon. They would need a mechanic that made dying very undesirable but still something a player (not necessarily their toon) could recover from.

[JCatano]

Imo very bad idea. It's an artifical rule that takes away from immersion and sandboxyness while adding nothing to the game. Also, playing "more realistically" means being the only who gets ganked, because you were the only one stupid enough to disable your safe zone.

Virtus was mistaken. After Prelude, safety zones are going to be turned off.

[StarvingSteve]

Virtus was mistaken. After Prelude, safety zones are going to be turned off.

What makes you think so?
The quote is quite recent and Virtus didn't correct himself, at least not in the same thread...

edit: the quote is from here:
http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/3807-Did-you-know-this-will-be-a-FFA-PVP-game/page6

[JCatano]

What makes you think so?
The quote is quite recent and Virtus didn't correct himself, at least not in the same thread...

edit: the quote is from here:
http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/3807-Did-you-know-this-will-be-a-FFA-PVP-game/page6

"The main discussion seems to be regarding safe zones. Some players are imagining 'safe switches' that can be turned on and off. That's not part of any plan. I am considering allowing tribes that want to war sooner than others to remove their safe zone if they so desire. A separate zone (as the mist clears) or server with no safe zones at all is also under consideration depending on the world's population. My goal is not to impose new limits as solutions but to give more choices." - Xsyon

http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/590-Xsyon-Updates-Archive/page19

It was verified via PM to me, too.

So, safe zones turned off after Prelude. He may allows us to turn off safety earlier than planned. If population allows, making a zone or server that has save zones off during Prelude will be considered, too ( as opposed to a zone or server, I assume).

[StarvingSteve]

ah, that's nice. I thought the devs wanted to change the system because of all the concerns...

Well, we'll see how it all turns out.