Regarding Saved Totems

[wolfmoonstrike]

Regarding the final wipe, we plan for this to be a week before the official launch of March 15th. We have compiled a list of saved totems from the 18th and will email the tribe and homestead leaders in advance of the final wipe.

How is this fair? I mean during the 18th Pre-Launch lag who's to say any totem was legit. From what I understand some totems had to be placed a multitude of times before they stuck or were overwritten by another tribe. Also what about the tribes you didn't recover their data but they did place a totem? Because there is always a chance you missed something.

So really all I'm calling for is a complete wipe and give everybody a fair chance to get their land. I honestly believe that no place should be saved and we all run for our spots on the day of the new Pre-Launch.

Also what about the new people who did technically did preorder your game? Should these people get shafted?

Btw I would like to say I'm not posting this as a member of Pandemic but as a Subscriber of the game. These are my views so whatever drama you have with my tribe please leave it out of the thread. (same goes for us >.>)

[furanku]

^_^ Wolf I have a feeling you are going to get flamed. Hard.

[Haunt]

I agree with wolf.

[Armand]

The 18th was scheduled as the official launch. Those of us who were organized and ready to go then should not be shafted either.

The Dev team acknowledged their failings and offered compensation through this measure.

[KeithStone]

I agree with this too.

[wolfmoonstrike]

The 18th was scheduled as the official launch. Those of us who were organized and ready to go then should not be shafted either.

The Dev team acknowledged their failings and offered compensation through this measure.
But what I'm saying is with all the lag and having to keep replacing your totem till it stuck OR was replaced by another. How was this fair? How do you know what was a LEGIT totem. Because I'm sure people will be saying "Well I placed it here why did this tribe get it?!" ect after the list goes out or the game launches again.

[Quatroux]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/Man_sitting_on_a_dead_horse_%281876_-_1884%29.jpg
This horse may have a bit of life left in it... we'll fix that.

[Armand]

But what I'm saying is with all the lag and having to keep replacing your totem till it stuck OR was replaced by another. How was this fair? How do you know what was a LEGIT totem. Because I'm sure people will be saying "Well I placed it here why did this tribe get it?!" ect after the list goes out or the game launches again.

If they can't confirm legitimacy of totems, then I agree with you. Those who were in their spots first and ready to plant totems should not be penalized.

I honestly can't say if they're able to sort this out.

[wolfmoonstrike]

This horse may have a bit of life left in it... we'll fix that.

Please don't troll. If you have an opposite view I welcome it but please put some thought behind it.

[Quatroux]

??? The first two responses to your post added a lot of value.
Perhaps you missed the last few days of posts, blogs, and youtube.
Are you really suprised by this announcement? Seriously? I'm not saying you won't get 20 pages of responses. What I am saying is that there's nothing new here.

[wolfmoonstrike]

??? The first two responses to your post added a lot of value.
Perhaps you missed the last few days of posts, blogs, and youtube.
Are you really suprised by this announcement? Seriously? I'm not saying you won't get 20 pages of responses. What I am saying is that there's nothing new here.

no last I checked those last few days was about a tribe cheating (whether they were or weren't I couldn't careless at this moment.)
and also the EXACT drama I didn't want brought here. Two tribes duking it out on the forums, while entertaining, isn't what I want in this thread. This has nothing to do with politics but with fairness.

Btw Armand I agree with you. If they can fully legitimize the totem placement then let them but otherwise complete wipe is needed.

[r4NGe]

Unless they have recovered 100% of the totem data, people are gonna get screwed.

[Doc]

Threre is no win-win solution about this. I guessed you figured it out by now. How about people that did place the totem on 18th and spent hours in trying? How is it fair that they have to run for landgrab...again?

[mgilbrtsn]

Threre is no win-win solution about this. I guessed you figured it out by now. How about people that did place the totem on 18th and spent hours in trying? How is it fair that they have to run for landgrab...again?

This. There is no good call. If a gun were placed to my head and I had to make a decision, I would vote for a complete wipe and let the land grab begin.

[wolfmoonstrike]

Threre is no win-win solution about this. I guessed you figured it out by now. How about people that did place the totem on 18th and spent hours in trying? How is it fair that they have to run for landgrab...again?

Will you sing this same tune if somehow your totem isn't legitimate and another tribe got the spot?

[JCatano]

I vote for a wipe, too. We even got the spot we wanted, but I don't really see them getting all of the information correct for every tribe that placed them (except Hopi, for sure).

Yes, I did it.

[mgilbrtsn]

I vote for a wipe, too. We even got the spot we wanted, but I don't really see them getting all of the information correct for every tribe that placed them (except Hopi, for sure).

Yes, I did it.
lol, don't get that started.

[wolfmoonstrike]

I vote for a wipe, too. We even got the spot we wanted, but I don't really see them getting all of the information correct for every tribe that placed them (except Hopi, for sure).

Yes, I did it.
Please man keep the drama out. I do not want it to devolve into that.

[Quatroux]

I agree that the forum banter has gotten to be too much. However, totem placement was at the core of recent debate. If we can return to civil discussion - great. I spent a crappy launch day trying to plant a totem and I'd hate for that time to be a waste. Running to the totem site countless times in huge lag was a hassel. I understand that some groups couldn't do it. This totem recovery may not even be possible. You'll have upset people no matter what they do. If they feel like they can restore totem they should give it a try.

[Doc]

Will you sing this same tune if somehow your totem isn't legitimate and another tribe got the spot?

Trolling your own thread?

Im not singing any "tune" if you havent noticed, i suggest you reread my post again.

[JCatano]

Please man keep the drama out. I do not want it to devolve into that.

Too late!

I laughed, but only a little. I should have put more effort into that jest.

[wolfmoonstrike]

How is it fair that they have to run for landgrab...again?

I assume you're talking about those that placed a totem and was legitimized. But what I'm saying is what if another totem was placed there and not your tribes? Even though you're sure you placed it. That was what I meant by singing the same tune. It was a phrase, I apologize not being more clear.

In other words if you weren't guaranteed that you wouldn't get your spot and another tribe did. Would you still be advocating for saved totems.

[kiwiitis]

Threre is no win-win solution about this. I guessed you figured it out by now. How about people that did place the totem on 18th and spent hours in trying? How is it fair that they have to run for landgrab...again?

Of course not everyone is going to be satisfied.

My opinion only.
AS the game is going to be RESTARTED on a new server it is only fair that no totems be saved.I could also say please start up at the same time as it was very nice time for me.I certainly will not go complaining whatever the new start time.

[r4NGe]

Threre is no win-win solution about this. I guessed you figured it out by now. How about people that did place the totem on 18th and spent hours in trying? How is it fair that they have to run for landgrab...again?

I understand and I was there for 7-10 hours doing the same thing. In the 3 totems we placed, due to overwrites, etc, we might even have a "saved" spot. But in one case, ours was overwritten by someone who came later. There were people placing multiple totems. I fail to see how it's fair to reserve spots without 100% data recovery.

I think it is worth sacrificing a few hours of our time to gaurantee fairness and a clean slate.

[woachaos]

Restoring anything seems bullshit to me.. The lag was horrible for anyone, many tried for hours and still didnt place a legit one. Others thought they placed and logged out as they were supposed to and then their tribe got screwed oder night. Srsly, there is noone that "earned" their position.

I know you cant satisfy everyone but a complete wipe is still more fair than some random restore..

[Doc]

I assume you're talking about those that placed a totem and was legitimized. But what I'm saying is what if another totem was placed there and not your tribes? Even though you're sure you placed it. That was what I meant by singing the same tune. It was a phrase, I apologize not being more clear.

In other words if you weren't guaranteed that you wouldn't get your spot and another tribe did. Would you still be advocating for saved totems.

What exactly am i advocating? Have i declared one should be done over the other? Please, dont presume things. Im 50-50 on it, as i said "no win-win solution". Means that anything that is decided - sucks.

[Sultan]

Restoring anything seems bullshit to me.. The lag was horrible for anyone, many tried for hours and still didnt place a legit one. Others thought they placed and logged out as they were supposed to and then their tribe got screwed oder night. Srsly, there is noone that "earned" their position.

I know you cant satisfy everyone but a complete wipe is still more fair than some random restore..

Agreed

[wolfmoonstrike]

What exactly am i advocating? Have i declared one should be done over the other? Please, dont presume things. Im 50-50 on it, as i said "no win-win solution". Means that anything that is decided - sucks.

I didn't realize I was presuming your stance I apologize. I should have taken it as a straight question.
Do I believe that those who did get saved totem should have to rerun for it again? Yes because, even though unfair either way, the lesser of two evils would be to wipe and start everybody on even ground.

[Mako_Jak]

I speak only for myself here. I am pro full wipe, no restored data. I'm of course torn, because I see both sides and I was there and made many runs to get it done that night, but I also have a major desire to see this game flourish for all involved.

[Bridger]

It's a definite no-win situation.

I understand the points being made on both sides, and I can see some merit in both. The question I still have - and it's not original, other people have already raised it - is; what about the people who showed up on the appointed day, in some cases making real-world sacrifices to do so, and expended a lot of effort to plant their totem in spite of all the frustration? How can it be fair if that counts for nothing?

It seems to me that if the recovered data from the day of The Great Land Grab unambiguously validates a claim to a site, the effort expended to claim that site demands that claim be honored. 'Well there's some confusion with regard to other sites,' isn't a legitimate reason to invalidate the claims that aren't ambiguous.

For the claims that are ambiguous... Well, that's where it's a no-win. If you grant the claim to one over the other, someone's going to be happy and someone's going to be mad. If you throw out both claims, two people are going to be mad.

At this point, I would say that if you've filed a claim to a plot of land and that claim is invalidated, the developers - who, let's be frank, caused this problem, albeit unintentionally - need to take some thought about a little compensation for the disappointed claimant.

[Quatroux]

I couldn't make many points better than Mako_Jak and Bridger. However, you might as well have thrown a poll up since everything posted on here is about feelings.

I wouldn't dare say that your opinions aren't valid. However, we knew this was how it was going to work. Therefore, this thread could be interpreted as an attempt to whitewash and repackage the nonsense from yesterday. Where's the upside? What's the end game? What do we stand to gain from this?

How about we wait for those problems to appear and work together to address and resolve them?

[Nephilim]

i like that he is doing as he said. if u had an issue u should of followed instructions to INSURE u had a legit totem. nuff said. i spent 12h the first day and had fun running back each lap of my treck 6 times. and even the days that followed.

and im not trying to bring any drama here but *seriously* why do u even care? ur not setting up were u have been all this time ur in a new area and unless u want to grief hopi or someone else why would u seriously care? u either followed the instructions following the head start fiasco and had guides legitiz ur totem or u dont care and u should still not care. i think Jordy is being more then fair and am honestly supprised he can figure out what is good and what is bad. im intrested in seeing how this all plays out in the end

[Bridger]

Right after I posted my last, a thought occured to me.

We know that the map is going to be expanding in the future. That being the case, I can envision future 'land rushes.' And that being the case, I wonder if there might not be a way to grant priority in the future to people whose claims are dismissed now.

I'm not sure how that priority would work, or if it's even possible. I onlyl offer it as a tentative suggestion because I hate to point out a problem without at least trying to offer a solution.

[Eremon]

what about the people who showed up on the appointed day, in some cases making real-world sacrifices to do so, and expended a lot of effort to plant their totem in spite of all the frustration? How can it be fair if that counts for nothing?


In addition to your remarks:

What about all the people who have signed onto the game AFTER the release on the 18th? Should they now be allowed to participate in a (fresh wipe) land rush?

[wolfmoonstrike]

It's a definite no-win situation.

I understand the points being made on both sides, and I can see some merit in both. The question I still have - and it's not original, other people have already raised it - is; what about the people who showed up on the appointed day, in some cases making real-world sacrifices to do so, and expended a lot of effort to plant their totem in spite of all the frustration? How can it be fair if that counts for nothing?

It seems to me that if the recovered data from the day of The Great Land Grab unambiguously validates a claim to a site, the effort expended to claim that site demands that claim be honored. 'Well there's some confusion with regard to other sites,' isn't a legitimate reason to invalidate the claims that aren't ambiguous.

For the claims that are ambiguous... Well, that's where it's a no-win. If you grant the claim to one over the other, someone's going to be happy and someone's going to be mad. If you throw out both claims, two people are going to be mad.

At this point, I would say that if you've filed a claim to a plot of land and that claim is invalidated, the developers - who, let's be frank, caused this problem, albeit unintentionally - need to take some thought about a little compensation for the disappointed claimant.

But see that in itself was/is the problem. What about those same tribes that spent countless hours to trying to gain a spot but was unable to, even after placing multiple totems down? Is it fair that those same tribes not get the spot they where they did indeed place a totem? Believe it or not, I'm advocating for the tribes that went through those frustrations but may not have gotten their ideal spot DUE TO LAG. If the lag was that bad, then no totem should be legit and we should just wipe.

Btw your thoughts of "those who get screwed now should get a chance later to pick a new spot out of the expanded lands" is an interesting compromise now but will lead to problems at that time. In fact it will basically be this same argument.

edited last bit for better clarity.

[Eremon]

If the lag was that bad, then no totem should be legit and we should just wipe.


And everyone who subscribed to the game after 3:00pm PST on Feb 18th should not have game access until 3 hours after the new restart. They weren't there at the beginning, they shouldn't be there intially at the re-start.

[wolfmoonstrike]

And everyone who subscribed to the game after 3:00pm PST on Feb 18th should not have game access until 3 hours after the new restart. They weren't there at the beginning, they shouldn't be there intially at the re-start.

I think 1 hour is more fair because by then everybody had chance to get there spot.

EDIT:

But as a thought these last few days has been wipe after wipe after wipe. So though they weren't there for the first launch they should get some sort of chance since they spent the same 40 bucks for a pre-released game as everybody else. Still if they added a small timer till they could play I would find it fair non-the-less.

[Eremon]

I think 1 hour is more fair because by then everybody had chance to get there spot.

You're assuming there's going to be a flawless re-start. Not sure I would place money on that.

[alyvia]

But see that in itself was/is the problem. What about those same tribes that spent countless hours to trying to gain a spot but was unable to, even after placing multiple totems down? Is it fair that those same tribes not get the spot they where they did indeed place a totem? Believe it or not, I'm advocating for the tribes that went through those frustrations but may not have gotten their ideal spot DUE TO LAG. If the lag was that bad, then no totem should be legit and we should just wipe.


Did those people follow the instructions given from that day to contact the guides? If so, then yes they should too.

[sionide]

I like this. And the tribe I am in got our spot, so I am unbiased.

Tbh, there are tons of good spots, so tribes should really have backup locations if their first choice is gone.

* Edit *

"This" being people who registered before the 18th having a few hours before those who bought the game later, to be able to drop their totem upon the new release.

[Tehralph]

Im not going to read through all the posts, but I am going to throw my 2 cents in. Im not going to be here for the new-pre-launch. I will be away for basic training. I have 6 accounts, and most of them were on repeatedly making totems on the 18th with my guild. Why would it be fair if me, and my tribe has to landgrab AGAIN on a day many of us might not even be available.

Your argument is so one sided. My diagnosis, you didnt get the spot you wanted on the 18th and now youre crying for a second chance.

[wolfmoonstrike]

Im not going to read through all the posts, but I am going to throw my 2 cents in. Im not going to be here for the new-pre-launch. I will be away for basic training. I have 6 accounts, and most of them were on repeatedly making totems on the 18th with my guild. Why would it be fair if me, and my tribe has to landgrab AGAIN on a day many of us might not even be available.

Your argument is so one sided. My diagnosis, you didnt get the spot you wanted on the 18th and now youre crying for a second chance.

You do bring up a good point ralph. Its not fair for you but since you're going into the military (btw kudos for that) and will be away for awhile regardless.

But if you're unable to be here that is a doozy and I don't have a counterpoint to it right now. I agree would be terribly unfair. Though I could ask what about those who were away on the 18th? Was it fair to them? If you think like that, the point is moot. Because not everybody can be places on certain dates.

Btw about my argument being one sided, I concur. I'm voting for a full wipe there is no two ways about it, so yes very one sided but non-the-less I believe it to be a valid argument.

[Tehralph]

You do bring up a good point ralph. Its not fair for you but since you're going into the military (btw kudos for that) and will be away for awhile regardless.

But if you're unable to be here that is a doozy and I don't have a counterpoint to it right now. I agree would be terribly unfair. Though I could ask what about those who were away on the 18th? Was it fair to them? If you think like that, the point is moot. Because not everybody can be places on certain dates.

Btw about my argument being one sided, I concur. I'm voting for a full wipe there is no two ways about it, so yes very one sided but non-the-less I believe it to be a valid argument.

But for the 18th people had a lot more notice than a week. Originally it was the 14th, but it was delayed, so it actually gave guilds more time to gather their people. We were promised pre-launch on the 18th, and on the 18th people were told to contact Guides regarding their totem. Through the lag, and crashes, many people got their totem down. Its the least they can do to help those people who went the extra mile to place their totem, when other people had just given up.

[Mystais]

It seems obvious to me that those that do not want the totems saved are those that wish to take someone else's legitimate spot.

And those that want them saved are those that painfully went through all the lag and roll backs to acquire their spot fairly.

You cannot blame these tribes for not replacing their totem after every wipe we have had since that time... especially after being told that they would have their location saved as compensation for the trouble they went through to place it the first time.

[RedMizt]

My first day here, in the forums, as well as, the game. Seems to me, that if the land-grab was well advertised, which seems to be the case. Then the only ones who would seek a complete wipe, would be those who did not get the site they wanted. How is that remotely fair, to all those who listened and then implemented a course of action to get the spot they wanted most?

Perhaps less time whining in the forums and more time in game doing what needs to be done is the proper approach.

[Eremon]

It seems obvious to me that those that do not want the totems saved are those that wish to take someone else's spot.

And those that want them saved are those that legitimately went through all the lag and roll backs to acquire their spot fairly.

You cannot blame these tribes for not replacing their totem after every wipe we have had since that time... especially after being told that they would have their location saved as compensation for the trouble they went through to place it the first time.

Exactly. And you can be sure that everyone who has subscribed to the game since the initial totem placements are going to be voting for a complete wipe and "do-over" land rush.

[wolfmoonstrike]

It seems obvious to me that those that do not want the totems saved are those that wish to take someone else's spot.

And those that want them saved are those that legitimately went through all the lag and roll backs to acquire their spot fairly.

You cannot blame these tribes for not replacing their totem after every wipe we have had since that time... especially after being told that they would have their location saved as compensation for the trouble they went through to place it the first time.

Like I said from the beginning I do not want any of the drama over the last couple days in this thread and infact it has nothing to do with trying to take another person's/tribes spot but about equal footing. The last few days have not been a pre-launch but a beta. And what happens after every beta? You wipe for the real game. Yes it sucks but its fair. Should we restore weapons, tools, and buildings too?

I know for a fact that I have no wish to take another persons camp. I don't want to grief anybody. I just want to play a game with equal footing.

[Mako_Jak]

It seems obvious to me that those that do not want the totems saved are those that wish to take someone else's legitimate spot.

And those that want them saved are those that painfully went through all the lag and roll backs to acquire their spot fairly.

You cannot blame these tribes for not replacing their totem after every wipe we have had since that time... especially after being told that they would have their location saved as compensation for the trouble they went through to place it the first time.

Although you are very likely correct when it comes to the majority of the votes, I can assure you that it's not the case for every voter. I was there the moment the server came up, I ran and made it to the camp over and over and over, for hours. I was there when our totem was placed, and I was there afterwords as well. And I still feel that a wipe without restoring anything is in the best interest of this game. I also understand that this is just my opinion, and I am aware that many others feel differently. Ultimately it's Jooky's decision, and I support it either way... it is what it is.

[wolfmoonstrike]

Ultimately it's Jooky's decision, and I support it either way... it is what it is.

I do agree with this as well. Even if in the end he decides he's still going through with saved totems. I will continue to play this game. I just wanted to state my opinion and get the opinion of others (with hopefully no pre biased due to who I belong to.). I'm very glad there is game out there like this in mostly working order and I hope this game will grow big. Even my girlfriend is getting a copy in a few hours (currently testing her comp for playability lol.)

And for those who don't know my stance by now.... full wipe nothing saved.

[Bridger]

Ultimately it's Jooky's decision, and I support it either way... it is what it is.

I also agree with this.

My position is: if the land claim (totem) can be validated with data available from the 18th, then reward the effort it took to establish that claim and then follow directions and have it confirmed. For the disputed claims that can't be validated, find some form of compensation.

[Metsuro]

I do agree with this as well. Even if in the end he decides he's still going through with saved totems. I will continue to play this game. I just wanted to state my opinion and get the opinion of others (with hopefully no pre biased due to who I belong to.). I'm very glad there is game out there like this in mostly working order and I hope this game will grow big. Even my girlfriend is getting a copy in a few hours (currently testing her comp for playability lol.)

And for those who don't know my stance by now.... full wipe nothing saved.

I played for a straight 24 hours from launch, rerolling my character 13+ times. Waiting for 7 hours to make sure our spot remained ours till the totem finally broke. Than placed a homestead on our spot and waited for my group to wake up again so we could reform and reclaim.

The 18th was suppose to be the launch there are no wipes after you launch. They should be just deleting the broken totems and tribes and thats it. But they arn't.

Why do you think its fair for me who dealt with the lag, the rollbacks and the problems for a 24 hour period to lose my spot to you because you want it didn't get to claim my spot?

This is the only reason you feel cheated you didn't stick it out and someone else got your land. I'm sorry please deal with it. First come first serve, get mad at those who were dropping 7 totems and causing the issues. Those players are your problem not me.

[galagah]

How is this fair? I mean during the 18th Pre-Launch lag who's to say any totem was legit. From what I understand some totems had to be placed a multitude of times before they stuck or were overwritten by another tribe. Also what about the tribes you didn't recover their data but they did place a totem? Because there is always a chance you missed something.

So really all I'm calling for is a complete wipe and give everybody a fair chance to get their land. I honestly believe that no place should be saved and we all run for our spots on the day of the new Pre-Launch.

Also what about the new people who did technically did preorder your game? Should these people get shafted?



Completely agree with this , if your doing a final wipe , it should be a completely clean slate with no totem spots saved for anyone .

I myself got a Homestead down despite all the lag etc , and it even stuck for a few crashes until it finally vanished . Now i've no idea if that saved to the database or not , and tbh i don't really care either way .

Make it fair for all , newcomers and old alike.



I played for a straight 24 hours from launch, rerolling my character 13+ times. Waiting for 7 hours to make sure our spot remained ours till the totem finally broke. Than placed a homestead on our spot and waited for my group to wake up again so we could reform and reclaim.

Why do you think its fair for me who dealt with the lag, the rollbacks and the problems for a 24 hour period to lose my spot to you because you want it didn't get to claim my spot?

This is the only reason you feel cheated you didn't stick it out and someone else got your land. I'm sorry please deal with it. First come first serve, get mad at those who were dropping 7 totems and causing the issues. Those players are your problem not me.

What makes you so special ?

There are plenty who played / tried to play continuously through the lag to get a spot , myself included .
At the end of the day , that launch failed ... so tell me ... how is it fair to those who " Could NOT " get connected because of lag / server problems ?

The only "Fair " way is to have a fresh launch with no saved data used and a clean field for everyone .

[river111]

You guys are like 5 days behind on this one sheesh. I been saying this since the 18th. Even made a thread back 5 days ago here about concerns on the wipe.

http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/3798-The-Pending-Doom

Oh well, guess I didnt create that one with enough friction to catch on. I need to learn to troll better, hey Tommy you take students?? :)

[wolfmoonstrike]

I played for a straight 24 hours from launch, rerolling my character 13+ times. Waiting for 7 hours to make sure our spot remained ours till the totem finally broke. Than placed a homestead on our spot and waited for my group to wake up again so we could reform and reclaim.

The 18th was suppose to be the launch there are no wipes after you launch. They should be just deleting the broken totems and tribes and thats it. But they arn't.

Why do you think its fair for me who dealt with the lag, the rollbacks and the problems for a 24 hour period to lose my spot to you because you want it didn't get to claim my spot?

This is the only reason you feel cheated you didn't stick it out and someone else got your land. I'm sorry please deal with it. First come first serve, get mad at those who were dropping 7 totems and causing the issues. Those players are your problem not me.

What about those same exact people who did do that and did stick it out? Are they ALL really guaranteed spots? Is that really truly possible? Should people really HAVE to play 24hrs straight to have a saved totem spot? What about RL? Is this truly and completely fair? I'm sure many were only expecting the land grab to be a 1hr affair at most which for some turned into huge huge things. What about all those with families? What about those with jobs? Even if you do have a job/family you were probably lucky enough to schedule for this big event some people aren't so lucky....should they be shafted this bad?

[wolfmoonstrike]

@river111
I do like your idea if they do a full wipe. The only problems I have with it is some will be unhappy having to gear for PvP. Though I think this is still the fairest especially in the Beginning. I really, really like your idea the more I think about it lol. You mind copy and pasting it in this thread for those too lazy to click a link?

[STAR_GOD]

YOU GUYS DONT GET ONE POINT! THIS IS BETA WHERE HAVE U SEEN ANY MMO TO BE RELEASED WITHOUT WIPE! I MEAN WTF! IF GAME GETS RELEASED NEXT WEEK THEN WE NEED WIPE AND PUT STOP TO THIS NONSENSE.. i reall dont understand why admin keeps pushing his theory that leting people keep totems from beta stage this dont make sense!

People will be alot happyer if there is fresh wipe and everyone gets fair chance! Otherwise support will get spammed with people saying that i had totem there why is it not there anymore....

[JCatano]

YOU GUYS DONT GET ONE POINT! THIS IS BETA WHERE HAVE U SEEN ANY MMO TO BE RELEASED WITHOUT WIPE! I MEAN WTF! IF GAME GETS RELEASED NEXT WEEK THEN WE NEED WIPE AND PUT STOP TO THIS NONSENSE.. i reall dont understand why admin keeps pushing his theory that leting people keep totems from beta stage this dont make sense!

People will be alot happyer if there is fresh wipe and everyone gets fair chance! Otherwise support will get spammed with people saying that i had totem there why is it not there anymore....

Anyone who buys the game can start right at this moment. There is no release of sales. Not necessarily a normal release.

[dizietsma]

YOU GUYS DONT GET ONE POINT! THIS IS BETA WHERE HAVE U SEEN ANY MMO TO BE RELEASED WITHOUT WIPE! I MEAN WTF! IF GAME GETS RELEASED NEXT WEEK THEN WE NEED WIPE AND PUT STOP TO THIS NONSENSE.. i reall dont understand why admin keeps pushing his theory that leting people keep totems from beta stage this dont make sense!

I seem to remember seeing a post of yours which contained an Email you had sent to Xsyon asking him to reserve your tribe totem for launch, I cannot help but think you would be posting something different if he had replied yes, but never mind.

Personally, I think it should be a full wipe, completely fresh start, even though some Tribes did manage to get in, rough it through the lag and place totems.
As long as everyone knows when the wipe will take place, and the server is available for everyone to log on and get in at a reasonable time, then it is all fair game.

[STAR_GOD]

I seem to remember seeing a post of yours which contained an Email you had sent to Xsyon asking him to reserve your tribe totem for launch, I cannot help but think you would be posting something different if he had replied yes, but never mind.

Personally, I think it should be a full wipe, completely fresh start, even though some Tribes did manage to get in, rough it through the lag and place totems.
As long as everyone knows when the wipe will take place, and the server is available for everyone to log on and get in at a reasonable time, then it is all fair game.

I was not asking it was more of enquiry since there was talk in game and in our tribe about it... I am sure other people enquired too ;-)

Point is the same its Beta and everything should be wiped just as you agree... If things dont get wiped it will cause flames on forums and support will get too many complains they are already overloaded with mails I am sure... ^^

[jokhul]

I was not asking it was more of enquiry since there was talk in game and in our tribe about it... I am sure other people enquired too ;-)

Point is the same its Beta and everything should be wiped just as you agree... If things dont get wiped it will cause flames on forums and support will get too many complains they are already overloaded with mails I am sure... ^^

So you were trying to get a spot reserved for your tribe before launch ?



<snip>

Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2011 3:27 PM
To: support@notorious-games.com
Subject: question



There has been some talk in our tribe and question poped up are we able to reserve spot for prelude launch on 18th.. I contacted guide but he wasnt sure so he told me to mail you. We have tribe of 20 members Pandemic tribe..

And if we can what is way of doing it

Thank you very much in advance

Please get back to me

STAR_GOD (your favorite forum poster)

And then at launch your 20 man guild couldn't get your spot either ?

That sux man, but no worries, maybe third time lucky ? ;)

[Bridger]

One point; at the time, the 18th was the beginning of head-start. Circumstance forced a re-examination of that. So be it. 'Stuff' happens. Still, as far as we knew on the 18th, this was 'for real.' People were operating with that expectation. So yes - it's back to beta now. But for a brief moment on the 18th, it wasn't.

So while to say, 'It's beta! You should be expecting wipes!' is usually correct, this is a unique situation and that generalization doesn't really fit. At least not in my opinion.

[Tehralph]

One point; at the time, the 18th was the beginning of head-start. Circumstance forced a re-examination of that. So be it. 'Stuff' happens. Still, as far as we knew on the 18th, this was 'for real.' People were operating with that expectation. So yes - it's back to beta now. But for a brief moment on the 18th, it wasn't.

So while to say, 'It's beta! You should be expecting wipes!' is usually correct, this is a unique situation and that generalization doesn't really fit. At least not in my opinion.
Yeah! You stick it to the man, in a calm, collective and sensible post!

[wolfmoonstrike]

One point; at the time, the 18th was the beginning of head-start. Circumstance forced a re-examination of that. So be it. 'Stuff' happens. Still, as far as we knew on the 18th, this was 'for real.' People were operating with that expectation. So yes - it's back to beta now. But for a brief moment on the 18th, it wasn't.

So while to say, 'It's beta! You should be expecting wipes!' is usually correct, this is a unique situation and that generalization doesn't really fit. At least not in my opinion.

Fair enough, at that moment in time it wasn't considered a beta. It sucks but how about a different way to compensate for lost time? Saving land even if it was placed during legitimate time but before a wipe seems kinda like a cheat to me and an unfair advantage. What about instead, to compensate those who registered before the 18th, get a month free added to there time? Then it is not on a tribe basis but on a personal level and everybody who deserves to get something does.

[Bridger]

I'm certainly not opposed to this alternative on principle. Let's see what the proposed compensation is and then I'll be happy to discuss it.

I proposed elsewhere that people who get a claim denied this time be offered some kind of priority on future new lands when they open. That would be another way to compensate - in a 'kind for kind' way.

[STAR_GOD]

I'm certainly not opposed to this alternative on principle. Let's see what the proposed compensation is and then I'll be happy to discuss it.

I proposed elsewhere that people who get a claim denied this time be offered some kind of priority on future new lands when they open. That would be another way to compensate - in a 'kind for kind' way.

You are just complicating things even further.... admins can keep promise of two week prelaunch you think they gona give u priorities on new land ^^... Seriously all it takes is one wipe to fix all this and i really dont get it why admins keep persisting to save totems that got placed

[wolfmoonstrike]

I'm certainly not opposed to this alternative on principle. Let's see what the proposed compensation is and then I'll be happy to discuss it.

I proposed elsewhere that people who get a claim denied this time be offered some kind of priority on future new lands when they open. That would be another way to compensate - in a 'kind for kind' way.

Only problem I forsee with new lands giving is you will have this same argument then from other players. If you wipe now I think you would have a lot less bitching.

[Bridger]

You are just complicating things even further.... admins can keep promise of two week prelaunch you think they gona give u priorities on new land ^^...

If the developers can't handle something that seems fairly straightforward with as much lead-time as they need - they can put the promised compensation into place once they're satisfied it will work as intended - then perhaps this game doesn't have so much of a future after all.

But I'm fairly confident they could make it work if they decided it was something they wanted to do and set their minds to it.


Seriously all it takes is one wipe to fix all this and i really dont get it why admins keep persisting to save totems that got placed

Perhaps they have a different vision than yours for what they want to happen ?

[Bridger]

If you wipe now I think you would have a lot less bitching.

Respectfully - I don't think the poll results on this question support that assumption.

[STAR_GOD]

If the developers can't handle something that seems fairly straightforward with as much lead-time as they need - they can put the promised compensation into place once they're satisfied it will work as intended - then perhaps this game doesn't have so much of a future after all.

But I'm fairly confident they could make it work if they decided it was something they wanted to do and set their minds to it.

Perhaps they have a different vision than yours for what they want to happen ?

whats it to do with vision?

[Bridger]

"I really don't see why admins keep persisting to save the totems that got placed."

"Perhaps they have a different vision than yours for what they want to have happen and that's why they're 'persisting'."

[ButtaRock]

honestly a total wipe is the logical way to go.. it was a server cluster fuk that day & should not be set in stone..

[Quatroux]

WAIT!!! We're migrating to yet another thread on this topic.