I just thought of something potentially terrible

[ColonelTEE3]

Please - please correct me if im wrong, because i really hope im wrong in understanding this:

1 ) homesteads and tribes can be placed ON TOP of junk piles
2 ) homesteads and tribes can choose to be "peaceful", as in, they can't be raided in their own tribeland/homestead,
3 ) when inside your own tribeland homestead, if you are peaceful, you can't be killed, but you can kill outsiders

Conclusion: what is stopping everyone from claiming ALL junkpiles with their totems, choosing to be "peaceful", and not ever being contested for their resources?

And this leads me to another question -- if clans and tribes split up their tribes into subtribes -- what is stopping them from having "peaceful" subdivisions that claim junkpiles, store up resources, and then give them/ sell them to their parent tribe that is conquest/war oriented, without them ever being at risk of losing control of their junkpiles?

Does this seem like an EXTREMELY broken system to anyone else? Or did i just straight up miss something

[wolfmoonstrike]

Please - please correct me if im wrong, because i really hope im wrong in understanding this:

1 ) homesteads and tribes can be placed ON TOP of junk piles
2 ) homesteads and tribes can choose to be "peaceful", as in, they can't be raided in their own tribeland/homestead,
3 ) when inside your own tribeland homestead, if you are peaceful, you can't be killed, but you can kill outsiders

Conclusion: what is stopping everyone from claiming ALL junkpiles with their totems, choosing to be "peaceful", and not ever being contested for their resources?

And this leads me to another question -- if clans and tribes split up their tribes into subtribes -- what is stopping them from having "peaceful" subdivisions that claim junkpiles, store up resources, and then give them/ sell them to their parent tribe that is conquest/war oriented, without them ever being at risk of losing control of their junkpiles?

Does this seem like an EXTREMELY broken system to anyone else? Or did i just straight up miss something

And now you've started an argument that has long been fought...over....and over....and over again lol.

But I totally agree with you for the most part. Especially the peaceful sub division thing.

EDIT:

one more thing, junk piles are a non-renewable resource.

[Zarin]

Not sure, but I think that the peaceful and evil system will be decided by actions and not the original alignment chosen.

If not, I hope they make it this way.

[Soulwanderer]

Please - please correct me if im wrong, because i really hope im wrong in understanding this:

1 ) homesteads and tribes can be placed ON TOP of junk piles
2 ) homesteads and tribes can choose to be "peaceful", as in, they can't be raided in their own tribeland/homestead,
3 ) when inside your own tribeland homestead, if you are peaceful, you can't be killed, but you can kill outsiders

Conclusion: what is stopping everyone from claiming ALL junkpiles with their totems, choosing to be "peaceful", and not ever being contested for their resources?

And this leads me to another question -- if clans and tribes split up their tribes into subtribes -- what is stopping them from having "peaceful" subdivisions that claim junkpiles, store up resources, and then give them/ sell them to their parent tribe that is conquest/war oriented, without them ever being at risk of losing control of their junkpiles?

Does this seem like an EXTREMELY broken system to anyone else? Or did i just straight up miss something

Just one of the many reasons that tribal warfare is important and not having it require consent is the way to go.

[KeithStone]

yup, it's been argued many times.

It's a resource driven game where tribes can choose to hog the resources without any repercussions.

[pendergraft]

Building on or directly adjacent to a junk pile should come with a hefty penalty. Like cancer.

[MeTaylorMe]

Junk Piles will run out of resources shortly after launch. And the fact of tribes eventually going PvP is inevitable, unless they never defend themselves. Once a tribe is flagged as "evil" or whatever they will not be able to turn that off, and that is decided by your actions in the game. GL if you are on a junk pile...

[ifireallymust]

I'll be glad not to be able to build on junk if tribes can't fence them. But I doubt anyone else will like that idea. I will be so happy when other resources for major crafting are available besides those ugly junk piles!

[mrcalhou]

What I imagine is:
- Tribes choosing to become warring on non-warring, not as an on / off switch but as a permanent or difficult to reverse decision, likely based on tribal actions.
- Warring tribes would be able to conquer and raid others, but they will also become susceptible to war. Non warring tribes would keep their area safe, but don’t gain the ability to raid or conquer other tribes.
- Both warring and non-warring tribes could claim resources that would be up for contest by both types of tribes.
- Some expansion zones being open to more conquest without safe zones, while in others tribes would retain the choice to war or not.

I'm not particularly a fan of the first two points. I personally find them silly. But the last two points give me hope that they will actually flesh the system out in a way that makes sense for gameplay purposes.

From a gameplay balance perspective, I see no reason why the game should be either FFA-PvP everywhere, or why people would be able to decide where to place a safezone. The former drives away people that would otherwise play the game and the latter is too exploitible. A good balance is to have a large area dedicated as a safezone and another large area dedicated to PvP conquest where players could be unrestricted in terms of killing and building. Then, the devs should place different resources, monsters, events, etc in each area to encourage players to play in both, encourage trade, encourage crafting (through the destruction of equipment), and encourage transportation of goods.

This type of system gets around some of the more worrisome exploits and over-sights whilst still encouraging players to play in the manner that most befits their personalities and goals.

[tredo]

I'm not particularly a fan of the first two points. I personally find them silly. But the last two points give me hope that they will actually flesh the system out in a way that makes sense for gameplay purposes.

From a gameplay balance perspective, I see no reason why the game should be either FFA-PvP everywhere, or why people would be able to decide where to place a safezone. The former drives away people that would otherwise play the game and the latter is too exploitible. A good balance is to have a large area dedicated as a safezone and another large area dedicated to PvP conquest where players could be unrestricted in terms of killing and building. Then, the devs should place different resources, monsters, events, etc in each area to encourage players to play in both, encourage trade, encourage crafting (through the destruction of equipment), and encourage transportation of goods.

This type of system gets around some of the more worrisome exploits and over-sights whilst still encouraging players to play in the manner that most befits their personalities and goals.

+1

[darg75]

I reckon that if what the OP suggests occurs (and no reason it can't/won't happen that I see) then we'll just have to find a way to cope until such time as the developers solve the issue for us (via releasing other resources, placing more junkpiles, changing the safe zone system, releasing more land from the green mist).

At the centre of all of this I believe that the developers don't want us playing a broken game. They'll find a way to fix it, then we'll find a way to break it again.

[Charles_Prince]

Building on or directly adjacent to a junk pile should come with a hefty penalty. Like cancer.

Hefty indeed.

[Tandarie]

Junk Piles will run out of resources shortly after launch. And the fact of tribes eventually going PvP is inevitable, unless they never defend themselves. Once a tribe is flagged as "evil" or whatever they will not be able to turn that off, and that is decided by your actions in the game. GL if you are on a junk pile...


Good thing then he will be unveiling *The Mist* and there are plenty of new junk piles in the new areas.

[yoori]

It shouldn't be a problem unless scrap piles will stay as a main source of resources. Once we have mines and we can produce what we need and not rely on what we find, scrap should be left for new and very small tribes. If mines or other resources cannot be claimed with main totem problem is somewhat solved.

There's one more thing, once comfort is enabled we'll need buildings(houses) to keep it high, comfort will affect all skills. Placing totem on a scrap pile will seriously limit building area(I guess you can still do it with homestead).

As far as I know there will be no safezones after Prelude Jooky haven't said there staying, he said that main lands will be safe from conquest, not from PvP.


It is a problem in Prelude, but we don't have a way to conquer other tribes anyway and dropping safezones would be worse IMO.

[jumpshot]

Conclusion: what is stopping everyone from claiming ALL junkpiles with their totems,


I tried to drop a totem that covered all the junk piles in game, but it just wasn't large enough.

[ac1dtrip]

Sorry I must be a noob but I can't find this information about not being able to place homesteads on junkpiles thanks again if you can show me where this is said.

[Kroom]

If a totem is placed on a junk pile and no one else is around to scavenge it, is it a depleted resource?

[ColonelTEE3]

I tried to drop a totem that covered all the junk piles in game, but it just wasn't large enough.

If junkpiles weren't deplete-able, your sarcasm would be funny.


If a totem is placed on a junk pile and no one else is around to scavenge it, is it a depleted resource?

Again, same point. Limited resources means, at some point or another, these tribes are effectively one-upping everyone else with the resources they will be hording that, at some point or another, won't be available. They should at the very least be vulnerable to raids, peace tribe or not.

OR, a better solution IMO ; if your tribe's land radius encompasses ANY fragment or section of a junkpile, then your tribe land is no longer a safezone, even if you declare your tribe a "peace" tribe. This wouldn't solve the problem of tribes setting up camp right next to junkpiles but at least they are a little bit at risk when they go scavenging, just like the rest of us.

[Bear5732]

In the limited two weeks that I have been playing - this has not been a problem or an issue -basically because there is a lot of junk, lots of lots of it in and near the mist. Not even sure if everyone on server split into homesteads, they would be able to cover all the junk. Only very large tribes will have a chance to take over a junk pile, and even then nothing stops you from gathering resources there except for fear of being attacked by that tribe.

But there is plenty of junk. At least for now...

[kaisergod]

In the limited two weeks that I have been playing - this has not been a problem or an issue -basically because there is a lot of junk, lots of lots of it in and near the mist. Not even sure if everyone on server split into homesteads, they would be able to cover all the junk. Only very large tribes will have a chance to take over a junk pile, and even then nothing stops you from gathering resources there except for fear of being attacked by that tribe.

But there is plenty of junk. At least for now...

Thats because nowher enear the full population is playing, in fact entire tribes are not playing right now because of the repeated wipes an dthe upcoming final wipe making anything you do in game right now pretty pointless. Once the final wipe is done and the server goes live, those junk piles are going to be hard to get ahold of.

[Viper66]

Important thing that is being missed all the time is... i can be on 24/7 most of you can't ... end of protection of your junk pile...

[Bear5732]

Thats because nowher enear the full population is playing, in fact entire tribes are not playing right now because of the repeated wipes an dthe upcoming final wipe making anything you do in game right now pretty pointless. Once the final wipe is done and the server goes live, those junk piles are going to be hard to get ahold of.

Even with 4x the population, I still don't see this as an issue - But since only the DEVS know the actual population, it will be impossible to know until launch. And there are practically 15+ zones of mist and junk that contain only a few homesteads.