Pre-order weapons still too powerful

[jemmus]

This has been discussed before, but I think it's still a game design issue that needs some attention. I love my pre-order Pillager axe, but…. these things are just too much, compared to what can be made in-game. A tribemate and I did a test of my pre-order vs. a Master Quality Manaba axe. The MAQ axe did only 2/3rds the damage of the pre-order.

To put that in perspective:
-We’re talking about an MAQ axe here. Not a High Q or Very High Q.
-To have a chance of crafting an MAQ weapon, the player has to be in the area of 99 Weaponcraft skill. Close to maxed out in that skill, in other words.
-The player also has to use Master level materials. Off hand I don’t recall the exact materials needed for a Manaba axe, let’s just say: an MAQ handle (requiring 99 Woodcrafting), MAQ leather strap (99 Leathercrafting), MAQ screws and feathers (99 Scavenging). In other words, the item requires materials that come from maxed out skills in four different skill areas. To make one, you (or some trading partners) have to reached the game's very end goal in each skill area.

But, with all this, the Master level axe only does 2/3rds the damage of a pre-order. All other things being equal, with your Master axe you land 3 hits on the other guy for every every 2 times he hits you.

So the bottom line is, you can work your way to the very top of every crafting skill in the game, but you’ll still never produce something equal to a pre-order. And because pre-orders are soulbound, you’ll never be able to obtain one either (by trading or looting). IMO something needs to be done to balance pre-orders with player-craftable weapons. They kind of wreck the incentive to excel in the game and work your way to Master-level crafting skills. Thoughts?

[Vandal]

Meh... they don't need to solve that problem, it will solve itself.
Eventually there will be weapons making more damage than the PO weapons and everyone will forget it ever happened.

[unclean666]

I used to think they needed to go but your post just gave me the drive to make a better weapon but why do people talk about master Q like it ends there?

[MrDDT]

At the best it will be = to supreme. But why would I want to use a supreme ultra rare weapon when I can have this other one that never decays, never leaves me and does the same damage and speed?

This is assuming it will be even equal which I dont think it will.
Vandal I have no idea how you think it will solve itself. Can you please explain that?
Where do you get the idea that there will be more better weapons? Also how is that solving itself?

No PO weapons do way to much end of story. They are already way overpowered due to the fact that they never decay and cant be dropped or looted.


Also OP, you forgot master QL thread, and leather scrap to make the leather strap. Which means 99 tailoring.

[xyberviri]

TBH by the time they start getting the boat turned around all the players with PO weapons will be pretty limited.

[unclean666]

they are powerfull but its the fact that they never decay is what will be the problem.and you dont need all those skills on one person thats what your tribes for that guy does leather he makes the supreme straps that guy is a tool crafter he makes the supreme tools ect. But you can do it your self I just start back on weps this morning at 81 atm all the rest I pretty much have checked off.
Give me a couple of days.

[jemmus]

I think there are a few simple ways they could fix the imbalance:
-Add item decay to POs. Pre-order people get the super benefit for a while, but not forever.
-Make them tradeable or droppable. People who didn't get a PO still have a chance to get one, if they really want it.
-Add some more POs to the game. Prizes as guide events, extremely rare scavenge item. Whatever, but get people a shot at getting one. But the chance of getting one would need to balance somehow with the huge amount of work needed to ever be able to craft a Master or Supreme weapon.
-Lower POs' damage down to something comparable to weapons players can craft.
But again, the concern is that people need an make the ultra best weapons in the game. With POs the way they are now, that's not even possible.

[soulless]

this has been mentioned in other threads, we have been told they are looking into this, but they are still way over powered... so i think it does need to be mentioned again.

My main problem with them is the damage. They are preoder, and im glad this is the first game that made preoders worth somthing. but lets face it, in this setting, a weapon that is not lootable, and does not decay is already a huge advantage over any weapon out there. but to also make its damage over the top is just to much imo. even if the damage was the lowest out there, it would still be an invaluable weapon.

[xyberviri]

I think there are a few simple ways they could fix the imbalance:
-Add item decay to POs. Pre-order people get the super benefit for a while, but not forever.
-Make them tradeable or droppable. People who didn't get a PO still have a chance to get one, if they really want it.
-Add some more POs to the game. Prizes as guide events, extremely rare scavenge item. Whatever, but get people a shot at getting one. But the chance of getting one would need to balance somehow with the huge amount of work needed to ever be able to craft a Master or Supreme weapon.
-Lower POs' damage down to something comparable to weapons players can craft.
But again, the concern is that people need an make the ultra best weapons in the game. With POs the way they are now, that's not even possible.

uhm, maybe those people should have preordered the game......... you know...... preorder weapon...... tends to mean you got it because you uhm, ah nah..... pre ordered...

Also if it ever becomes so that they are Tradeable then ill just borrow a buddies account and reroll 100 of them and toss them in a back pack, So will every other player that has access to one....

[unclean666]

Soon we will be making better armor and better weapons.We just need a few more tools in our belt to do it and they are working on those now.But if they said that they want to add decay to my PO thats fine with me I had my fun with it and ready to move on.Plus i dont want to carry this thing around forever.

[MrDDT]

Soon we will be making better armor and better weapons.We just need a few more tools in our belt to do it and they are working on those now.But if they said that they want to add decay to my PO thats fine with me I had my fun with it and ready to move on.Plus i dont want to carry this thing around forever.

How do you figure you will be making better weapons? At the BEST you can do it will be only equal.


IMO the best options are
1) Put them with decay (even a long decay is fine)
2) Nerf damage and make them just a status item.
3) Fix damage on other weapons they are much better.

Out of the 3 fixes, #1 is best IMO.

[Vandal]

Alright... Let's me put some common sense in this topic.

Pre Order: Some games give bonus items when people pre order it. What would it look like if 2-3 months after the release, the devs go like "So sorry bros, we are gonna mess up our previous deal and just delete whatever we gave you...".
No, that's not going to happen.

Now another thing.
Why are you guys even complaining about the PO weapons, when right now, combat are so ridiculous, that an army of people couldn't even take me down?
I know you guys consistantly need something to cry and complain about, but PO weapons have been overused, please find something new.

MrDDT: What I meant by solving itself, is that eventually, there will be new weapons that will have a higher damage range than the PO weapons. From that point on, PO weapons will have no value and people will request the devs to make a way to get rid of them. As simple as that.

MrDDT: Again man, it's a simple curve. The game will eventually add on more stuff and better stuff. That's the normal course of things, that's how it works. And eventually, there will be better items than PO weapons.

[MrDDT]

Yes those preoder items are normally for show, and are not the top of the line items in the game for weapons. Please show me a game where it was?

Also he already said there would be crafted items better than PO weapons. Yet there are not.

You cant say that later there will be items better than preorder weapons. Once there is, we wont worry about this topic. We are talking about NOW. Not 10 years from now. Nor are we talking about another game. We are asking for the crafted items to be better than PO items, if you cant focus on that topic, then maybe you should make your own topic.

RIGHT NOW, preorder weapons are way overpowered. RIGHT NOW, they should be balanced.

See the 3 ways to fix it.

[Vandal]

Ok... Out of the ENTIRE list of features, they said this game would have, which one are available in game? Not even like 10% of them.
So, just like EVERYTHING else, the game's status is way behind and you guys frakking know this. Why?

Because it's the SAME answer to EVERY single problems people complain about.
Yes, the game is fucked up right now.
Yes, they will fix it, eventually.
And yes, you need to wait.
And no, you don't need to remind them again and again, they know.
And no, they won't fix it right away, they are gonna put them all nice and tiddy in a big patch and put it in at the same time.

You guys know this...
If you aren't willing to wait, leave.
If you are willing to wait, be quiet.

[MrDDT]

Ok... Out of the ENTIRE list of features, they said this game would have, which one are available in game? Not even like 10% of them.
So, just like EVERYTHING else, the game's status is way behind and you guys frakking know this. Why?

Because it's the SAME answer to EVERY single problems people complain about.
Yes, the game is fucked up right now.
Yes, they will fix it, eventually.
And yes, you need to wait.
And no, you don't need to remind them again and again, they know.
And no, they won't fix it right away, they are gonna put them all nice and tiddy in a big patch and put it in at the same time.

You guys know this...
If you aren't willing to wait, leave.
If you are willing to wait, be quiet.

Or you can stop posting in this thread when you know its broke. Stop trying to defend it, and either stop posting your jibber about how it will work out, or post reasons why you think its ok the way it is.

But posting saying "Yes this isnt a problem because one day they will fix it" is pretty bad statement to the topics people are bringing up about the problems with them.

So what you really are saying is "Yes there is a problem with them, but the game is broke, we can only hope they fix it someday".
Which is what we are expressing here also.

[Vandal]

Weekly Question

MrDDT asked: "The Preorder weapons are broken, they are way too strong and no other weapons are as close to their quality, when are you guys going to fix it?"

Xsyon answered: "We are currently aware of the situation and it has been added to our "never-ending" list of modification and will be looked into."



There you go. :)

[MrDDT]

Weekly Question

MrDDT asked: "The Preorder weapons are broken, they are way too strong and no other weapons are as close to their quality, when are you guys going to fix it?"

Xsyon answered: "We are currently aware of the situation and it has been added to our "never-ending" list of modification and will be looked into."



There you go. :)

Great so why are you defending it?

This thread is to express how they are OP, and ways to fix it. Its also to express that its important and maybe should be moved up the list past say like ahh fixing that the fact that water is flowing upstream instead of down. Or maybe fixing the issue that trees sway in the wind but grass doesnt.

It wont work itself out, it will only be fixed if the devs choose to fix it. Its not something players can do. Thus the point of this thread.

[Vandal]

I'm not defending the weapon.
I have agreed that there is a problem with them.

I'm only saying that Dev knows.
And I'm the kind of person that hates when people keep on and on and on and keep bashing the same complaints over and over. It drives me nuts.

So that's what I said, Xsyon knows about the PO weapon's problem.
No need to further cry about it.

[fotuenti]

And I'm the kind of person that hates when people keep on and on and on and keep bashing the same complaints over and over. It drives me nuts

so why not follow your own logic and not read this thread?



If you aren't willing to wait, leave.
If you are willing to wait, be quiet.

[Vandal]

Hey, don't blame me. I'm just trying to filter content so that devs don't spend their days reading unnecessary stuff. ;)

[jemmus]

Well agreed, it's an old topic that's been beaten up a bit already. But back in the early discussions we didn't have item Q levels. Now that we do, we're seeing that all the intricate work needed to produce a Master yields... what? Something about 67% as good as a PO.

[darkbladed]

Remember Metal-smithing is going to be added.

We are using bones and whittled wooden handles with stone and scraps of decaying metal strapped to them with leather; sure the PO weapons are going to rock those pieces of poo.

Once we can make a fiberglass handle with a tempered steel blade attached with high quality adhesives we will make comparable and even vastly better products.

Also who knows if 100 is going to be the skill-cap. It is now but when WOW first came out level 50 was the cap and now a few years later 85 in the cap (and each expansion it gets raised).

Maybe after prelude 150 or 200 will be the skill cap.

Also they are currently fixing combat and then fixing crafting so damage and other stuff may be dealt with differently in the near future.

[xyberviri]

yeah i would like to be able to stick it in a bag and not have the extra weight, though im not sure if they even weigh anything.

[orious13]

The quickest thing that will make the PO weapons less used is when they add the resources that give + to stats while crafting. Then add in the far later possibilities of making your own metal and working your own metal, that will decrease the PO weapons as well. Right now, they may be... bad news, but...