Scavenging Feedback - From 7/27

[GuideRaguel]

Greetings Survivors!

This thread is for you to post your opinions on what Items that are scavenged using the scavenging ability need to be adjusted, in terms of Rarity.

This is not a discussion thread, so absolutely no discussions.
I don't want this to turn into a flame wars, lets keep this civil.

What we need to know is...

-The items you think are too easy to find, to hard to find or items that just need a little adjusting.

- An explanation as to why you think the items need adjusting.

- If you have collected any data about scavenging please provide it.

- Any other information you think would be useful to know, that we can take into consideration.

Once we look at the player feedback we will adjust and balance accordingly.

Thank you.

[GuideSariel]

Hi Raguel!

In my oppinion nothing is too easy. I can scav for ages and get only a few items.

All the basic items used to make tools are way too hard. I believe we are spoiling the experience for many new players by not allowing them to gather essential items for basic tools. Some are not ever being scavenged any more.

These seem to not exist anymore because they are so rare in the loot table...........
- old saw blades
- pioneer and rusty spades
- feathers of all sorts
- old pipes
- rubber scrap
- rubber grip
- 5 and 10 pound weights
- cleaver blades
- all recipes
- all ready to use weapons and tools
- all bones, but especially human bones seeming as they can only be found by scav atm
- wood and steel bats
- golf clubs
- rusty and pioneer pick heads
- nails
- screws

I have gotten a FEW bolts by scav. I used to find these in bundles of over 15 and up to 50-ish

Im sure others will mention more i have missed.

[GuideSariel]

Another thing i missed.........

It was mentioned that there is zero chance of rare items on your own lands. This i believe is good for the game as it encourages travel and exploration.

I understand Jordi also wants there to be a zero chance of rare items scavenged on other people's land. I think this should be reconsidered as it will encourage risk if we get rares on our neighbours property because they can attack us and we cannot fight back. This is exciting and would be fun imho. It also does nothing to allow griefing etc. I can think of no down point to this and i strongly urge it to be recosidered.

I was under the impression that the further away from your own land, the better the chance of finding rares, as long as you are not on another tribe's lands. This is not the case. I can be a million miles from my own totem and not on anybody else's property, yet because i am CLOSE to another totem (remember im not on their' land) i get a huge decrease in the chance of finding rare scav items. This seems counter intuitive to game enjoyment and risk vs reward.

[unclean666]

Its pretty simple really all blades for weps and saw blades,shovels heads,pick axes ect just need to be bumped up a bit.While they should be rare around the very hard range.

Recipes about the same.

As far as bones besides humans you should have to hunt for those.

and some of the stuff like nails,screws,feathers,rubber scraps I seem to find them just fine Rubber grips though dont think I have in a long time.

[Larsa]

Please look at this thread (http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/7235-Scavenging-Feedback-after-patch-July-8) where people have posted detailed scavenging logs.

My general feed back:
1. It's generally unclear what items should be got through scavenging and what items should be got by pulling junk. This seems to be undefined at the moment - a large amount of goods (for example screws, bolts, nails, metal sheets, cloth of all sorts) can be got both by scavenging and pulling junk.

2. The main purpose of scavenging currently is to get larger amounts of items that we can also get through pulling junk. Apart from that scavenging provides items that cannot be got by pulling junk: dollar bills, quarters, pennies, plastic buttons, beer tabs, feathers and very rare bones. I haven't seen any other item since the scavenging patch. Note that most items that can only be found by scavenging have no use: dollar bills, pennies, quarters, beer tabs, bottle caps.

My suggestion:
Make pulling junk the action that provides large amounts of basic materials, make scavenging the skill that provides small amounts of rare things.

[mrwooj]

Larsa, you touch on something here that i think should be noted.

"Make pulling junk the action that provides large amounts of basic materials, make scavenging the skill that provides small amounts of rare things. "

Things like plastic, cloth and leather really do not need to be in the scav table. Even metal sheets, bolts, nails.

We can already sort junk specifically for metal, plastic, cloth and leather. It would be good to remove them from the scav table entirely. These are not rare items and to be honest it is annoying when you scav 10 times and get nothing but 1 plastic, which you can get in bundles of 4 every time by sorting junk.

Free up the scav table for the more rarer items like decorations, belt buckles, rubber, VGQ to Master tools and weapons, human bones, recipes, handles, saw blades, etc.

[Dzarren]

Another thing i missed.........

It was mentioned that there is zero chance of rare items on your own lands. This i believe is good for the game as it encourages travel and exploration.

I understand Jordi also wants there to be a zero chance of rare items scavenged on other people's land. I think this should be reconsidered as it will encourage risk if we get rares on our neighbours property because they can attack us and we cannot fight back. This is exciting and would be fun imho. It also does nothing to allow griefing etc. I can think of no down point to this and i strongly urge it to be recosidered.

I was under the impression that the further away from your own land, the better the chance of finding rares, as long as you are not on another tribe's lands. This is not the case. I can be a million miles from my own totem and not on anybody else's property, yet because i am CLOSE to another totem (remember im not on their' land) i get a huge decrease in the chance of finding rare scav items. This seems counter intuitive to game enjoyment and risk vs reward.

Sariel is so right in this but he forgets to mention that in a lot of areas the scrapheaps are taken by tribes so this means no change getting rare items.
Also i find it strange that items are rare which can fully encumber you.
You will only be able to find these when far away from youre totem with no way to transport them back to youre totem.
A thing which actually amazed me was the big difference in ratio which things could be found before and after the patch.
Before the patch i had an basket full of recepy's in 2 hours scavenging and after the patch none could be found.
This felt a bit like earning 50 euro an hour and youre boss changing the procedures and then you get only 1 .
Just my 5 (Euro)cents :)

[fatboy21007]

Hi Raguel!

In my oppinion nothing is too easy. I can scav for ages and get only a few items.

All the basic items used to make tools are way too hard. I believe we are spoiling the experience for many new players by not allowing them to gather essential items for basic tools. Some are not ever being scavenged any more.

These seem to not exist anymore because they are so rare in the loot table...........
- old saw blades
- pioneer and rusty spades
- feathers of all sorts
- old pipes
- rubber scrap
- rubber grip
- 5 and 10 pound weights
- cleaver blades
- all recipes
- all ready to use weapons and tools
- all bones, but especially human bones seeming as they can only be found by scav atm
- wood and steel bats
- golf clubs
- rusty and pioneer pick heads
- nails
- screws

I have gotten a FEW bolts by scav. I used to find these in bundles of over 15 and up to 50-ish

Im sure others will mention more i have missed.

This sums it up but i think recipes (basic ones should be decently easy to find, for the new players) However higher end recipes should be tough, but you shouldnt spend a week trying to find one. People got lives so i think you should be able to find atleast 1 rare recipe with in 2 hours. if it takes a day or days to find something, then the game is a second job. metals- chrome-tritanuim-gold-silver should be rare and tough to find and also inline with what i said. Im not saying give me the easy button, but i am saying i got alife and every1 else does here also. Make it reasonable to find things. And a final note metal boreds-studs-concrete posts etc just 5 encumber ya, would be nice if their weight was adjusted a bit, i think they way their droping atm is just fine though.

[Larsa]

...

These seem to not exist anymore because they are so rare in the loot table...........
- old saw blades
- pioneer and rusty spades
- feathers of all sorts
- old pipes
- rubber scrap
- rubber grip
- 5 and 10 pound weights
- cleaver blades
- all recipes
- all ready to use weapons and tools
- all bones, but especially human bones seeming as they can only be found by scav atm
- wood and steel bats
- golf clubs
- rusty and pioneer pick heads
- nails
- screws

I have gotten a FEW bolts by scav. I used to find these in bundles of over 15 and up to 50-ish

Im sure others will mention more i have missed.I have a somewhat different experience from you it seems (my scavenging 100, perception 71).

- Occasionally I scavenge feathers.
- I get reasonable amounts of rubber scrap, metal buckles and zippers by pulling junk (not through scavenging).
- Nails, screws, bolts, rivets: I get small amounts of those by pulling junk and get large amounts of those through scavenging. After a scavenging session on a junkpile (say 50 scavenging actions) I can come home with 100-200 nails, screws, bolts, rivets, etc.

[Tesla]

I will take a slightly different approach to report my scavenging experience.

I have pulled the following items since the patch which also currently have no use in game as far as I know. In most cases, they appear in Small, Medium, and Large. In some cases, such as Metal boards, there are various types, such as Steel and Iron.

-METAL Boards, Studs, Pipes, Medium and large Blocks, Posts, Poles, Long Handles
-PLASTIC Sheets, Blocks, Studs, Boards, Poles, Handles
-Concrete Posts

It is hard to guage rarity without knowing the usefullness of these items. I suppose I will rarely use them.

I have found uses for Small Metal Block, Small and Medium Metal Handles. So, they are not included in the above summary.

As a side note, I am still trying to figure out the purpose of these non scav items:

-Tar, Quartz, many non edible Plants, and Shells. My guess for the Plants is Cooking.

I still find and discard alot of Dollar Bill, Quarters, Pennies, Beer Tabs, and Bottle Caps. My guess is this was an attempt at currency.

Part 2 to this debacle is a list of items I can no longer find that I do have a use for:

-OLD SAW BLADES, Pruning and Circular Saw Blades.
-Knife and Cleaver Blades
-Spades and Pick Heads
-Bats
-Lucky Horseshoes(can't confirm the usefullness here, but carry one anyway)
-Old Pipe
-Human Bones
-Weights
-Golf Clubs

Next are items I no longer find which also currently have no use as far as I know. I assume some will be used for farming.

-Hoe Head, Rake Head
-Pitchfork Head, Garden Scythe
-Old Wrench

I still find the following useful items from scavenging or sorting:

-METAL Plates, Sheets, Spikes, Wedges, Rods
-Nails, Screws, Bolts, and Rivets of various types
-Feathers, Zippers, Junk Plastic, Buttons
-Leather, Fur and Leather/Fur Sraps of various types
-Metal Buckles and Decorations, now through sorting
-Rubber Grips and Scrap, now less frequently
-Cloth and Grass Fabric and Sraps

Metal Knobs are in a class all there own. Found them before patch by scav, after the patch by sorting and have never been able to use them for anything.

MOST IMPORTANTLY, Can't find any recipes. If I could find Architecture recipes, I might be able to figure out what to do with some of these materials.

[MrDDT]

I will take a slightly different approach to report my scavenging experience.

I have pulled the following items since the patch which also currently have no use in game as far as I know. In most cases, they appear in Small, Medium, and Large. In some cases, such as Metal boards, there are various types, such as Steel and Iron.

-METAL Boards, Studs, Pipes, Medium and large Blocks, Posts, Poles, Long Handles
-PLASTIC Sheets, Blocks, Studs, Boards, Poles, Handles
-Concrete Posts

It is hard to guage rarity without knowing the usefullness of these items. I suppose I will rarely use them.

I have found uses for Small Metal Block, Small and Medium Metal Handles. So, they are not included in the above summary.

As a side note, I am still trying to figure out the purpose of these non scav items:

-Tar, Quartz, many non edible Plants, and Shells. My guess for the Plants is Cooking.

I still find and discard alot of Dollar Bill, Quarters, Pennies, Beer Tabs, and Bottle Caps. My guess is this was an attempt at currency.

Part 2 to this debacle is a list of items I can no longer find that I do have a use for:

-OLD SAW BLADES, Pruning and Circular Saw Blades.
-Knife and Cleaver Blades
-Spades and Pick Heads
-Bats
-Lucky Horseshoes(can't confirm the usefullness here, but carry one anyway)
-Old Pipe
-Human Bones
-Weights

Next are items I no longer find which also currently have no use as far as I know. I assume they will be used for farming.

-Hoe Head, Rake Head
-Pitchfork Head, Garden Scythe

I still find the following useful items from scavenging or sorting:

-METAL Plates, Sheets, Spikes, Wedges, Rods
-Nails, Screws, Bolts, and Rivets of various types
-Feathers, Zippers, Junk Plactic, Buttons
-Leather, Fur and Leather/Fur Sraps of various types
-Metal Buckles and decorations
-Rubber Grips and Scrap

MOST IMPORTANTLY, Can't find any recipes. If I could find Architecture recipes, I might be able to figure out what to do with some of these materials.

Perfectly said and well posted.

+1 from me same problems and finds.

[L0rd0fIvIetal]

Only ten replies??? Really??? Does no1 Scavange???
Do u guys allready have all that u need??? Can i has some saw blades???
Anyways here is the stuff i havent seen and its pooping me up the wall(hope the pooping bit doesnt get me baned hehe)

-Sawblades
-Knife and Cleaver Blades
-Spades and Pick Heads
-Bats
-Human Bones
-Weights
and what others said

[VeryWiiTee]

I second the idea of making clearer lines between scavenging and collecting junk. Currently it feels like you can find just the same through scavenging and pulling junk. The only difference be the quality and quantity you can get.
It is possible that the increased amount in scavenging simply has put already rare items so far down the loot table we no longer see them. Removing those that can be found through sorting would be hella nice!

[soulless]

I agree with most of what was said, especially old saw blades used to make saws… new players need those, and I am running out of saws to give away ;)

I don’t really want to see bolts, screws, nails and rivets removed, as I can find useful amounts scaving, and only very small amounts sorting… when we need such large numbers, I prefer to see them kept in the scav tree. But things like leather, plastic, and cloth have no need to be in the scav tree as we can find more than enough sorting. Just my opinion… thanks for your time.

It would be a really nice thing down the road to be able to narrow our scav tables down by picking form a list of things were looking for at higher skill levels or something... say small metal bits, or cloth colors... hope this is clear, and I know that's far down the road, but would be a good idea.

[thurgond]

Since the big scavenging changes, I've found one of each of the following item types that used to be common:
pattern (bonecrafting)
bone (rottweiler rib)
old saw blade
weapon part (cleaver blade)

The frequency of these items seems to be about the same as skulls or giant drill bits used to be. Patterns don't need to be as common as they used to be, but still are too rare now. Old saw blades, bones and weapon parts should be found at least half as often as under the old tables.

My scavenging is 100 and perception 83. As the sole survivor of a formerly large tribe, I have a large supply of weapons (including picks and shovels) and a smaller supply of weapon parts. As a weapon crafter, I can grind on Tulipi clubs and axes, but under the current scavenging tables I'd probably wear out a bin full of knives for every new knife I can make from newly scavenged knife blades. A new weapon crafter that started like me with only the 5 shovel recipes could take a year or more with max scavenging to learn another recipe or find a pattern.

The scavenged leather is too common by a factor of 3 or 4. The heavy construction items (boards, sheets, poles, studs) should be moved to sorting. They are way too common and can make you go from 40% encumbered to a full stop in one pull. Feathers should be more common, perhaps off of junk piles. Handles and blocks are also too common, specially since there are limited recipes that use them.

To close on a good note, cloth drops seem about right.

If the combat changes on the test server go live without making knife blades as common as they were previously, then I'll be out of blades in less than a month and have to switch to axes.

Ravelli

[soulless]

In my opinion, your scavenging changes are still too drastic. did you even read these suggestions before attempting to correct your scav charts?

I scaved for 3 to 4 hours yesterday and left the game in frustration... I can’t imagine how it is for new players without 100 scav and high perception. Crossed 5 or 6 zones, hit 10 or more different scav piles, and found very little of use. Not one pattern, or any blades, no saws... felt like a waste of time.

Please consider looking at this more seriously, thanks.

[L0rd0fIvIetal]

by lack of post here the last 2 days im going to assume u all found blades??? or u just dont care about scav being fixed.
i havent found jack since the last combat patch only stuff i can get from sorting and even that a miserable amount of it after scavenging for 10 hours+

[fatboy21007]

Scavenging still 100% busted. again i wish the old system was back. it was fun and kept us busy. atm cant find anything and changes seem to do 0 effect.

[mrwooj]

For once i agree with Fatboy. Scavenging is 100% busted. None of the issues adressed above have been corrected. Now on top of this the resourse table seems broken as well. Havent seen a shell, obsidian or chalk in ages. There was a short time of about 2 weeks a while ago where these resourses had popped back into existance, but now they are gone again. I want the old system back. The new system in my opinion is absolutely terrible. I strongly suggest you get one of the Dev team to play the game and experience the scav/resourse table for themselves. Then we should see some changes in the right direction.

[fatboy21007]

Now with the update today, i see alot of vareity and alot less drops however so far in 20 minutes time i found a horseshoe,circular saw,knife blade wedge, all other items we got before the patch and metal decorations.,old wrench, i can definitly notice a difference now.

[VeryWiiTee]

I'm not much of a scavenger so have most of those items like heavy boards, sheets and posts/pipes vanished from the scavenging loot table?

No they haven't, but there sure is an influx of tool heads and blades/cleaves :).

[lordadamar]

Hi Raguel!

In my oppinion nothing is too easy. I can scav for ages and get only a few items.

All the basic items used to make tools are way too hard. I believe we are spoiling the experience for many new players by not allowing them to gather essential items for basic tools. Some are not ever being scavenged any more.

These seem to not exist anymore because they are so rare in the loot table...........
- old saw blades
- pioneer and rusty spades
- feathers of all sorts
- old pipes
- rubber scrap
- rubber grip
- 5 and 10 pound weights
- cleaver blades
- all recipes
- all ready to use weapons and tools
- all bones, but especially human bones seeming as they can only be found by scav atm
- wood and steel bats
- golf clubs
- rusty and pioneer pick heads
- nails
- screws

I have gotten a FEW bolts by scav. I used to find these in bundles of over 15 and up to 50-ish

Im sure others will mention more i have missed.

My problem has not been with any of the tool / weapon parts listed above I have HQ and VHQ of all the above everywhere.

Im sitting on 60 VHQ saw blades all found in a weeks time..

Where my issue is Bone / leather recipes are over abundant ,
and nails seems to have got more rare, used to scavenge the same spot for the same amount of time and come up with 4x more nails..

Last night I scavenged for 3 hours out of the 40 recipes I found of 6 different junk piles

30 were leather / bone
3 where building bp's that i already knew
7 were tools, 5 of which i already knew...

Metal sheets are more abundant id say every 5th pull was metal sheets or poles...

I think finding Recipes should have a skill base variable, or smart loot based on what you know already...

I understand that when you add up all the recipes and get a total count of armor/weapon/tool vs building/ wainwright bp obviously theres greater odds of finding anything but, there should be some balance there..
Its near impossible to find anything to do with wainwright or buildings, I have tried a dozen different junk piles in 3 different zones for extended periods of time...

80 Scavenge
93 Perception
91 Charm
85 Resource

48 wainwright 8 schemes only 2 inspired Paid through the nose to for others

[MrDDT]

You know this post is almost a year old right that you just necro'd?

My problem is less about the resource type being so over abundant and more about the QL being over abundant.

Meaning if I have 100 scav, and 90 CHA. I'm going to pull up Master QL stuff almost every scav. This creates and effect that makes QL mats way to common. If I only pulled up 100 Saw blades and only 20% of them were master, the rest were lower ranges, then you can see that would make it so that masters are prized. Instead of now where I use the same QL to grind with as I do for good items because I cant get lower QL.