would re-sub for 9.99

[Solaris74]

I would re-sub to the game if the sub fee was 9.99 still have issues payin 14.99 for this game.

[Hodo]

I would consider it too. But now that Salem has gone beta, and I got a key, I am not sure. That game looks to offer quite a bit, with a much smoother interface.

[joexxxz]

I checked that game out, nothing special :)

[Hodo]

I checked that game out, nothing special :)

Having played it for a few hours this weekend, I found it has one of the worst tutorials I have seen in a while, not as bad as Xsyons, which there really isnt one in game. I do like a few things about it, but I doubt I would sub to it if it tried to charge me for it in its current state.

[jefferysauto]

Umm guys you do realize, that they are like that on purpose right??? These games are not for everyone it is for people who do not want there hand held, and for them to find out how to play themselfs, Not to be rude I hate to see you kids or young adults which ever play games in the 80's and 90's, they where no hand holding or these tutorials that people so need today..

Not trying to troll you either, just makes no sense to me why people today like this so much, to me thats NOT gaming.. but what ever floats your boat, there is games for people who like that kind of stuff its called GW2, WOW, Rift, SWTOR etc.

Sandbox's are for people who are tired of the same ol' stuff we see time and time again.

Thats my 2 cents


To the Op, so because of 5 bucks you won't resub, its less than a lunch and MCdonald's, sometimes I wonder that people can afford to have gaming as a hobby . This free to play market makes me laugh, and to many want games for free and expect DEVS that bust there arse to work for nothing... Being in Game design I know the hard work they/we put into this, and for people to whine over a few bucks amazes me every day.

The game is 40 bucks where most games for 50-120$ So you saved money, they also let you go on the Test server when hardly any company allows that after you Unsub.



PS:F2P is not really F2P..... Most people see the word free and go nuts, and think its free , when alot of people end up spending more then a money sub...in the end that is...

[Riverspirit]

I have no problem paying $14.99 for this game. We are talking $0.50 a day here... You can't get entertainment that cheap anywhere. Just my $0.02 :cool:

[Fushaum]

I understand people think it's a lot of money for the game, i think to, and yes Riverspirit there there are many places you can be entertained for the same amount, will not name the games.

I do not think that they will lose money on putting the price 50% down, because I believe they will get more than 100% new players.

And then they have say on the front that the game is not fully developed, so people dont expect more than they get.

I love this game, and I will happily pay the price for playing it, not because I think the game is worth it, but because I want to support the project.

as long as they stick to the style and they do not mix magic into the game and they stick to one server world, love sandbox games.

[Hodo]

Umm guys you do realize, that they are like that on purpose right??? These games are not for everyone it is for people who do not want there hand held, and for them to find out how to play themselfs, Not to be rude I hate to see you kids or young adults which ever play games in the 80's and 90's, they where no hand holding or these tutorials that people so need today..

Not trying to troll you either, just makes no sense to me why people today like this so much, to me thats NOT gaming.. but what ever floats your boat, there is games for people who like that kind of stuff its called GW2, WOW, Rift, SWTOR etc.

Sandbox's are for people who are tired of the same ol' stuff we see time and time again.

Thats my 2 cents


To the Op, so because of 5 bucks you won't resub, its less than a lunch and MCdonald's, sometimes I wonder that people can afford to have gaming as a hobby . This free to play market makes me laugh, and to many want games for free and expect DEVS that bust there arse to work for nothing... Being in Game design I know the hard work they/we put into this, and for people to whine over a few bucks amazes me every day.

The game is 40 bucks where most games for 50-120$ So you saved money, they also let you go on the Test server when hardly any company allows that after you Unsub.



PS:F2P is not really F2P..... Most people see the word free and go nuts, and think its free , when alot of people end up spending more then a money sub...in the end that is...


I understand that, I am a BIG sandbox player and fan. But this game is just not what I am looking for anymore. I cant say I think Xsyon is bad, its not, its just not what me or my guild were looking for. I have since moved on back to Starquest Online because that sandbox is what I am looking for, if only it had an active development team it would be perfect. But unfortunately it is on its way out due to greed, and legal issues with the owner.

But it is considerably cheaper than Xsyon and I find that worth it in itself. Its the price tag of Xsyon that is turning it off from many players. Its just to expensive for what your getting. Sure its 50cents a day, but when compared to Salem which is free, and SQO which is 35c a day, or any of the half dozen other sandboxes that are f2p or pretty close. And with "A" list titles due out by the end of the year, like Repopulation, PS2, MWO, and others I can tell you that many companies are moving to the micro transaction method of payments, which is turning out to be a win win for many gamers.

[severin]

Its the price tag of Xsyon that is turning it off from many players. Its just to expensive for what your getting.

That is a very subjective statement. I might as well say "It is not the price tag of Xsyon that is turning it off from many players. It gives you a lot for the money you pay".
See, I'm as right as you are. It's just a subjective statement depending on the eye of the beholder.

[Willowhawk]

That is a very subjective statement. I might as well say "It is not the price tag of Xsyon that is turning it off from many players. It gives you a lot for the money you pay".
See, I'm as right as you are. It's just a subjective statement depending on the eye of the beholder.

Exactly, I would rather pay for a game I like than play a game I really don't like because it's free :rolleyes:

Hodo if the game you are playing charged a nominal fee maybe they would still have an active development team like Xsyon. Lets face it, Nothing is Free! I believe Xsyon has been very smart in their approach to development. When you have a limited budget, you work within that budget and develop in stages while keeping the bills paid so you don't have to close your doors like so many (Most) other small development companies have done.

I will happily keep paying as long as Xsyon continues to show the professionalism and customer service they have provided all along. :cool:

[MrDDT]

I will happily keep paying as long as Xsyon continues to show the professionalism and customer service they have provided all along. :cool:

I'm sure this has a lot to do with why so many are not paying right now.

You can take this how you like, but its a belief I have and its hard to show otherwise.

[Hodo]

Hodo if the game you are playing charged a nominal fee maybe they would still have an active development team like Xsyon. Lets face it, Nothing is Free! I believe Xsyon has been very smart in their approach to development. When you have a limited budget, you work within that budget and develop in stages while keeping the bills paid so you don't have to close your doors like so many (Most) other small development companies have done.


Time to slam that door right now.

First off the game I am playing currently had a development staff as large as Xsyon, and he is completely stateside not using third-world programmers, that he has to fly over to talk to every 6 months to get shit done.

Next CastleThorne had a disagreement with the development staff that caused them to break up, which put the game in legal limbo while the rights are worked out in court. Instead of shutting the game down and letting it die, they turned over the management of the game but not the development of the game to NeXeon Inc. Who also runs another game that I play Face of Mankind which is F2P, with a P2P model. Which has a larger playerbase than this and its going through a low point due to end of summer and new games coming out.

Xsyon is not the worst game I have ever played it is pretty good, but I expected more from someone who worked on one of the best sandbox game ideas in recent history, Roma Victor. Xsyon is not what it could be, or where it should be, and he knows it. The price model is the straw that broke this camels back and thats why I moved on.

With the market becoming flooded with F2P games with a P2P model or micro transactions, Xsyon is a dinosaur in the age of mammals. Xsyon is nothing more the Minecraft, with better graphics right now. And Minecraft is cheaper. I think there are more people in Wurm Online which is where a lot of the initial population for this game came from, than there are in Xsyon.

But now I am just being bitter and thats not what I came here to do.

[Morphinehit]

I'm sure this has a lot to do with why so many are not paying right now.

You can take this how you like, but its a belief I have and its hard to show otherwise.

The lack of advertising and profile is quite possibly the main reason a lot of new people aren't playing. I've been an avid mmorpg gamer for a long time and I only stumbled upon Xsyon by accident. Very glad I did. The reason a lot of the original community didn't keep playing is probably because there is a good slice of this generation of gamers out there who want their shinies handed to them without any challenge or effort. They want to be spoon fed their games, lead by the nose from one quest to the next. They like the 'idea' of sandbox, but don't actually want to exert any effort to develop their character.

There are a good number of people who would cherish the gem that Xsyon presents to the gaming community, and it will just be a matter of good marketing and wise, continual development that will lure them in and keep them playing.

That said, I love the game and have found the Xsyon team to be polite and friendly in my dealings with them. I haven't needed to ask for much support in game, but when I have I was happy with the result.

If, like some people, I was constantly throwing tantrums and DEMANDING changes that I felt were in the best interests of the game in order to suit ME - then I would probably be annoyed with Notorious for not caving in to my very important demands. But I came here looking for a game with exploration, crafting and gathering and that's what I got. I see the potential of the game, I like playing, and I have faith in the continued direction of the developers.

I pray that they don't buckle to the childish demands of a vocal minority, and stay true to their vision.

[MrDDT]

I pray that they don't buckle to the childish demands of a vocal minority, and stay true to their vision.

It's not just the vocal minority.

First, you have more people upset with this game, than happy. If you dont believe me, read these forums compared to any game that is doing just 1/2 ok. Xsyon has a horrid rep.

You have to understand that 1000s of people played this game. You have less than 300 (using the Guide's numbers which who knows if its true or not) playing.

1000s quit this game without a word. Many others have started this game and quit without a word. Now you have the few people posting that are upset. But just go back and read what people that quit, vs people that love this game. Now also take into account how many people "love" this game in posts, and are still playing.

Few things we are still waiting for after 2 years.

1)Archery.
2)Cooking.
3)Crafted gear that matters.
4)Taming

Those are just some of the biggest things they said they would give us, and haven't.

I've played this game, and honestly I cant log in for more than 10mins at a time because I have nothing to do. I've never had this issue with any other MMO.
Now you can say what you like, but this has never happened to me before.

[GuideHael]

This is getting a little off track from the OP and leaning more towards bashing of the game as a whole. The OP was about the price of the game so please keep things on track to that topic. If you all have constructive feedback we welcome that but if the thread slides down that road of outright game bashing than what this topic is about, I'll lock and prune the thread.

~Guidehael

[Morphinehit]

This is getting a little off track from the OP and leaning more towards bashing of the game as a whole. The OP was about the price of the game so please keep things on track to that topic. If you all have constructive feedback we welcome that but if the thread slides down that road of outright game bashing than what this topic is about, I'll lock and prune the thread.

~Guidehael

I think discussing the qualities for and against the game are entirely relevant to the cost of the game and therefore the topic at hand.

I like the game, and find the experience worth the price of admission. If people don't believe it is worth the price, then they should also have the option to say why.


That said, obviously someone who has played Xsyon since release would have a very different perspective on the gameplay and the speed of development than a newcomer like me. I've only been playing for a few months, and I've only seen one or two minor balancing changes and the migration thing.

I also haven't been through the whole plethora of changes from the original release. It boggles my mind when some of the 'older' members of my tribe talk about the early days and how little there was in game compared to now. Given what I've been told, I'm not surprised that some people didnt stick around, given the typical gamer mentality (now now, gimme gimme). Those who did so obviously saw the potential in the game, and valued the open nature of the world and gameplay. I also get it that some people are impatient that promised developments havent been integrated yet (despite the massive changes that have occured) because they want to continue to enjoy the game, and new things like cooking and taming will hopefully make that possible.

But at the end of the day, people originally bought a game that (according to some people) didnt have 1/10th of the features it has today. By all accounts, it has changed immensely since then with new features and additions which have culminated in a game that I am thoroughly enjoying. There might still be features left to be introduced, but I'm not going to be sad if they take a long time, or end up never eventuating.

At the end of the day, I paid for a product and I pay a sub to access the product. That's pretty much it.

I don't feel like game companies owe me anything more than this basic arrangement. The fact they keep working on the game at all in an attempt to improve it is a bonus. How quickly they do so is entirely up to them, and will ultimately come down to their resources and drive to make it happen.

So essentially, players have 2 options.

1. If they continue to enjoy Xsyon, they can continue to pay their sub.

2. If they don't, then they can cancel their sub.

The third option to cry about speed of development, business models and broken promises is just a luxury that people with a false sense of entitlement and self-importance tend to adopt. For these people, I recommend Option 2.

I undeleted your post.

~Guidehael

[GuideHael]

I don't mind the discussion, my post was more directed at a few who are not playing but like to patrol the forum and bash the game when they can. http://www.xsyon.com/content.php/69-xsyon-sandbox-mmorpg-apocalypse-2012-development There are different stages of development you can read about here to see what is on the list and will get worked on before others. The current development is in progress and as Xsyon posted in the announcement thread once we kick off free trials/kickstarter development will pick up faster with the revenue that brings. I hope that gives a little insight to what is being worked on and what will be worked on next.

~Guidehael

[Hodo]

I don't mind the discussion, my post was more directed at a few who are not playing but like to patrol the forum and bash the game when they can. http://www.xsyon.com/content.php/69-xsyon-sandbox-mmorpg-apocalypse-2012-development There are different stages of development you can read about here to see what is on the list and will get worked on before others. The current development is in progress and as Xsyon posted in the announcement thread once we kick off free trials/kickstarter development will pick up faster with the revenue that brings. I hope that gives a little insight to what is being worked on and what will be worked on next.

~Guidehael

I know you arent directing that at me, but even if it is. Those of us who no longer play and take time to come back to these forums to "patrol" as you put it, are doing so because we still have some interest in the game which is good. Its better than having thousands of dead forum accounts that no longer care about anything to do with this game and dont even come back to see if there is progress.

Which would you rather have, a forum with no one but your self to moderate, or a forum with someone on it who at least looks to see whats going on?

[GuideHael]

I don't mind former players keeping up on the game and posting, I want the discussion to stay on topic though.

~Guidehael

[Hodo]

Agreed the topic should stay on the price of the game.

I hate to say it, but 9.99 is a fair price for this level of product currently. The issue is still Xsyon charges for the initial purchase of the game and then charges 14.99 a month for the game additionally. Which means your paying more for this game then you would for Wurm Online, Neocron2, Repopulation, and other non-sandbox "A" list titles.

What is the plan to draw players back or into the game with the current price structure? Is he considering a re-pricing or a reduction of initial sale price?

[GuideHael]

http://www.xsyon.com/showthread.php/8384-Questions-of-the-Week-09-24-09-30 That would be the place to ask that question.

[Drevar]

At $40 for the client and $14.99 a month (some less due to 3-month pricing) I feel like I have been kickstarting this game for 2 years now. There are SOOOOO many things that have been promised in "the next round" for so long. And when some things do get done they are bare minimum and incomplete. Some people will play and pay the full sub price just for a single really good, in-depth feature (like cooking or farming). Unfortunately we already know from the answered questions that these systems will not be robust and full featured when they come in, but bare minimums. How many years will it take to flesh these out to the point where they alone are worth the sub price to those specific players?

[tomduril]

Postings like "the game is not worth XXX $" are sort of strange to me.
How do you measure "worthiness" - by comparing it to other games?
Do you also do this worthiness checks with all your entertainment expenses?
Like: internet costs, cinema, eating? Do you compare them on the same level?
Like: pizza was cheaper but the last movie in the cinema was more entertaining than the pizza I ordered (so the pizza was not worth the costs, but the cinema visit was) ?!?

Saying for me the entertainment I get is not worth XXX $ is a valid statement, but the general argument that other games are cheaper - and this game should also be cheaper is sort of disturbing for me - especially from people from USA :P

The supplier defines the price - and you can choose to buy/consume or not... wether the price works out or not has to be determined by the CFO of notorious games...

I dont think that the monthy fee greatly influences the population of the game (probably a lower price would result in more active subs with "inactive" players)...

[Azzym]

Postings like "the game is not worth XXX $" are sort of strange to me.
How do you measure "worthiness" - by comparing it to other games?
Do you also do this worthiness checks with all your entertainment expenses?
Like: internet costs, cinema, eating? Do you compare them on the same level?
Like: pizza was cheaper but the last movie in the cinema was more entertaining than the pizza I ordered (so the pizza was not worth the costs, but the cinema visit was) ?!?

Saying for me the entertainment I get is not worth XXX $ is a valid statement, but the general argument that other games are cheaper - and this game should also be cheaper is sort of disturbing for me - especially from people from USA :P

The supplier defines the price - and you can choose to buy/consume or not... wether the price works out or not has to be determined by the CFO of notorious games...

I dont think that the monthy fee greatly influences the population of the game (probably a lower price would result in more active subs with "inactive" players)...

Not sure what you wanted with this tomduril. It is not uncommon to compare prices for products in a specific category. In fact, its more common to do that than not. What you get all wrong though is that you try to compare apples to oranges, or even shoes to cars. Other posters in the thread are comparing Xsyon to other games, not other entertainments. Personally I don't think Pizza is some kind of entertainment at all, even though they can amusing.

From what I can read and understand by former posters in the thread (and others) some people consider the pricing model for this game being too high in comparison to other games when it comes to quality, completeness, development, content, etc.etc. I'm sure there are tons of research papers written on the subject and that some marketing genius will advice Notorious Games of a suitable pricing model in order to attract as many players as possible. Actually, perhaps they don't even want as many players as possible. Hardware considerations, scaleability, modularity come into play with a larger population and the game is perhaps not written with that taken into consideration.

Well, and as a last thing. The wise supplier practice a flexible strategy to sell more. Setting a price "out of the blue" is a really bad strategy. And sticking to it because "I can", ...is even worse. But I do agree, that decision is up to NG, and if we don't like it we can unsubscribe.

[tomduril]

Not sure what I wanted with this either - I wrote it at work in a bad mood because something I had to fix was not working ;)

Just saying that not all games can be compared - and not all publisher go for "maxing" the (paying) player base.

And: some clubs sell "gin tonic" at 10 Eur - other sell the same drink at 2 Eur - the people that go to the place that sell it at 10 do it for a reason: its "exclusive" (and the use more expensive gin) and its not overfilled with 16 year olds posing as adults (like the bar selling it at 2 eur is) ...

I personally dont think that lowering the price would be a good idea... but the pricing level is something that hopefully has got some attention by Notorious games!

[Hodo]

Postings like "the game is not worth XXX $" are sort of strange to me.
How do you measure "worthiness" - by comparing it to other games?
Do you also do this worthiness checks with all your entertainment expenses?
Like: internet costs, cinema, eating? Do you compare them on the same level?
Like: pizza was cheaper but the last movie in the cinema was more entertaining than the pizza I ordered (so the pizza was not worth the costs, but the cinema visit was) ?!?

Saying for me the entertainment I get is not worth XXX $ is a valid statement, but the general argument that other games are cheaper - and this game should also be cheaper is sort of disturbing for me - especially from people from USA :P

The supplier defines the price - and you can choose to buy/consume or not... wether the price works out or not has to be determined by the CFO of notorious games...

I dont think that the monthy fee greatly influences the population of the game (probably a lower price would result in more active subs with "inactive" players)...

To answer that is simple.

What is it worth to me, I compare it to other games in its genre and market.

Xsyon-Sandbox open ended, no levels(well there are), heavy grind, mostly open PvP.

Other games that are in that area....

Darkfall Online Free to Play till DF2 comes out.
Mortal Online 14.25EUD a month
Wurm Online Free or 5EUD a month
Star Wars Galaxies Free
Star Quest Online 9.99USD a month
Ultima Online 12.99USD a month or Free.
Neocron2 Free
Eve 14.95USD a month, or pay with ingame money.

Games coming out in that genre.

The Repopulation.
Star Citizen.

Most game markets now are micro transaction and thats what works.

[Solaris74]

Xsyon is a ok game so far he has been working on it and updating it but if the dev was to drop the price to 9.99 (sub fee) he would probably get a bigger sub base.
I love sandbox games its the whole figuring them out that i like the most. I dont want a hold my hand game and walk me threw it.
All im sayin is that if the game was 9.99 (sub fee) id be more apt to play it and pay to play it. As im sure most are happy to pay 14.99 to play and some will all im sayin is at 9.99 there will probably be more intrested as its cheaper then most games out there. Also i do have experience playing games have been playing 20+ years went from atari to comadore 64 to sega to nintendo to playstation also xbox is in the mix. Im not tryin to make people upset or mad here just sayin if it was me thats what i would do =)

5 dollars does not seem like a lot but its like when you go 50-60mph no big deal 10mph not that much but when you go 200 to 205 that 5mph makes a big diffrence. Yes i know speed and money dont equal the same but its the same concept.

[jefferysauto]

Xsyon is a ok game so far he has been working on it and updating it but if the dev was to drop the price to 9.99 (sub fee) he would probably get a bigger sub base.
I love sandbox games its the whole figuring them out that i like the most. I dont want a hold my hand game and walk me threw it.
All im sayin is that if the game was 9.99 (sub fee) id be more apt to play it and pay to play it. As im sure most are happy to pay 14.99 to play and some will all im sayin is at 9.99 there will probably be more intrested as its cheaper then most games out there. Also i do have experience playing games have been playing 20+ years went from atari to comadore 64 to sega to nintendo to playstation also xbox is in the mix. Im not tryin to make people upset or mad here just sayin if it was me thats what i would do =)

5 dollars does not seem like a lot but its like when you go 50-60mph no big deal 10mph not that much but when you go 200 to 205 that 5mph makes a big diffrence. Yes i know speed and money dont equal the same but its the same concept.



Lol, so because of 5 bucks, you won't play, I bet if the game was 10 bucks, you people wouldn't either, because if 5 bucks is stopping you, maybe its time for a new hobby, I know this sounds harsh, but this gets old when people cry free to play or cheaper subs.

Back in 1998, subs where 10 dollars this is 2012, so 5 dollar increase from then is nothing.. Devs need to eat to.

@Hodo

Darkfall is free for a month thats is, it was 15 a month for ever, then only dropped for there new game, which again will be 15 bucks...

Mortal online is 16 a month more then any game on the market, in american, so its more..

The game thats state that are free to play, you will pay more than 15 a month for the same items in say xyson, say Xsyon went free , you would end up spending more then 15 a month for the same privledges..

Look at LOTR, and DDO, great way of doing free to play, but I rather sub because in the end if I want everything that I like, I would may more then 15 a month.

Free to play does not always work, and its amoney grap, Indies should never ever, ever, ever do Free to play it does not work here, and I hope they never do it, being a newer Dev myself I have studied Game Production and buisness , I see for AAA, free to play works if done right, for money reasons, Indies it just does not work, they do not have that study flow of money like AAA's do, because they are a niche game.


They need that study income, free to play will never work, and if they dropped to 10 bucks, how many people would they gain very few, because of 5 bucks is stopping you from a game, then, the game was never for you in the first place, I spend more at mcdonalds in a day, $7.52 for one meal. SO i'm lost by this 5 dollar thing and it does not make any sense.

[Hodo]

They need that study income, free to play will never work, and if they dropped to 10 bucks, how many people would they gain very few, because of 5 bucks is stopping you from a game, then, the game was never for you in the first place, I spend more at mcdonalds in a day, $7.52 for one meal. SO i'm lost by this 5 dollar thing and it does not make any sense.

You spend to much at McDonalds. I can get in and out for less than 5bucks. Dollar menu is your friend.

Lets look at the product and compare it to other products charging the same price. And I am not just talking content, but total package.

DFO, has more content, better graphics, and a larger development team thus faster patches.
MO, far better looking graphics, content is a bit more, but is plagued with bad patches.
Wurm Online, worse graphics, WAY more content, but slower patches, but is cheaper.

Thats just three games, if I were to throw in EVE... it not only has better graphics, deeper gameplay a larger game world, and a huge development team behind it. It now has a console FPS expansion!

Xsyon has much to offer but it has been over a year, if not 2 years and the game is WAY behind the power curve. So it makes less sense now to charge AAA prices for a game that is at best mid-tier. The reputation of this game is poor, go to MMORPG.com or Tentonhammer, or any of the MMO review sites and read the player forums on this game. For every ONE possitive review there is 2 negative ones, if there are any posts AT ALL. And thats bad seeing as many players it once had.