To Xsyon.

[znaiika]

If you want you customers back? revert to old skill system or let us lock all skills and abilities from getting decay.

[Pwnuts]

are you serious? :D

[wazcool]

Yes, from previous experience I think he is :)

[Bejaymac]

Guess he wants to be an UBER without having to work for it

[znaiika]

I see you don't want any more people to play Xsyon, because current system only keeping people away from Xsyon and you want it that way so only few can play, don't want any competition don't you?
Your economy will never work Xsyon will always have small population if he dose not change/remove current skill/attribute decay system.
How long it is now since skill/attribute decay system was implemented? since then it is only getting worse not better, people come and leave mostly because of it.
It's time for you to open your mind and do logic thinking.

[Pwnuts]

The decay sytem is working very well, and if new players wouldnt have to deal with it, they would leave because they get all skills up to fast to have any goal or motivation. i would not say that people leave because of that. if you did, ok there might be one, but still i cant see your point. everyone was working years for the stuff they have now, and i honestly would like to see some competition coming up for my own view, but they have to do it in the same way as i did, as everyone did. also, if you know how to deal with the decay you can grind most of yoir skills up really easy. the few skills where its harder to get materials for wont bother you much eighter - over time.

[znaiika]

It is working very well for a few and to keep other/new people away, that one I agree.
When Xsyon started to implement decay system because few people demanded that's when people started to leave by a big numbers.
And mostly people left because of it and it was confirmed by Xsyon.

There is a way out though, without effecting those who like this decay system, simply add another clean pve server where people could control their skills and attributes by checking any of the three options: minus, plus and lock on all skills and attributes not just few.
Then we will see if I am the only one who think that way, Xsyon could use extra players.

[MrDDT]

First it was "Make a PVE server, and everyone will come"
Now it's "Remove decay again and everyone will come"

Some people you just can't give them logic. Znaiika I've debated with you before on these topics and yet you still think that everyone left because of decay. Sadly everyone left due to launch issues and nothing to do with decay.

[znaiika]

MrDDT it was never "Remove decay "again"" I remember when a lot of people left and why, and yes we have debated on this decay system, often I hear new people disagreeing on skill and attribute decay and simply leave because they don't wont to argue about it.
Adding another clean server without decay or controlled decay on all skills and attributes will not effect current pvp nor pve servers, so you don't have to worry about it.

[Darkkmercy]

yeah I don't really see a issue on the decay system as a new player. . . it only took a few mins to figure out after talking to people

[MrDDT]

MrDDT it was never "Remove decay "again"" I remember when a lot of people left and why, and yes we have debated on this decay system, often I hear new people disagreeing on skill and attribute decay and simply leave because they don't wont to argue about it.
Adding another clean server without decay or controlled decay on all skills and attributes will not effect current pvp nor pve servers, so you don't have to worry about it.


I'm sure adding a clean server would have 0 effect on the current servers. /sarcasm

Having said that, I think a clean server is a good idea once things are ironed out more with combat, and giving players a direction. Until then I wouldn't make another server spit. We seen how the last one went.

Znaiika. The few people you are talking about (likely less than 10, but maybe a couple dozen) are nothing that left compared to when people really left in the 1000s.
Decay has been debated and asked for, far more than asked for removed. It was always in the plans and he added it. There was a time when there was no decay and people whined about it. So finished up the decay system. Now you have according you some people upset about it.

Sadly the few people left in the game is less of a worry than the 1000s of people waiting for the game to become what it said it was going to be at release.
Where is the combat objectives? Where is the good vs evil system? What is the drive to do anything? Why level up skills? What does high end crafting give over just making it for looks? Where are the animals? Where is the danger?

People need a reason to do things other than "Hey that looks cool". They need something to spur them on. Like zombies raiding them at night, or a big bad Lich going to invade the area. Whatever it is, people need to be driven to do it.

[Darkkmercy]

gonna agree with mrddt here - the decay system is pretty small potatos to many of the others - even a unified server with a mix of pvp and pve - with 3 start points for good neutral and evil players - having a no mans land between them with larger mutant animals and towns near the edge are raidable but ones farther in low threat to medium threat can not be raided - of course the towns nearer to badlands would have access to higher level resources and possibly other free bonuses (like larger settlements starting off) giving a inventive to being in pvp zone - of course high danger zones is open pvp but the lesser zones are not allowing one server with a mix of pvp and pve where people can build massive pretty towns then hang out with allies in a forward base camp

of course this would also need a larger map (I know its planned past the mist but would need to be already in game) and the good / evil system working as well as many other things added BEFORE this could be added but it would also allow 1 server for all

[znaiika]

I am 100% sure that skill/attribute decay system was a kill shot, then playing with people nerves, like: limiting old saw, then knife blades and so on, which affected population drop as well in addition to skill decay, before implementing PVE server I was asking to also change/remove skill/attribute decay system, which you protested "the reason why people left and still come and leave as soon as they hit their first decay in their skills and attributes", skill/attribute decay is the main reason to population problem, PVE population was and still better then PVP population from the start, but the main problem is and will be skill/attribute decay system, if you don't want it to be changed on current servers, then the best way is to add clean server with controlled skill/attribute system as I propose.
Also remove all tools from scavenging, like old saw, knife blades, feathers and such and add them to toolcrafting, add feathers to birds, change public decay, such as containers give them timer for about 2 or so hours in real time before they are open to public, after dropping totem increase timer for next drop to one weak of real time and so on.

DDT you still think 1000s left not because bad new systems but by Xsyons fault? living in a lie and believe that they are truce, other expression is "believing own lies".

You can add all you wish to first two servers, and experiment with those as much as your heart desires, but other people want to play as well and they don't want to be effected by your desires, and the perfect solution is to add another fresh server with controlled skill/attribute decay system, and it is simple to code just adding locks to all skills and attributes, simple as that.

[znaiika]

gonna agree with mrddt here - the decay system is pretty small potatos to many of the others - even a unified server with a mix of pvp and pve - with 3 start points for good neutral and evil players - having a no mans land between them with larger mutant animals and towns near the edge are raidable but ones farther in low threat to medium threat can not be raided - of course the towns nearer to badlands would have access to higher level resources and possibly other free bonuses (like larger settlements starting off) giving a inventive to being in pvp zone - of course high danger zones is open pvp but the lesser zones are not allowing one server with a mix of pvp and pve where people can build massive pretty towns then hang out with allies in a forward base camp

of course this would also need a larger map (I know its planned past the mist but would need to be already in game) and the good / evil system working as well as many other things added BEFORE this could be added but it would also allow 1 server for all

The only PVP I would agree if you could activate it by /pvp flag = optional. not zones

[Darkkmercy]

I've seen it done in many games they just give you a warning and a 30 sec pvp active - also if the maps 3-4 times as big with 20% of each map dedicated to pvp you are unlikely to run into it by accident so it would be 100% optional

also the pvp flag system is to variable how long is it active? can I be attacked but not attack? do I have to be pvp and you pvp to fight or can you randomly attack me?

by simply placing a portion of the game world between the alignments you could open up more or less pvp zones - for instance good tribe zones would have the largest no pvp zones meaning its almost impossible to accidentally walk into a pvp zone - where as neutral would be a 60/40 safe/pvp split and evil would be closer to 20/80 split

of course also the more hostile zones would be higher level animals also creating a new survival mode for people who want heavier combat where as the more peaceful good people don't have to worry as much if they just want to craft and chill out building something cool

this would allow players to select their pvp commitment while not forcing anyone into fights if they choose not to

[znaiika]

There is a pvp server for full open world pvp to fight over resources and such, no pvp controlled zones on pve servers period, will ruing everything, as for pvp option = flag both who activated pvp flag can attack each other but not anyone else who did not activated pvp flag can not attack any player, this is how pvp flag works, there can be competition between more people or even between tribes of course every citizen of that tribe should have an option to activate pvp option or not, should not be forced in to pvp by tribe leader.

[znaiika]

I am still waiting for an answer on this proposal, I know that Xsyon is aware why population left, why not fix it? would it hurt current servers? no, would it be bad for Xsyon him self? no, what would it take to finally realize that this can be fixed and not loosing time waiting? you can call current servers hardcore and new server unrestricted or classic or whatever you call it and let like minded people play how they like.
Xsyon, I know you're reading this, please don't ignore it at this time, if you are waiting for people to populate current servers? then there is no hope, you know how long it's been and population dose not grow, in my opinion is due to current skill/attribute decay system.

[Xsyon]

Like many aspects of the game, the skill system can and will eventually be improved. Personally, I would prefer a system as I recall from UO, with a hard cap on total skill points and locks to control exactly what skills are gained and lost once you've reached the cap.*

There certainly is an audience for games where you can max every skill. For me, that potential destroys the role playing aspect of a game. Regardless, there is no evidence to show that revising the skill system is a critical issue at the moment.

It's true that when the current skill system was released, the game population decreased. To put this into perspective:

- Aside from the initial Prelude launch, the active population has always been low. At the launch, many pre-order players left for several reasons: they didn't get to place their totem in their desired location, conflicts with other players and the desire for a PvE only server were the main reasons reported to me. During the first three months after the launch players left primarily because of poor performance (lag, crashes and bugs). Many also just came and went simply because that's what many players do. (I'm an example of this type of player. There are very few games that I played beyond the initial month or even week). By the end of that year, the active population was about double what it is now, but nowhere near the numbers at launch.

- Outside of launch, the biggest exodus of active players was due to opening Xsyon to free play. Although the daily number of players that dropped in made Xsyon feel more active, these people mostly came and went quickly. I surveyed these players several times and the main response for why they didn't stick around were:
-- They were looking for a different type of game.
-- They wanted an entirely free to play game.
-- They wanted PvE only.
During the free to play period, active numbers steadily decreased, only boosted slightly by updates and boosted decently when I opened the Peace Server.

- The second biggest exodus was due to totem and tribe decay and the advent of revenants. Even though this was a much needed improvement, around 150 active players left during that time.

- The third noticeable change was after the skill and stat update. The active population decreased by around 30 players at that time. This update and population decrease happened after two months of steady growth due to events and press releases, so it's difficult to say if the population left because of the update or simply because players from the growth spurt had their fill of the game.

Aside from those moments, the active population has been relatively steady.

I do keep in touch with many past players who say they'd return for many different reasons. Mounts, pets, ranged combat and achievements are the most common. Cooking and farming were highly requested but ended up not bringing back many players (although I'm happy with how the systems turned out). The skill system is not typically mentioned.

So I will continue to focus on the most requested features and changes.

Among Steam players, the biggest complain by far is the subscription. Removing the subscription would definitely bring in more players. Whether it would bring in enough new players each month to offset the loss of subscriptions, I don't know. Would these players stick around or just play a few hours and move on to the next game, I don't know!

I hope this puts things into perspective!

* This may not be exactly how it was, but it's how I recall it.

[znaiika]

Thank you Xsyon for responding, I wish that I could play but current skill decay system is way too grindish, people say it's possible to reach high levels in skills it may well be but you need a lot of materials and know how, I am a person who would prefer simple and fast level-up then I don't mind fluctuations, call me lazy or any how you want but that just me.
You're saying it's for the good of RP but I think it dose not matter RP or no RP people would still prefer playing alone and only come out RP when they feel like, that just how people are, and it won't matter how strict you will force them to RP you will only push people away, I remember when people could level-up all skills they traded away better then now, because they wanted to be first to trade before price drop, now people trade for what they really need and keep most wanted things to them selves, this halted trading.
I am not trying to ruing RP in this game I am trying to make it better, if you had three servers you would see which setting are better preferred it's all.
Thank you again Xsyon and wish you all the best.

Why do people hunt alone? because of loot, it is easier for a big tribe to hunt in groups because only one can loot an animal.
Add one more server and call it solo, and current server RP.

[MrDDT]

I think the key to any good MMO is to focus on bringing people together not putting in systems and servers that encourage people solo play.
On top of that the key to an RPG is the feeling like you are in control of your toon and it's progressing either through a story line or in it's own ability.

Znaiika, it really sounds to me like you shouldn't be playing MMO's nor should you be playing RPGs. You likely would do much better off with a single player game like Assassin's Creed. Where there is no real skill system and what they do have it's quickly gained and you don't have to worry about anyone else but you and your own storyline.

People play MMORPGs for the reason of being around other people, dealing with them in trade, grouping, adventures and guilds/clans.
I would love to see Xsyon bring in more combat and grouping options. Let us have reasons to be together and things to strive for as a group.

[Pwnuts]

For me, that potential destroys the role playing aspect of a game.

trading was never important for this kind of things. making cart which are not to bad in trades, is a skill everyone can learn without loosing any skill. the stuff which was traded most of the time was tons of materials or blueprints, not crafted items.

[znaiika]

I think the key to any good MMO is to focus on bringing people together not putting in systems and servers that encourage people solo play.


The key of RP is to place people on the same map and give them a free choice not force them to RP. You see, there is a difference between me and you, you are always looking for ways for dominance, I am looking for ways of equality and respect to others, your way will never work and never did.
Add another server with my proposed settings and lets see which server will have more RP, even if it is sounds like solo settings.
There are ways to let people to hunt together and let everyone walk away with loot without forcing them to be a members of a big tribes, like: first person to loot will get 100% of quality then every person after that will get slightly lower quality of the same loot from same animal, assuming everyone have their skills at the same level.
There are ways to distribute power levels to a certain animal types so those would make sense, there are ways to kind of restrict people from killing some animals solo, so people would have something to hunt as a group and something to hunt as a solo, normal animals should not have power level of 80 and above = fully grown adult animals, only mutated animals should have power level above 80 adult animals, make normal animals to regenerate health slow, lower HP and damage, make mutated animals to regenerate faster much higher HP but low to moderate damage, so one or even two people would not be able to keep up with enough damage to lower HP on mutated animal, there is your solo and group content, this will not make animal over powered and will have proper settings for materials (normal animals, from hamster to bears, not mutated).
Remove blueprints from scavenge loot table and add them to learning.

[MrDDT]

Znaiika you glossed over the fact that I like playing with people and teams. You like solo.

If you want solo, don't play MMO's pretty simple concept. You might think I only want to dominate everyone but what I like is to play with other players, it's the social aspect I like. Which is why I play MMOs.

I like to play RPGs because I like building and advancing a character and story that is involved in a large world of players.

Unlike you my play style requires me to play MMO's, your play style not only doesn't need other players, but you don't even need to be online to play it.

Yes there are lots of ways to let and promote people to hunt. Xsyon currently has no system like that in place. It actively discourages people to hunt together. I don't think it was meant to, but all the systems in place and all the changes to those systems have make it where grouping is harder and worse than solo hunting.
You know the system of looting was sorta like you said only, everyone got quality based on their OWN skill. They removed it from the game.

There are lots of ways to make animals and mutants harder, but that has not even been done at all. In fact animals have got easier with less and less HP and power. Because a few vocal people wanted to be able to solo and do everything.
Animal regeneration is completely crap. Whole thing needs to be fixed from the ground up.

No idea what you mean "learning" in your last statement. You already can learn blueprints.


One of the biggest problems in my opinion is that Xsyon gives your opinion equal weight as anyone else, even though you clearly do not have a sound grasp on MMO's, Xsyon, or RPGs, nor what you even want. He listens way to much to people like you and to little to himself and players with plans that were discussed between a group of people and ALL views were taken into account and worked out the details.
Where is the group of devs or GMs that question and tested by players and see what might work best before it was even coded or planned fully?

[znaiika]

DDT, you may not notice but you sound more solo then me, you don't even know what MMO means, you don't know what it means to share a same world with everyone else, your aim is to dominate not playing alone side with everyone else, that's why you tell everyone to go play single player, because you want all attention to your self, this is not RP style.

By learning I mean all kinds of blueprints should be learn only not in a loot table.

[MrDDT]

All blueprints are learnable from using the skill.

I tell people that I think are trying to change an MMO into a single player game to go play what they would like, a single player game. People that want to play with other people should play MMO's.

Znaiika you really should play Xsyon and learn a bit about it before trying to change it. All I ask is learn it first, then offer suggestions that you think might be for the betterment of the game. Not just how you would like it better, but both for the game and yourself.

[znaiika]

I know that blueprints are learnable but they are also in a scavenge loot table, I am asking to remove them from loot table.
Well, tell me if this is fair, some vets leveled their skills when it was easy to level, now they only need to maintain skills from decaying, but for a new player it would take years to level skills playing at least 4-6 hours a day every day, this is a perfect recipe for dominance.
To make it fair, let people raise their skills without decay then at high level about 95 decay would kick in, or simply add another server with controllable skill decay on all skills.
Why do you worry so much about adding third server? afraid that most people would play there? afraid that people would choose server with more freedom? third server will not effect current servers in any ways, so: why are you so worried about?.

[thurgond]

I don't think any skill that was ever easier to level, specially architecture.

You youngsters don't know how easy you have it. Back in the day there were no blueprints, you lost all materials when you disassembled something, you couldn't grid posts because there were no wood posts, for a long time trees did not regrow so if you wanted wood you had to run into the mist and hope you could chop a tree down before you died, of course there were no carts to carry building materials around, and you did not get inspires if you used green points to raise your skills.

[geezer mode off]

[znaiika]

I am not talking about Back in the day, maybe a year before skill decay patch.

[MrDDT]

You know Znaiika, that Architecture CAN NOT decay?

So what you are talking about and asking for is already in place for that skill. Again another issue that you are having is that you DO NOT know or understand the game or what you want.

Wainwright and Architecture do not decay. (I wish they would, but that's a different story and why)

Why do I worry about a 3rd server? Because much like the WAR / PEACE server did was split up 2 very low populations. Is the PEACE (AKA PVE) server more populated than the WAR (AKA PVP) server? Yes. But combine the servers and you would have had more people than you do now on 1 server which is better. There is also no reason why WAR and PEACE couldn't have worked on the same server. Just make areas of PVP and areas of PVE only.

You say that a 3rd server would have no effect on the current server except you are missing one major factor. You would again split or even pull away a few people to another server making the current low population even feel lower.


FYI all skills are controllable for decay. Maybe not as much as you like but they are.

[znaiika]

Wasn't me talking about Architecture for one.

PVP and PVE on one server will never work since PVPers want all goodies in one tiny place which ruins everything.

Some may move to third server but over all more people would play the game, so it's better for Xsyon.
So you do agree people would play on third server with controlled skill decay?

Currently you have to reach that level to easily control decay which would take very long time, which is tedious and not fun.

[MrDDT]

Blueprints are in Architecture so you were talking about that.

PVP and PVE did work, and still would work on 1 server. Maybe not in the way you would like it (you don't even like the current PVP or PVE server so that is kinda pointless).

Of course some would play on a 3rd server. People that didn't know, people that thought the name sounds cool or whatever. But that doesn't mean it's a good idea.

No quite the opposite. When you have a few skills to worry about, decay is not a problem. Most new players just do not understand how the lock system works. It's not until you get 3+ skills that you do not want to decay PER pool that it starts to effect you.

But again, its a lack of understanding the game. Your suggestions need to be bounced off other people to vet them to make sure what you want isn't already in the game and what you are asking for would even work. Then as a group of people talk about your ideas and work out issues and details then maybe that idea can come out to be something worthwhile. I'm not say get people to vote on it, but you need to really understand how things work before you can come up with working ideas.
Currently you are either suggesting things that are already in game, would not work like you want because of how the game is, or break other systems in the game that you already like or want. Plus a few other issues. Without even getting to the point of me disagreeing with your basic idea, just the fact of what you want wouldn't even work the way you are suggesting.
On top of all that, you do not believe me when I say things, you have this idea that I want everything the way I want it to rule the world or something.
Not sure if you know this, but I deleted my toon for this very reason. So I can offer advice on the game without people like you convinced that I'm only out for myself. I also deleted my whole town and about a million in $ in game. So before you try to say things like "your aim is to dominate" please think about what I just said and did. If that were my aim why would I delete the strongest toon in the game and all the riches he had? Yeah, kinda contrary to what you are saying huh?

Anyways, my advice is that really 1 single server is best with areas of PVP, and mostly PVE. I also think that a change to how the skill system works currently is needed where instead of able to learn all skills to 100. Only allow like 2 or 3 per pool to 100. Or a set amount of skill points per pool total.

[znaiika]

Blueprints are in Architecture so you were talking about that.


Anyways, my advice is that really 1 single server is best with areas of PVP, and mostly PVE. I also think that a change to how the skill system works currently is needed where instead of able to learn all skills to 100. Only allow like 2 or 3 per pool to 100. Or a set amount of skill points per pool total.

Oh I see why are you all talking about architecture, what I meant was blueprints, recipes and such anything that can be learned in skills like toolcrafting, leathercrafting, architecture, and so on.

PVP would work on the same server with PVE if there is no advantage over one another the only difference would be is ability to PVP not controlling resources nor more animals nor more resources nor best resources and so on, people would know that PVP zones are a war zones and entering or setting a tribe in those zones would be at their own risk.

I agree with you about allowing 2-3 skills per pool to 100 or setting skill points per pool but all pools need to have equal pools not one pool with 2 skills and other one with 10, all need to be 4 or 5 skills per pool except for combat skills, and skills that are action skills should be excluded such as running, jumping, swimming and such.

[Dorsie]

well ddt , you're still goin strong on pvp , no ?
doesn't matter , but znaiikas idea about bp's and such is kinda weird too . I tell you some facts znaiika , there is no way to learn all schemes or whatever you call it , not even in one skill , its a hard cap . I started at war and guess what , at architect 95 i still get some worthless gadu bp's , and at scaving at 95 its just the same , no wall ot gate or anything worth the time running around.
my guess is , all has been nerfed for mist tribes sell , which none really has a use of , vets have all bp's anyway and newbs can't buy them , lol
but one thing is right , znaiika , there should have been a clean server with the so called early access , because people wonder why they find carts with 6k+ days or scrap piles with ghost towns on it or beeing destroyed by players from early days
But that is up to jordi , no matter what we say here , because the usual answer is " why you hate this game " , go play something else :P
And the vision of multiplayer is gone long ago , when people tell you it's a game not a chatroom , so jordi should log anonym and check the facts to get a grip of what is actually going on
Another wall of sad text , but maybe there will be a change in the future
Anyways , still playing and get frustrated , but enjoy the game more or less :P
but after writing that , and be told i have to log just makes me smile , another annoying feature , lol

[MrDDT]

I think a clean server would work but not one like znaiika is saying.

What you need to do is have a full clean server, after all the combat and adding a few more content into the game.

Make the new server PVP and PVE with areas for both. Make the PVP areas a lot more dangerous with animals, and allow those areas to give a slight bonus to skill gain or resource gathering speeds.
Then also have some PVE areas do the same that have increased areas of animals. These would be like extreme areas only like 5x harder.
This would give BOTH PVE and PVPers a reason to do being in those areas. Also it will allow PVEers that like PVP here or there but not 24/7 to have places to go fight other players and reasons for skilling up combat skills and having the best armor.

I can come up with a lot of good ways to make such a server good for BOTH sides. The best thing to do would get a few players together to talk about how to make a clean server work. Also come up with a to do list of what needs to be done BEFORE this server would really even work.
Then market the crap out of the game as being "released" and take it out of Prelude.

You can give VET's a name reservation option and maybe even like a 7 day headstart. This would allow people to make tribes and place totems before "new" players to the server.
I also think that totems should COST resources to build so any joe can't just place totems anytime they want. I've talked about this before.
http://www.xsyon.com/project.php?issueid=1230
One of the Dev's long ago made this post using my forum thread.
It was well received. (Even says it was Implemented) but it really wasn't not in this way.

There are major reasons why you just don't want to start a clean server right now without adding in a few changes and some more content. I would expect that if you added another server the other 2 would close down due to the lack of people.

[znaiika]

Blueprints should only be available through learning not scavenging or trade, much like cooking the higher the skill the better recepie you get.
DDT, I do not agree with you, I would agree if there would be one place in the middle of the map and PVE only with extreme settings you describe, only no one will be able to set a tribe there to benefit from bonuses all the time and all animals and resources should respawn daily, all other areas PVP or PVE should be normal, no extra benefits, this will encourage people to group-up before heading to that extreme zone, and this will not have unfair advantage over people who live far away and don't want to PVP.
PVPers should not have anything extra, just because it's a PVP zone dose not mean they are special.
If you do not agree with me that pvp should not have extra benefits over pve then there is no point of having one server with both pvp and pve, best keep two servers to avoid any complications.
First time totem placement should be free than it should cost resource, more times you place totem within short time the more source cost it will be, could be set to one or to two weeks then reset.

Let me guess, your few players are going to be selected and have privet third party chat so everyone would know what to say and when, much like at the moment.
And skill decay really needs to be adjusted at the moment it's total mess.

[MrDDT]

Znaiika, I agree that blueprints (recipes of all types) should be through learning and remove them from the scav table. For a few reasons.
1)They make no sense to have them they would be unlikely to make it through and they surely would not be that common.
2)It makes scavenging so powerful with recipes/blueprints in them.
3)Promotes people do to use their trade to get the recipes.

Why I like recipes/blueprints in the scav table is because you could trade them around because what you are asking for would make recipes/blueprints very hard to fill what you need correctly. I suggest removing them from the scavenging option and put them into a skill that makes recipes. Give a few mats like wood/paper, some charcoal, and high enough skill on cartography or something and able to make maps and recipes/blueprints. You could even add an another material (or 3) in there for random stuff. This would allow people get recipes/blueprints they need in trade still.

Be careful what you wish for though. Without adding it in a skill like I just said, not having a tradeable option of recipes/blueprints would really change the way the game is played for many people, and I think it would not fit your style of play whatsoever as you would then need to grind a skill A LOT to get the recipe/blueprint you want. Which sounds like is what you don't want and I don't think you understand how hard it would be.

You say you don't agree with me, but then describe what you want, which is what I just said. If I didn't make it clear in my post, then assume what you just said is what I want.

About the PVP areas, I didn't ask for anything extra in a PVP area that wouldn't be in the PVE area. I said PVP areas would be extreme areas like the PVE extreme areas. Meaning a lot harder animals/monsters, faster resource gathering, and faster skill gains. In extreme areas. Which is where you would ONLY find PVP areas, but some would not be PVP enabled. Does that make it clear?

Yes much like you have at the moment, only with active parties and not people that don't play or 7/10ths of them are inactive.

[znaiika]

I agree on new skills like cartography or some sort for recipe/blueprints but not in scavenge, but for the moment Xsyon can adjust the rate of learning them, at low level higher rate to learn low level recipes low rate to learn high level recipes, at high level low rate to learn low level recipes and higher rate for higher level recipes where intelligence will play a major roll of learning rate.

As for pvp zones: with your suggestion you will create dominance simply because some people will occupy those zones and claim them under totems and the rest? well? you figure it out.
Like I mentioned in my previous post, there needs to be only one zone or several thru-ought land/map on pve side only so everyone could go there pveers or pvpers with settings as you describe but no one should ever could claim it/those with a totem.

[MrDDT]

Znaiika let the PVPers fight over the PVP land, if you don't like PVP stay out of it and goto the other areas the map. Not sure why you think it would be a problem for you, you wont go there. So what does it matter to you?

If you are talking about the PVE extreme areas, well if you feel like that will be there areas where everyone will want to be, you would be limited just as you would under any PVE game either claim it or you don't get it and have to wait. This is a major reason why a LOT of people like the PVP option because they can force 1 man tribes to leave or people living there that don't really use it or whatever reason.

If you think that there wont be enough room you can fight that battle then, currently extreme zones are not even remotely populated. In fact quiet the other way around.

[znaiika]

Then the best is to leave pvp out of pve and keep everything equal with no special zones, pvp have their server then fight in there, no need for creating dis-balance. You want to create special zones on pvp is fine with me, just to see how people like it then.
All I am asking is to add a third server with controlled skill decay or distribute skills in even pools 4-5 skills per pool then the current system would work fine with even skill pools, remove any and all crafted parts like blade, saw blades, spades and such and add them to crafting skills, also remove blueprints, recipes and such from scavenging and fix learning so people could learn them accordingly, is that too much to ask?

[MrDDT]

I do not understand you, I tell you that you can have areas just how you want them and then you say no.

You can't get a new server for every change in the game you want. It sounds like you don't like scavenging or dealing with other players and you want to be a solo player. It sounds like an MMO is not for you and surely not Xsyon.

[znaiika]

What you propose is dominance, I propose equal rights for everyone and freedom to do anything people want to do and how, without dominance over one another.
How I want? I want that no one can place totem in those areas for extra benefits and keep people from dominating over one another in any way, but with pvp mixed with pve thing only get worse.
With my proposed settings there will be more RP then you think, because people will not be restricted to anything, for example! why did Xsyon restricted from trapping an animals by simply digging a hole? which is the same as in the RL, because you did not want people to keep animals trapped.
I get it, you just want one server for you and some of your friends and keep away people from playing so you would have good excuse to keep Xsyon believe that he is on the right tracks without noticing what is really happening, which is, you want to create SP in a form of MMO knowing that people would not play and thus keeping Xsyon developing game just for you and your little crew, you don't want to play alone-side with many people with equal rights, that is why you need small areas for easy control, and create a skill system that only works for a small group. Telling me that I need to play SP? solo play dose not mean SP, with the right conditions can and will be a part of a big community but it has to be free will and unrestricted.

[MrDDT]

Yes because trapping and perching animals and mutants like that is totally the way games work.
There is a reasons game makers do things set to a difficulty lvl. If you bypass that or cheat those designs you are hurting yourself and the game balance. The rewards need to be changed and it would remove challenges.

Anyways you will never understand you keep trying on changing the game to how you want it. Good luck.

[znaiika]

Yes that how it works in RL, difficulty level can be set without screwing up with people and without restrictions I did explained that in this thread.
It's not only how I want it is for people and equality not dominance not restrictions.

Placing small zones with bonuses so you could drop totem on top and claim it for one self called challenges?

[chojinuk]

What you propose is dominance, I propose equal rights for everyone and freedom to do anything people want to do and how, without dominance over one another.
How I want? I want that no one can place totem in those areas for extra benefits and keep people from dominating over one another in any way, but with pvp mixed with pve thing only get worse.
With my proposed settings there will be more RP then you think, because people will not be restricted to anything, for example! why did Xsyon restricted from trapping an animals by simply digging a hole? which is the same as in the RL, because you did not want people to keep animals trapped.
I get it, you just want one server for you and some of your friends and keep away people from playing so you would have good excuse to keep Xsyon believe that he is on the right tracks without noticing what is really happening, which is, you want to create SP in a form of MMO knowing that people would not play and thus keeping Xsyon developing game just for you and your little crew, you don't want to play alone-side with many people with equal rights, that is why you need small areas for easy control, and create a skill system that only works for a small group. Telling me that I need to play SP? solo play dose not mean SP, with the right conditions can and will be a part of a big community but it has to be free will and unrestricted.

DDT said both PVP and PVE areas would have bonuses, did you even read that.

Your suggestings are about bypassing skill gained, from a skill based game.
Why not just have a button marked "give it to me now" and have done with it.

You are banging on about stuff you know nothing about, you are not even playing the game at the moment,


As for Vets having everything, firstly there are very few vets playing, and how can they stockpile the
new arch BPs when they have only just been added.

interesting how you hide behind your forum name, dont want ppl to know who are ?

Sark

[znaiika]

DDT also said PVE would only have few of those areas which some people will drop totem and keep them from the rest of players.

Bypassing? How?

Are you sure?

BPs have been for a wile now for your information, I guess you just started to play, only few vets still playing because other vets left due to changes were made, many which I stated in these forums, many of those vets has been harassed in the game.

Why would you need to know my name?

[chojinuk]

DDT also said PVE would only have few of those areas which some people will drop totem and keep them from the rest of players.

Bypassing? How?

Are you sure?

BPs have been for a wile now for your information, I guess you just started to play, only few vets still playing because other vets left due to changes were made, many which I stated in these forums, many of those vets has been harassed in the game.

Why would you need to know my name?

In your post :

"How quality should apply to crafted items."

you said "I suggest to add quality to resource type not from how good your skills are"

That is clearly bypassing the skill be it scavving, logging, rock pulling etc

im talking about the new arch BPs specifically the Trusses, Canti's and railing. The vets you refer to have had access to them for the same amount of time as everybody else or do you think a vet is someone who started a year ago.

Funny how you deflect my question with another question, I guess its easy
to criticise when you hide in anonymity

Im done feeding the troll, unlike MrDDT i dont have the patience.

Forum Mods please lock this thread as it is going nowhere.

Sark

[znaiika]

In your post :

"How quality should apply to crafted items."

you said "I suggest to add quality to resource type not from how good your skills are"

That is clearly bypassing the skill be it scavving, logging, rock pulling etc


Sark

And how is it bypassing? did you read further on? I explained how skills would be used.

Closing a thread is easier then to explain your opinion is'n it?

[Glorp]

mO.Om

Fish...I still love fish...but i burn most i catch.

I have to post before the thread gets locked.

When i started playing a couple years ago, I also hated the fact that at a certain point some skills decreased as i rose in others. I was used to the older mmo's that did not have this feature. But Xyson has alot of things that mimic Real life...soo i give some examples: In real life when younger i was a semi pro Bowler, a self taught musician (there are more but i'll just use these two)...I am a skilled Plumber but no longer work out in the field but still apply to customers the skill of my trade (Home Depot)...Now...if i were to pick up my Bass or a bowling ball...I would have a hard time remembering how and what to do to achieve the results i once had...So, same as in Xsyon, if i am 100 in a skill and i learn something new and that previous skill decreased...How? is that any difference than my Real life...None...So the game works.

MrDDT and I have had our differences but if you have an open mind to all the different personalities there could be...all he is doing is using Facts. Instead of holding a grudge, try learning to debate...no one really wins but the real issue at hand is made clearer. Xsyon is a pretty well made game ( would have been better without the server split but water under the bridge). but you have to agree at some point that unless something is added to make grinding to all 100 stats worthwile...you dont need to. This...is why people leave...your acomplishments ( besides building a leggo castle ) are for naught.
Xsyon will not be a WoW or Archeage or anything else you might try to want it to be. With all the past whining and complaining ( myself included ), He has done quite well with his vision of what the game is meant to be.

So my last comment before a lock is No...dont change the skill system...Yes...add a reason we all want the best gear and finish adding the features that should have been here since Launch...then...people will return or come anew.

Glorp

[znaiika]

Well, the crew has an instruction as I suspected, so be it, population will not increase unless Xsyon will stop making bad changes.
Unless Xsyon is OK with this special crew who most likely under-funding Xsyon.
Xsyon, if I were you I would stop wasting my time because this game will never have even fair income.