Turn PvP into a f2p server
issueid=2665 02-25-2020 08:12 PM
Static
Turn PvP into a f2p server

From what I can see here the most squeeky wheel gets the oil.

So when pve asks for building upgrades ~ they get them.

So when pve asks for farming ~ they get them.

So when pve asks for pets ~ they get them.

However what meaningful update has pvp got since the server split? We got blocking and ranged skills removed from the skill menu instead of finished, is that truely a update for pvp? I log in today and see nothing if anything meaningful changed from the aspect of a pvper. In fact you could say the server is worse off now cuz cats, dogs and anything smaller doesn't even attack you back so theres no way to train new players for hunting larger game with smaller game, I understand its a problem for people on pve with no hps to die randomly to a cat or a marmot but people on pvp don't share this issue, in fact, this update took away from pvp in a pretty meaningful way.

In fact, pvp is actually a broken server, since the synergy between players, crafters and fighters, works together to create a functional economy. By removing all the crafters from the pvp server you effectively have RUST where a bunch of fighters run around with the lowest equipment, no armor or useless armor cuz there is little to zero crafters in the game and nobody gets beyond the stone age.

This makes the game unfun when you remove the synergy between crafters and non crafters by splitting them between two servers.

Solution:

Add f2p to pvp.

PvE people don't want to deal with f2p people or pvp people, thats fine, however pvp cannot function as a completed game without crafters and pve players on the pvp server to create the synergy between players. Otherwise your asking players to buy multiple accounts in order to cover the stats required for all the skills, this is a huge investment at $32/ea account spending nearly a hundred dollars just to get the 3 accounts required to cover everything... Or this could be 3 players working together, trading with each other or even in the same tribe, as the game intended.

There is zero downside to adding f2p to pvp since you won't upset your pve players.

There is a up side since you would be letting players like my room mate play the game and get a taste of it before buying, who would otherwise most likely never buy your game due to how low the population is and how seemingly there is never anyone online. This would also give the community much needed new players that would not have the option to go to pve as f2p and thus would be more invested into pvp, more likely to stay on pvp even after since they would have invested in skills, stats and formed relationships with other players.

As f2p you would see large numbers of new people play the game and word would spread out about it.

I understand the server split was due to the guides having endless issues with pve minded people so this server would ideally be one that guides would NOT interfere with and would let players sort out their own issues that where not bug/glitch/stuck related.

I don't think its fair to blame players for having issues with each other and asking guides to step in, I think its the guides who are a problem for abusing their powers by interfering in situations between players, healing players, spawning animals, spawning items. Guides should be exclusively for bugs/glitch/stuck and nothing else, if this was true, than the pvp server even with many f2p would never become the problem big enough to the guides that they advised jordi to split to pve and pvp.

I'm saying don't interfere on PvP after adding F2P, let nature take its course, let people have less thunder of the mouth and more lightning of the hand.

I want to see this game do well. But saying its doing well cuz some folks play PvE while ignoring whats happening to PvP would just simply not be the truth.

I'd like to change this however from a PvP server aspect; I'm not seeing the same love PvE gets, so it feels like a situation of the squeekyest wheel getting the oil here.. so I'd like to squeek a bit about things pvp needs so maybe we can get some oil to fix the glaring problems with the server that cause people to not want to play it.
Issue Details
Issue Number 2665
Issue Type Feature
Project Suggestions
Category Unknown
Status Rejected
Priority 1 - Highest
Suggested Version Unknown
Implemented Version (none)
Votes for this feature 0
Votes against this feature 0
Assigned Users (none)
Tags (none)




03-23-2020 02:02 AM
I tried Free to Play with limitations for a while and it didn't work out well.

New players couldn't experience building their own tribes and it seemed that many weren't invested in the game enough to really experience what the game has to offer before deciding not to continue playing (since they didn't pay).

It also attracted griefers and players who would create alt accounts to mess with others, which was just an additional burden to deal with. (Silly things like players creating toons with vulgar names and causing problems in chat were a lot more common).

Income declined, problems increased. I know free to play works for some games (typically with much larger audiences) but for Xsyon it was counterproductive.

I'll make a few comments though:

All the updates are intended for all players, of course! Nothing is patched to just one server.

The current updates should be welcomed by PvPers, at least players that enjoy combat. The synch between players should be a lot better. Creature AI has been redone and all the variables are being balanced and will be further balanced with player feedback this week. Once regular combat is satisfactory I can add features to it.

The Peace Server was added because of a high demand for it since day one. It was launched as a way to save me from closing the game and it worked. It wasn't about the Guides, although having the two servers did greatly reduce the number of player conflicts that I had to personally deal with.

I greatly regret not launching with two servers but I can't change the past!

I did start work on a conquest system for the War Server (it's described in the Developer Zone part of the forums) but there wasn't that much interest in it. I do plan to continue and finish it but I bumped it down my list of things to do.

03-27-2020 01:58 AM
Xsyon Citizen
The sync between players is indeed better.

With that being said, I can totally get why there wouldn't be much interest in any combat at this point, most of the people that where interested in combat have given up waiting for things to change while watching things like farming, building trussing updates and various others come long before anything meaningful was done to combat.

I have to disagree with you that f2p was a problem, I remember quite a few f2p players that continued to grind even with the lv30 cap they could lock at 29 and continue to grind stats for combat, since its a pvp server folks could be more combat minded at f2p.

I agree having it so they can't build is a problem, however alot of new players where able to join pre existing tribes and build. However with the new changes to arch the lvl30 cap would mean they wouldn't be able to build even basic teepees.

Heres a solution to the no building/tribe thing. Give people the ability to setup temp camps, as in, a camp that is like a tribe, but smaller and with a time limit so that after x amount of time the totem is gone. If this time was quite a bit shorter than a tribes expire than new players could still test the game as its meant to be played, on a smaller sized tribe, but without having 950 in game days (3 months) to remove their abandond tribe.

Could put it to say 1 month of abandon time, this way if they are active they can keep going and if not than its gone without clogging the server up.

Again I don't think it should be the same 50m wide (25m all directions from totem) You could prob get away with a much, much smaller area like say 5m in all direction, or 10wide from edge to edge.

This would give another reason to buy, since it would double the size of your tribe.

I really think it would add more life to the server as well, give people to kill, create drama and conflict, give enemies and rivals to play verse and a reason to grind stats to fight... cuz if theres nobody playing theres no point in grinding combat fights cuz you never fight anyone.

03-27-2020 02:01 PM
Xsyon Citizen
possible solution to players creating alts:
Have accounts locked to steam accounts, this way you can't make a new account without making a new steam account as well, this would slow down the rate of people making alts.

Right now my wifes account automatically logs her into her account from her steam icon, I'm saying have this for everybody. Transition to the game being accessed through steam and you'll be able to lock a player to their account.

At this point you could enact the idea of having multiple characters on the same account.

The transition period for that would be weird but I would be willing to bet alot of people like say chino with his 80x accounts would be fine if the large majority of them where transitioned toward "tribe expansion" on a single character so may have to do a case by case.. but at the very least people who dont use steam would need some kind of code/key to connect their xsyon account to steam, but if you did that than you would eliminate the ability for people to just quickly make another xsyon account, since they would first than need to make a steam account and possibly "buy" the f2p on their account in order to play it.

03-27-2020 02:19 PM
Xsyon Citizen
As for player names being vulgar; solution; if you don't want some names being used, make them names you cant use in player creation, make a black list.

As for people "causing drama in global"... whats the problem with this on pvp? Let them. Don't interfere. Let them have beef with each other, it generates trade, a reason to play, a reason to grind stats and get better to GET THAT GUY! By interfering with every player interaction or beef or combat, its effectively ruining the pvp aspect of the game.

I feel that pvp should be a server that unless its something like a underground rock a player can't get rid of or some other glitch, bug or non player interaction related thing the player can't deal with, than there should be no interfering, this is not the peace server, to expect folks to act peaceful with everybody and have no conflicts is counter productive to the health of the server.

People will leave if they find out they can't actually do anything verse another player without being labeled a "griefer" and being told to stop doing what they are doing. Who cares what they are doing, they are playing your game. Again, they if they are actively playing your game you should let them continue to do so. Its my 2 cents thats its a massive mistake to try and get in the middle of every conflict or player interaction since thats the type of thing that makes the game interesting, to remove that by interfering your reducing pvp back to forced peace/pve server status.

03-31-2020 02:57 AM
Xsyon Citizen
Quote Originally Posted by Static
possible solution to players creating alts:
Have accounts locked to steam accounts, this way you can't make a new account without making a new steam account as well, this would slow down the rate of people making alts.

Right now my wifes account automatically logs her into her account from her steam icon, I'm saying have this for everybody. Transition to the game being accessed through steam and you'll be able to lock a player to their account.

At this point you could enact the idea of having multiple characters on the same account.

The transition period for that would be weird but I would be willing to bet alot of people like say chino with his 80x accounts would be fine if the large majority of them where transitioned toward "tribe expansion" on a single character so may have to do a case by case.. but at the very least people who dont use steam would need some kind of code/key to connect their xsyon account to steam, but if you did that than you would eliminate the ability for people to just quickly make another xsyon account, since they would first than need to make a steam account and possibly "buy" the f2p on their account in order to play it.
Seriously bad idea, many of us have multiple accounts and they aren't to grief with, as a solo player trying to get one toon maxed out on everything is a nightmare of micro managing, so I have three accounts to help spread the load, others have crazy amounts of accounts just to expand their tribe land.

This is my main account, the other two are totem holders, I can leave my tribe any time which lets me go out "rev bashing", I can drop a totem on them, kill them all, wait a couple of hours to make sure none respawn, remove that totem, go home and dual log with two accounts to get back into my tribe.

Not sure but I don't think you can have multiple instances of the Steam client running at the same time, especially not with different accounts, so using that huge PoS is a non starter for me.

04-02-2020 01:42 PM
Xsyon Citizen
Many people have asked for steam locked accounts so they dont need to navigate 80+ accounts of alts, they could be
1) added to the same account as swappable characters or
2) have the need for more accounts removed by adding tribe expantion locked to players instead of needing to buy a alt to get the same tribe boarder boost.

This is totally possible to run multiple clients through steam, donno what your talking about.

The only thing you wouldn't be able to do is log into multiple accounts, so folks with 80+ alts it might be a problem, but if those people where given the option to either
a) add those accounts to their main account as switchable characters or
b) removed those accounts and add them as "totem expansion" to the main account.

Seems perfectly do-able to me, not sure what your talking about.

04-02-2020 01:46 PM
Xsyon Citizen
"so using that huge PoS is a non starter for me."

Thats how everybody else feels about having to buy multiple alts.

I bought multiple alts back in the day and honestly I can't remember all the email addresses or account names for them so I've effectively lost money and wasted accounts due to losing the login info and using random gmail accounts in order to create all the emails required for all the alts.

Like another option may just simply be letting multiple accounts register from the same email and than let you select one of the accounts registered to that email, in this situation, you would be able to play different accounts from the same steam if they where all linked to the same email.

All of these suggestions I've given are better than the current system where folks need to buy 80 alts with different emails and different login information, without a place like steam to hold them together its very easy to understand that it would be hard to keep up with the accounts over the years or after a brake... they are not locked to your account so if you lost the info you lost the account.