03/24/2020 - Feedback Request - Creatures & Combat

[Xsyon]

Important Note: Revenants are not ready for testing yet. I need to update some data for them to work correctly. I updated the main post with this note as well.

The Test Server has been updated to fix the following:

- You should not be able to walk backwards to avoid attacks. Creatures should keep up with you and you should have to turn and run (or sprint) to get away. (Walking backwards to avoid attacks is NOT an intended feature - it was a bug caused by code I changed a few days ago - that's why we need testing like this! Thanks ;-)).

- Aggressive creatures should automatically aggro and attack if you get too close (instead of coming towards you and watching you)

- Situations where creatures appear walking in place should not happen now. If they do, please try to reproduce the circumstances.

Comments:

- Dodging was removed because it seemed that nobody liked or wanted it. I may add it back. First I want to make sure everything that is in place is working well and no long 'broken'.

- I've never played Dark Souls. I'll be honest, it's very unlikely that I can code a system that resembles that of a multi-million dollar budget game series like that. My goal right now is to make sure combat is simple and satisfying, clear for new players and does not feel 'broken' or 'too hard'. Then I will do my best to add to it for PvP combat.

- Once all that's listed on my main post is considered working well without bugs I will add parrying and we'll test that. I'm not going to add shields or fancy moves with this first upcoming patch but they can come in subsequent patches. One step at a time.

- Regarding revenants on King's Beach: Revenants in easy zones on abandoned tribes near the lake should die permanently when killed. Is that not happening? Do they continue to re-spawn? Or is the tribe not completely abandoned? I will take a look at that situation.

I appreciate all the feedback. Thanks!

[Static]

Heres another good example; dauntless.

The "creature" your fighting is massively stronger than you. But since you have the ability to dodge their attacks, you can prevent yourself from being hit.

At the same time, if the creature finishes its attack, it leaves a opening for you to attack them, than get out before you take more damage.

This is great combat, its a pretty popular game with a large population and aside of the "graphics" aspect the only real difference is that xsyon is missing dodge on players and counter play features by having attack animations that leave a opening for attack at some point if the right conditions are met.. I would say xsyon's combat is more complex than dauntless, by far with the directional twitch combat... so if you added some kind of side roll or side dodge WITH some sort of counter play with creatures than you would effectively have a better combat game than dauntless.

I want to also echo some good news cuz there is honestly some great things done here as well.

The way the animals are moving around is way more smooth, they look awesome and proper now, no lagg jumping or studdering.

sync between players feels more fluid now.

sync between player and objects feels more fluid/responsive.

sync between what a player is swing'n at and what they hit is more responsive.

Lots of good things here in the reduction of delay and sync between player, server and other players.

Having the weapon dmg displayed is a awesome update.

Having names for the animals your looking at so you can know how strong the bones are is also a really great and welcomed idea. Previously you could only click on their name and look at their hp and know if they are maxed by knowing if their hp is maxed. This helps remove that by knowing the names or being able to look it up on the wiki of what a max one is called for easier visual of knowing what your up verse, without having to hover your mouse over their hp, this is great.

[Static]

Another example: skyrim

You raise your shield, blocks the attack, the attack bounces off and causes a hit recovery motion on the enemy, this opens up a chance for you to hit them with your own attack.

Theres at least 3 games with examples of being able to force a miss or turn a attack into a non-hit that then opens up a chance for yourself to than attack in the opening.

This is the basics of melee combat and currently animals act like this.. however in this new patch they do not and its disappointing to see that your trying to remove the ability to see a attack coming or counter play attacks in favor of instant attacks that cant be avoided or dodged unless your doing a predictive parry right after you hit cuz you know your gona get instant hit after... this kind of combat does not inspire joy that you need to be predictive to something you cant see coming.

[Xsyon]

Regarding 'instant attacks' on the Test Server:

Attacks are not instant. The creature swings and the attack hit and damage is calculated at the end of the swing. This will give the player time to parry or dodge (when those are re-implemented).

If the attacks seem too fast - which is what is sounds like you are saying - it's because the system overall processes much faster than on the Main Servers. Creatures don't have charged attacks on the Main Servers. If the attacks on the Main Server are slower or seem like they are charged, it's simply because that old system is slow and laggy.

There are two variables at play here; attack speed (speed of the animation) and attack rate (time between attacks).
I will look into these and make sure they are slow enough for a player to react to them with a parry (or later with a dodge or block). These are easy to adjust.

Note: My main goal right now is to wrap up this first patch. My priority is finding and fixing any bugs and balancing creature variables so that combat is welcoming to a new players (that is just going to stand and click to attack).

Creature variables CAN and SHOULD be adjusted with this build. Hp and damage are not fixed numbers that I need to work around. They need to be properly balanced so that players don't feel a need to try tricks to defeat creatures.

I will not be able to add shield and likely not a proper dodge to this patch. I don't have the time or resources. (For example - anything that requires new animations is a time drain. I know how to use the tools but I'm not a skilled animator. I didn't create any of the current animations.).

Thanks!