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  1. #31
    Sorry if I sound so frusterated but I'm watching all the potential of this game, the reasons why I have continued to stick it out, get flushed down the toilet with these suggestions.

    I won't be playing if we turn this into WoW, there are alot of other games I could be playing, alot of new innovative games like "Last Oasis" that came out, its a survival game like xsyon but has a great combat system, its going to overshadow xsyon if you turn it into a WoW clone, I already know people who have quit xsyon to play Last Oasis.

    Instead of looking at games from 16 years ago, maybe look at whats being released today so you know what you need to compete with for todays standards, your not competing with games from 16 years ago today...

    Last Oasis has great multi directional combat, please stop quoting rust (a first person shooter, focused on guns) as a legitimate comparison to xsyon, cuz its not.
    Last edited by Static; 06-13-2020 at 01:45 PM.

  2. #32
    Again Last Oasis has equipable skills, just like xsyon, but they are not special attacks or WoW style boosts.

    You can equip a bandage to use on yourself if you have a bandage, this could be a great skill to have.

    You can equip your waterskin to use on yourself if you have a waterskin, this could be a great skill to have (altho kinda moot cuz you can just drink off item)

    The point I'm making is that actions are fine, but creating WoW style special attacks is not what people want in a survival game, its going to ruin the survival aspect of it and turn it into a wow or league of legends brawler.

    Its MUCH BETTER to have real time directional combat.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9MGcFE0oDQ

    People are STOKED for this game.

    I'm NOT STOKED AT ALL for WoW combat upgrade and NOBODY I've talked to that has quit xsyon thinks this is worth coming back for... So whats the point in this? Nobody is going to be stoked bout this style of combat aside of ddt and maybe some pve people, so non-combat people will love it?

    If your going to listen to non-combat players to balance combat, than again, whats the point in having a pvp server if you want teh game to effectively be whatever non-combat pve style players want?

    Why not just remove pvp and have your pve "combat is not the main focus of the game' server where everybody builds instead of combat.

    I mean if you want to ignore everybodies request for fixed pvp, than why not just delete pvp server if your goal is to have it a pve server without any focus on combat?
    Last edited by Static; 06-13-2020 at 01:51 PM.

  3. #33
    Like your talking about "other survival games"

    You notice anything weird while watching other survival games?

    NONE of them have loading bars to pick up anything or craft anything.

    Hes picking up rocks, plants ect off the ground pretty instantly.

    Yes hes gotta chop a tree to get wood, but you get resources from each chop.

    This is a "instant reward" system that doesn't exist in xsyon, your forced to use a loading bar for every task..... this means more time sitting and waiting and less time playing the game and having fun.... Adding more combat skills for spam damage is just going to support this more since you'll avoid combat while you wait for your loading bars to refresh, than spam them all on the next target... your bring'n the unfun aspect of loading bars into combat, this is really really bad.

    If you ask me, this is more of a issue with new players than the combat system, everything takes so much time to do and for no reason other than to watch a loading bar.

    Why don't you focus on this when compairing xsyon to other survival games like rust or lost oasis? Loading bars are not fun, other survival games let you pick up things and craft instantly...

    Xsyon is a completely different game and should be treated as such, not cloned after other games in the market that are old and out dated.
    Last edited by Static; 06-13-2020 at 02:07 PM.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Static View Post
    "Rust/Conan Exiles"

    You think these are combat games? Holy hell, your opinion is so moot cuz you don't play any combat games, I donno why your here talking about combat balance when you DO NOT EVEN PLAY ANY COMBAT GAMES.


    This entire comment is pretty damn stupid. Text based games have a chat system, so should we reduce xsyon combat to text combat? No? Than stop suggesting that cuz someone use's a chat box that we should use DECADES OLD COMBAT THAT NOBODY LIKES BUT YOU.
    Rust and Conan are Sandbox games, and survival games. I was not saying they are great combat. Which is exactly what I was saying.

    I do like WOW for what it is, but it's not a sandbox game. It's not a survival game. Xsyon has a lot of things WOW and many other games do not have, which is why I like Xsyon. Crafting, Building, Skills etc. I stated this before.

    I'm not sure how to make it more clear. But putting a small subsystem in from another game does not make it a clone of that game. Example was chat system, or the color rarity of items system.

    Not sure where you getting I want text based combat.


    Quote Originally Posted by Static View Post
    You keep echoing this "lagg is the reason we cant make good combat" when xsyon just stated he fixed the damn issue between server and player interactions or at least minimized it to the point where RANGED COMBAT was possible, this means, that the delay your talking about that would make pvp impossible isn't reality, plenty of people are able to play on 90-100 ping, I'm unsure what your talking about.

    If ranged combat is possible, seems obvious that pvp combat is possible too without lagg.
    Yes the desync is much better, the lag is much better, however, that does not change the inherent fact of it.

    Please just test the combat you are asking for in Xsyon, it's mostly here. Get a friend to PVP you on TEST server or PVP server. You try to parry their attacks. Because of the inherent delay of MMOs you will have major issues doing this. You need to see that they are attacking a direction, then you need to react, then you need to have enough time to do the parry. All this takes factions of a second. You have to do this in .9 to 1.6s in Xsyon with 0ping. Add in the fact you likely have 50 to 100 ping. If you live in the US. 100 to 250 if you live outside it.

    I'm echoing this because it's important. Just test it. It's the system you are asking for already in Xsyon. See how it plays out for you. I've tested it, it's 1) Not fun 2) Near impossible 3) Ends up being guesswork. 4) Ineffective for skillful play


    Quote Originally Posted by Static View Post
    I got to admit I really dislike reading your point of view..... If you love WoW so much, why are you playing this game instead of WoW? Go play WoW than if its the ultimate game? I WANT SOMETHING BETTER.
    Well if WOW had everything Xsyon has it wouldn't be WOW and I would be playing it. But it does not.
    I'm not asking for all or most or even some of what WOW has to be in Xsyon. I'm saying for 1 thing. Hotkeys for special attacks. Which almost all games have.


    Pvp players play pvp games.

    If you BOTH don't play combat pvp games than you BOTH are NOT the target market, so why argue with me if "I" am the target market since I play pvp and combat focused games?
    I've done more PVP in Xsyon than just about anyone I would guess. But also remember Xsyon is not targeting PVPers. It has PVP but it's not made for that market. It's made for everyone to have fun that wants to play Sandbox Survival. You don't have to take my word for it, Xsyon already said this.


    Dark souls, COMBAT ITSELF is fun.

    Mount & blade, COMBAT ITSELF is fun.

    Yes, there is other things going on in the game that are fun too, but the MAIN REASON people play these games is FOR THE COMBAT.

    I think maybe you losing focus here. 1) These are not MMORPGs nor are they Sandbox. 2) Xsyon is not combat focused.
    Are these combat games fun? Yes, I think combat is fun in both of these games, but they are combat focused games, that are RPG server based or even single player. It's going to be very hard to put those systems in an MMO.

    One game that does have great combat and is an MMO and considered sandbox is Darkfall Online. However, it's also semi FPS (it has FPS and 3rd person melee)

    I know you want this type of combat, I'm not saying not to ask for it. I'm saying there are likely limits. Because of those limits, you might want to see about other options than left click swing attack only as we have now.

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Static View Post
    Again the reason "combat feels broken" is due to how the creatures and players interact with each other or even players vs players
    Does combat still feel 'broken' to you?

  6. #36

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Xsyon View Post
    Does combat still feel 'broken' to you?
    As in, theres no options? Yes.

    You have one attack type. All creatures you attack only have one attack type.

    This feels very broken, yes.

    Theres no real interaction in combat, meaning that regardless of what you do the results will the be the same, every risk has the same response, theres no change, theres no out playing or out smarting what your fighting verse.

    I'm trying "really hard" to give advise to fix this instead of just saying "its broken" like other people have, however, when I see suggestions of adding a bunch of special moves instead of addressing the cores issues, than I have to say that we're focusing on the wrong things here.

    The problem is not player damage or lack of special skills.

    The problem is player interactions in combat with creatures being limited and feeling lifeless due to this.

    My suggestions are a attempt to add life.

    WoW combat would not add anymore life or interaction, it would just make killing things easier.

  8. #38
    For example if you had multiple directional attacks from creatures the same way as a player did, than you would have to block from different directions instead of just the same head on direction.

    This would mean you would have to parry from different directions than the same straight on direction.

    If you had different attacks, possibly a power attack from creatures that is slower but more powerful that you dont want to parry or dodge, would force you to change tactics and move out of the way instead of trying to parry or block.

    All of these would help add life to combat and make it feel less like a soul less mmo from 20 years ago where the creature runs up to you and you both spam attacks till one of you dies.

  9. #39
    All attacks seem too smooth and even with animation too, theres no build up or power behind it.

    Have you ever been in a fist fight in real life? Ever trained any martial arts? You can't just throw a haymaker out of nowhere, its slower at the start to build up while your loading your arm, than faster as you actually throw your arm.

    Your not wing'n your arm at the same speed as you setup/load for it.

    With respect; I'm not sure you guys have the same combat mind I do due to major lack of experience on your parts, you don't play combat games and I'm doubting you train any martial arts, so I'm unsure what experience you guys are speaking from here that would make your opinions valid if you don't play combat games and you don't think about combat or train combat with martial arts.

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Static View Post
    As in, theres no options? Yes.

    You have one attack type. All creatures you attack only have one attack type.

    This feels very broken, yes.

    Theres no real interaction in combat, meaning that regardless of what you do the results will the be the same, every risk has the same response, theres no change, theres no out playing or out smarting what your fighting verse.

    I'm trying "really hard" to give advise to fix this instead of just saying "its broken" like other people have, however, when I see suggestions of adding a bunch of special moves instead of addressing the cores issues, than I have to say that we're focusing on the wrong things here.

    The problem is not player damage or lack of special skills.

    The problem is player interactions in combat with creatures being limited and feeling lifeless due to this.

    My suggestions are a attempt to add life.

    WoW combat would not add anymore life or interaction, it would just make killing things easier.

    I think the word broken is not good here, I think a better term is boring.

    How to add life to it, is give players more options. Give the fight more things going on it. Animals special moves etc. I surely see adding special moves for players thru hotkeys the easiest way to do this.
    Can you add a system like Static is saying. I think its possible but like the current parry system, will not be fun.

    Mostly, you already have the system in for PVP. You have parry (which acts like blocking). You find out which direction the player is attacking you and you parry it. Once you parry you take 0 damage and you have 2s to attack back.
    In PVP I do not see this being used. Currently in PVE, I see it being used well, because you likely going to have group fighting where one is "tanking" using parry/dodge. The others are "DPS", where they only attack as fast as they can spinning around to the back of the creature. If it changes targets, they go into "tanking" mode of parry/dodge.
    This adds a little life to the combat for PVE. However, dodge IMO is the only real way to do anything in PVP. But I've not PVPed much with the new parry system. But I expect most of PVP (from what I've done) is using the dodge system, as parrying is too hard to figure out which direction the attack is coming in the .9s per attacks, over and over.

    Don't get me wrong, parry/dodge combat currently is an improvement, but as Static is saying you want more.

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