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  1. #11

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    prokop15 wrote:
    pottedfrog wrote:
    When all is said and done there is a lot that isn't know about any aspect of the game yet, and I love it like this, but without even a basic description the game can feel a little bland. This is just a suggestion to add a bit of flavour
    Yup, this a 3D MMORPG in 2010. It'd be a shame to actually have items with nothing but a name and an icon.

    I'm not the knitting granny type so the differences between fabric is kind of lost on me. Giving general stats on an item is akin to using your senses and intuition to determine the properties of a material.
    Yes because when I go to the store for toilet paper I pick one up in each hand and immediatly assign a number to each of it's qualities

    "Hmm...Angel Soft has a softness of 8 but only a strength of 9, But Charmin has a thickness of 12 and a rarity of 3....ooohh the choices!!"

    Yeah, not gonna happen.

    You can tell the rarity by how often you get it.

  2. #12

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    There are too many variables to determine the best uses of each item to figure it out in a short time unless you plan on launching some type of investigative experiment and spending most of your free time testing it.
    From my experience, that's one aspect of why people stay and play a game, to try and devise a way to 'crack' the way its done... maybe not down to the last factor but to a point where it can be, "I solved the cooking code".

    A Tale in the Desert, would have a different way of cooking each telling (around 1.5 - 2years to one telling). Players would spend hours stocking piling herbs (the active ingredient to cooking) and then days literally researching how cooking works, how and why it works and then charting up how they actually do it for others to use (freely).

    Metal too would require different aspects of how it was obtained, and all you had was the mine in front of you and you where to figure it out yourself. In my personal view is that the current telling (four), is the worst, its based on colour and can be rather annoying when playing the "memory mini-game" that the developer simply loves - EVERYTHING is a mini-game; including running!

  3. #13

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    ATiTD Tales 1-3 were awesome. Tale 4 was bloody stupid, and I won't be subbing for 5.

    Tale 1-3 had the right balance of gaming, collecting, mini-gaming and community. Tale 4 introduced way too many mini-games and brought about a sense of rivalry that hadn't been seen before. It led to so much 'me me me me' that many communities from T1-3 simply collapsed.

    Yes, there were still communities up and running, and a few were successful, but in the end they got the gaming and community vs 'discovering the weird way this works' wrong, way wrong.

    prokop15 wrote:
    I don't know how you've avoided it thus far, but humans are pretty fuckin' good at quantifying the properties things. Yes, if told to rate the softness of something on a scale of 0 to 1, 0 being no resistance, 1 being perfect resistance, you could give a fairly accurate approximation of the softness of a material.

    Things like weight, durability, malleability, quantity, shape, size, sharpness, density, colour, etc... would be things that we could reasonably assign an approximate value to on a scale.[/quote]

    Yup, we naturally decide which is best from looks / feel etc when we buy something. Without some form of indicator in-game, we can't do this, as we have nothing to base our decisions on.

  4. #14

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    My personal view on the items is that they are going to have a wurm like QL and also I do not think there is really going to be a big difference between the different armor types except their initial bonus and penalties(ie bone armor provides excellent melee/range protection but hinders your max movement speed so you are more susceptible to arrows/slings or whatever).

  5. #15

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    Shrimps wrote:
    prokop15 wrote:
    pottedfrog wrote:
    When all is said and done there is a lot that isn't know about any aspect of the game yet, and I love it like this, but without even a basic description the game can feel a little bland. This is just a suggestion to add a bit of flavour
    Yup, this a 3D MMORPG in 2010. It'd be a shame to actually have items with nothing but a name and an icon.

    I'm not the knitting granny type so the differences between fabric is kind of lost on me. Giving general stats on an item is akin to using your senses and intuition to determine the properties of a material.
    Yes because when I go to the store for toilet paper I pick one up in each hand and immediatly assign a number to each of it's qualities

    "Hmm...Angel Soft has a softness of 8 but only a strength of 9, But Charmin has a thickness of 12 and a rarity of 3....ooohh the choices!!"

    Yeah, not gonna happen.

    You can tell the rarity by how often you get it.
    Well until they make a game with that simulates real life to the extent where you can actually feel materials and judge their properties on your own, we're going to have to rely on numbers and properties.

  6. #16

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    I would say add attributes to items only if it's affected by a skill.
    Because the average person is not going to pick up a piece of Metal/wood/fabric/plastic and know anything about it.

    What type of material is your desk made out of?

    If you guessed MDF (meium density fibreboard)you are probably right, most furniture is now made of MDF. How well do you think MDF responds to water? Not well at all.

    The average person probably would have responded, pine, oak, or even plywood(not a type of wood!), not knowing anything about it.

    Same goes for plastic or metal. If I were to set bronze and copper of the same size and shape in front of the average person do you think they'd be able to tell the difference?

    My point being, knowing things like that takes experience.

    Gmes like WOW,AOC,DF, etc. take all the fun and mystery out of crafting, in those systems 1+1=2, but why can't 1+1=395?
    or 45+8=2?

    Figuring things out is half the fun in a new game, and is a large part of sandboxes.

  7. #17

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    If you believe finding these retarded thing out is a large part of the game, I believe you missed a very good part of every game you played.

  8. #18

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    Xsyon is not a gear based game. A wide range of armor parts are available and the player selects armor based on play style and appearance more than how stats are affected.
    [ul]Armor bulk and material affects player comfort, speed and actions.[/ul]
    [ul]Variable armor quality and durability for the same armor type[/ul].
    If stats have little affect then why have them? However items would need to have some kind of properties if they are going to have those kind of affects listed.

    So items/gear/materials need to have stats to satisfy the bullet points. But implementing a heavily stat based game contradicts the first two sentences. So how would the game developer satisfy both?

    By making stats plentiful but without any significant impact to make them worthy enough to note.

    What do players use stats for?
    To know that weapon X is better than weapon Y = gear dependant system
    To reverse engineer game formulas to compute the best gear to accomplish Z = Cookie Cutter builds = gear dependancy.

    Thus I prefer stats weren't listed because one of the things that interests me in this game was the fact it is not designed to be gear dependant. If I come across some one with two scrapper axes wearing leather, I don't want to know, based on publicly known stats what his DPS and THAC0 are compared to mine. I don't want to know that by adding Z string and Y handle increases Weapon X by +5 damage, -3 Durability, +7 Encumbrance. I'd much rather come to the conclusion that it does more damage but doesn't last as long and is a lot heavier.

  9. #19
    Xsyon Citizen Relandi's Avatar
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    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    cbowsin wrote:
    Thus I prefer stats weren't listed because one of the things that interests me in this game was the fact it is not designed to be gear dependant. If I come across some one with two scrapper axes wearing leather, I don't want to know, based on publicly known stats what his DPS and THAC0 are compared to mine. I don't want to know that by adding Z string and Y handle increases Weapon X by +5 damage, -3 Durability, +7 Encumbrance. I'd much rather come to the conclusion that it does more damage but doesn't last as long and is a lot heavier.
    Gear DOES have stats, regardless of being a "gear dependent" game or not, otherwise we might as well run around naked and swinging fists to keep it "fair".

    Thus, if there are stats, they WILL be figured out.

    So, if you think this stuff won't be figured out, put on a wiki and referenced constantly you're either delusional, or naive beyond belief.

    Welcome to 2010, guy.

  10. #20

    Re:Item Descriptions, Stats , Bonuses on mouseover.

    Shrimps wrote:
    I would say add attributes to items only if it's affected by a skill.
    Because the average person is not going to pick up a piece of Metal/wood/fabric/plastic and know anything about it.

    What type of material is your desk made out of?

    If you guessed MDF (meium density fibreboard)you are probably right, most furniture is now made of MDF. How well do you think MDF responds to water? Not well at all.

    The average person probably would have responded, pine, oak, or even plywood(not a type of wood!), not knowing anything about it.

    Same goes for plastic or metal. If I were to set bronze and copper of the same size and shape in front of the average person do you think they'd be able to tell the difference?

    My point being, knowing things like that takes experience.

    Gmes like WOW,AOC,DF, etc. take all the fun and mystery out of crafting, in those systems 1+1=2, but why can't 1+1=395?
    or 45+8=2?

    Figuring things out is half the fun in a new game, and is a large part of sandboxes.
    There is a craft system, and, seeing as we are are being given the choice to pick 2 crafts at the outset .. wouldn't our 'player' know which material is best for which task? Otherwise, why have such a system setup at the outset instead of just having us all 'generic toon with random stuff'.

    A tailor would know which cloth would last longer, a lumberjack would know which tree will yield the best wood, a basket-weaver knows how to utilise the best rushes/grasses. Conversely, A lumberjack on would (probably) not know which leather to use for his next pair of shoes, or, a fisherman wouldn't know if the joist he just put up in his cabin will bear a roof without collapsing.

    If need be for item descriptions then , make them character-specific. So the tailor sees things on thread a woodcutter wouldn't etc.

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