PVP rules

[Gamefreak]

If we're going to have alignments, they all have to be balanced. None of this bull shit with evil players getting shafted in terms of skill grind and skill loss on death.

That will not work, because who the hell would want to play evil in that case? It's like having an option to use a gun or a knife in a fight ...

My tribe isn't going to be an evil tribe, nor am I going to have an evil play style, but for god's sake, is it that hard to see there is a problem with nerfing one alignment?

It's not going to work, period.

[MrDDT]

Yep. Someone needs to learn the effective implementation of situational awareness.

But okay, how about this? You get a free hit every few minutes. Or, you can't get a penalty unless that player dies and you did over 50% of the damage or something. The "shit happens" fudge factor. Though, honestly, if a player is running between you and a bear I don't know why you wouldn't use his ass as a freaking shield.

So if someone jumps in your AOE and dies, what then? I mean I can get myself low on life and jump in peoples AOE and die. Now you are screwed.

Gamefreak, I agree but the bonus to being Evil is you can loot whomever you choose. Plus you can skill them (causing them skill loss for a while 2x more than a KO).
There is a bonus to being Evil. If you cant take the punishment then dont be evil.

[Shrimps]

Ok, here is the problem with that.

A little idea for this.

Im good player, and you are fighting a bear. I jump in front of you while you attacking a bear. BAM you hit me. Guess what? You are now going to be punished for hitting me. So I kill you, then the bear, and take all your goods. Thanks have a nice day.

Notice a problem there?

The player who gets hit would receive the option to forgive the agressor. If they accept everyone gets on with life. If they do not forgive them then both players can fight it out or whatever. Whenever they do not forgive the leader of both tribes are alerted to the situation and are also alerted as to who got hit first and who died. kind of like an AAR (After Action Report).

The tribe leaders can either decide it was an accident, forgive the aggressor and be happy happy bestest buddies forever. They can decide not to forgive the agressor and exile him and still be happy happy bestest buddies forevererererer. Or they can disagree on who was at fault and one tribe forgive the agressor and the other doesn't and they go to war also affecting the tribes alignment. This would increase the need for politics which I think is a good thing.

If a player is exiled from a good or neutral tribe they cannot rejoin another one for a certain amount of time. And they can never rejoin a tribe they were exiled from.
They are dropped one alignment level for every 3 incidents (being exiled, performing a "kill" move on an unconscious opponent.)

A player can regain an alignment level by doing a "spirit trek" (keeping with the lore). Spirit treks would be very difficult and very long and should be a tremendous undertaking.

Tribes are affected by attacking other tribes without declaring war first moreso for tribes of the same or higher alignment eg. good-> good or neutral -> neutral.(example above)
Tribes aignment can also be affected by having a number of other tribes of the same alignment declare embargos on them for doing things such as jumping in front of attacks or hassment.

Evil tribes should sustain a much larger penalty than good tribes but a minor amount more compared to neutral tribes.

people not in a tribe are essentially a nonfactor and can be treated as neutral.
But heres a sugestion anyways.
You would need to kill 5 or more solo players before your tribe drops an alignment level. Total acummulative per 2 months. So if you killed 4 the first day of the first month you would have to wait 59 days to kill any more. You can also mark individual players for death if they have done any damage at all to any of your players within the last week. If a week goes by where no damage is done to your members then the mark is removed.

Individual players can also be marked as a troublemaker if multiple tribes mark him as such which would effectively turn him evil untill the tribes removed their mark.

Honestly there are no npc cities. there are not wilderness buildings for you to use. So how would you do anything except pick your nose and run in circles outside of a tribe? I suppose you could use a tribes city but then you might as well just join a tribe.

I'm not entirely sure people understand that penalties for evil are supposed to be so bad that only 10% of players will want to be evil. There are around 1500 pre orders so 10% of that would be 150. Not everyone is intended to be evil unless of course you want darkfail 2.0

[mrcalhou]

So if someone jumps in your AOE and dies, what then? I mean I can get myself low on life and jump in peoples AOE and die. Now you are screwed.

Or, you can't get a penalty unless that player dies and you did over 50% of the damage or something

^

Gamefreak, I agree but the bonus to being Evil is you can loot whomever you choose. Plus you can skill them (causing them skill loss for a while 2x more than a KO).
There is a bonus to being Evil. If you cant take the punishment then dont be evil.

That's something, sure, but I'd still like to see other benefits and trade-offs too. Like possibly some buffs and debuffs (If you're evil you get a damage buff, but an HP debuff...or something just throwing out ideas), and possibly even different skill lines, like in Infamous.

[mrcalhou]

A player can regain an alignment level by doing a "spirit trek" (keeping with the lore). Spirit treks would be very difficult and very long and should be a tremendous undertaking.

Heh, I like this.

The stuff before this, however, I'm not exactly a fan of because it fails to take into account players that aren't in a tribe.

With regards to 10% of players being evil because of penalties, that's fine and dandy, but there should definitely be a reason for them to want to be evil. Regardless of the intent, there should be pro's and con's to anything in this game. Make the penalties for being evil really terrible, but make the benefits good to compensate. Trust me, a lot more people will still choose the easy way. Darkfall failed in this regard becuase there were practically no penalties. It didn't balance out. If the Devs want it to actually work, then it has got to be balanced.

[Shrimps]

people not in a tribe are essentially a nonfactor and can be treated as neutral.
But heres a sugestion anyways.
You would need to kill 5 or more solo players before your tribe drops an alignment level. Total acummulative per 2 months. So if you killed 4 the first day of the first month you would have to wait 59 days to kill any more. You can also mark individual players for death if they have done any damage at all to any of your players within the last week. If a week goes by where no damage is done to your members then the mark is removed.

Individual players can also be marked as a troublemaker if multiple tribes mark him as such which would effectively turn him evil untill the tribes removed their mark.

Honestly there are no npc cities. there are not wilderness buildings for you to use. So how would you do anything except pick your nose and run in circles outside of a tribe? I suppose you could use a tribes city but then you might as well just join a tribe.

Also edited this into original post.

[MrDDT]

The tribe leaders can either decide it was an accident, forgive the aggressor and be happy happy bestest buddies forever. They can decide not to forgive the agressor and exile him and still be happy happy bestest buddies forevererererer. Or they can disagree on who was at fault and one tribe forgive the agressor and the other doesn't and they go to war also affecting the tribes alignment. This would increase the need for politics which I think is a good thing.

So Im a good tribe, but I let all my people kill anyone I want? Only problem with that is that maybe a tribe will war me? Haha How is that a punishment? and some Tribe faction loss? Cant tribes war other tribes anyways?

"Ok guys, we killed 10 random people this week, need to cut it out for a week til we get back to being good. Haha."

"Oh look that guy has a ton of good costly items on him, We still have 10 kills left this week"

Exploit it pretty easy like that.


Quote Originally Posted by mrcalhou View Post
Or, you can't get a penalty unless that player dies and you did over 50% of the damage or something

So 3 people can kill 1 guy without punishment? Cool. That sounds fair. As long as I have 2 friends I can kill any person I want and still we are all good. But if I do it man to man, no no no I will be evil for that. Hahaha

[MrDDT]

people not in a tribe are essentially a nonfactor and can be treated as neutral.
But heres a sugestion anyways.
You would need to kill 5 or more solo players before your tribe drops an alignment level. Total acummulative per 2 months. So if you killed 4 the first day of the first month you would have to wait 59 days to kill any more. You can also mark individual players for death if they have done any damage at all to any of your players within the last week. If a week goes by where no damage is done to your members then the mark is removed.

Individual players can also be marked as a troublemaker if multiple tribes mark him as such which would effectively turn him evil untill the tribes removed their mark.

Honestly there are no npc cities. there are not wilderness buildings for you to use. So how would you do anything except pick your nose and run in circles outside of a tribe? I suppose you could use a tribes city but then you might as well just join a tribe.

Also edited this into original post.

Why 5?
Also, I make 3 tribes and mark you troublemaker. Ok now you branded for life as a troublemaker. That sounds cool and fair.

So I jump in front of you, and you hit me once. Now I can brand you for ANYONE to attack and kill you without punishment? Haha fun.

This is a cool game, keep them coming.

[Shrimps]

So Im a good tribe, but I let all my people kill anyone I want? Only problem with that is that maybe a tribe will war me? Haha How is that a punishment? and some Tribe faction loss? Cant tribes war other tribes anyways?

"Ok guys, we killed 10 random people this week, need to cut it out for a week til we get back to being good. Haha."

"Oh look that guy has a ton of good costly items on him, We still have 10 kills left this week"

Exploit it pretty easy like that.


Quote Originally Posted by mrcalhou View Post
Or, you can't get a penalty unless that player dies and you did over 50% of the damage or something

So 3 people can kill 1 guy without punishment? Cool. That sounds fair. As long as I have 2 friends I can kill any person I want and still we are all good. But if I do it man to man, no no no I will be evil for that. Hahaha

Why 5?
Also, I make 3 tribes and mark you troublemaker. Ok now you branded for life as a troublemaker. That sounds cool and fair.

So I jump in front of you, and you hit me once. Now I can brand you for ANYONE to attack and kill you without punishment? Haha fun.

This is a cool game, keep them coming.

If you have constructive critiscism anywere in there please let me know. But to adress the points you are unable to comprehend.

The faction loss for a tribe would be caused by attacking other tribes without declaring war first and it would be accummulative so if you ambushed a group of 5 guys from the same tribe you would get 5x the amount of alignment loss for being dicks and not declaring war like a good tribe should.

Having the ability to kill ->5<- people every 2 MONTHS is just a measure to keep tribes from getting harrassed by solos before they're able to mark them as complete assholes who are kill on sight.

Yes if you get 3 seperate tribes that all hate you enough to mark you as a troublemaker ("asshole") then yeah yoi probably deserve it and it'd save alot of greifing for our tribes. If somebody feels like being a dick and making a bunch of tribes to mark you then they would have to stay in those tribes because if they left them and the tribe disbanded then you'd be unmarked. If they did stay in them then you could contact a GM, it'd be simple for them to see that its a fake tribe and fix the situation.

You wouldn't be killable by everyone, only by that tribe and only if you damaged one of their members within a week. So if you stopped harrassing them and moved away from their location then you wouldn't have an issue.

Most of these are measures to prevent solos from greifing tribes which can be an issue since they have nothing to lose, unlike a tribe which has buildings and such.

If you have any suggestiond at all please share them instead of just crying about how everyone elses ideas suck and not contributing to the discussion.

[mrcalhou]

Or, you can't get a penalty unless that player dies and you did over 50% of the damage or something

So 3 people can kill 1 guy without punishment? Cool. That sounds fair. As long as I have 2 friends I can kill any person I want and still we are all good. But if I do it man to man, no no no I will be evil for that. Hahaha

Well, my answer was in regards to a person jumping in front of you while you were fighting a bear. But since you decided that you want to take this into a different route. It wouldn't be so difficult to think that if one player is taking damage only from other player sources, and then dies, that they should be able to flag all three of them as having been aggressive towards them.

If you want to grief me, then don't jump in front of me while I'm attacking a bear, wait until I'm in a giant orgy, then grief all of us.