Global Currency or Item for Item Barter?

[Gamefreak]

Right, but it's not as if either is going to drastically change how the game is played. If you have global currency, you will trade some sort of money for goods, if you don't, you will trade goods for goods.

Either way, they both work.

[MrDDT]

Thing about global currency, is that for it to work you would really need in game systems that use it. Which isnt really needed.
Being that there are no real human like NPCs, that you talk to and do questing and buy or sell things too, I dont see why you would want to put this system in.

Barter and trade that players make up is a better system, and more fun. These are my opinions based on many MMO's.

You dont need a global system. People will figure out what is worth something or not. You might value a knife at 10 human bones, while I might value it at 2. Im sure we can make an agreement on what its worth to each other. I dont see to have it told to me that a knife is worth 10g, and human bones are worth 1.


Edit.

Let me go on why a global system would need in game ways to spend it that have nothing to do with players trading with players. Without a system that sets the value of gold (or any item you going to use), then its worthless.

You cant say that a knife is worth 10g, without showing what 10g is worth. If I cant buy other things that relate to the knife. Then 10g is worthless.

Lets just go with this, if you have 100000g, and I have 0. But I have knives, and pigs, and crops and leather etc. But all you have is gold. Why would I ever trade you any of my stuff for your gold?
Now if I NEEDED gold for like a house, or to buy something with. Then yes I could see trading you. But unless thats in game why would I ever trade you my knife or sword for your gold?

Gold (or any item you wish to use) MUST have a use that is worth the same to everyone. Else it will never be used, or could be exploited.

[Jadzia]

My problem with barter trading is that it won't work well in a game like Xsyon. Imagine you need an item which cannot be found in your area. You know you will have to search a lot to find it, so you go with empty bin. You find your item after 1 hour of running at a tribe far from your home. It costs 10 full large bin of something. You are happy because you have a nice stock of that thing at home...but how to get it there ? You have to run home, take a full load, then run back. You can only run very slowly, the 1 hour become like 10 now. And you have to do that 10 times....

In a game where the carrying capacity is so limited, there are no carts or anything that could carry more stuffs, where there isn't any form of instant travel, barter trading would kill the economy.

And this is not theory, I've experienced this in Atitd, if the seller was far from me I didn't even bother with trading since it required waaaaaay too much running. And Atitd do have instant travel and you can expand your carrying capacity greatly.

We need something which has no weight or very very light, that we can carry around when we want to shop.

Edit: Atitd has global chat, so at least you can find someone selling your needed item on chat. Xsyon won't have global chat after launch, so you'll have to run around tribe towns to find it. In Xsyon there are no big gathering points for players like big cities or banks, as it is common in games with player run economy.

[Pandamin]

In a game where the carrying capacity is so limited, there are no carts or anything that could carry more stuffs, where there isn't any form of instant travel, barter trading would kill the economy.

We need something which has no weight or very very light, that we can carry around when we want to shop.

Spot on.

Though when money has a conciderable weight it might be interesting for banks to write out "worth papers".
Those would weigh nearly nothing.

So players could enter the bank, deposit/trade their currency with the bank manager, receive a "bond" and trade it back into currency in the city of their choosing.

Then the merchant would have to travel back with the goods, opening up a chance to get robbed by thieves.

Money having weight can open up a lot of gameplay.
Barter trading however limits too much, there is a reason why we stopped using it in real life.

[MrDDT]

I wouldnt say we stopped using it in real life. But use it a lot less I agree.

About the weight and travel. Well that would be part of the cost, you would have to find the value in it. Plus sounds like a good way to turn a buck. You goto that area with the light item resource and walk away with tons of something else. Then that light item is worth just about nothing.

Barter and trade system works and it works well. Ive seen it in WURM work fine. Works in ATITD. Just like you say, if they are far away you wont trade why? Because its not worth it. Sounds perfect. Roaming traders will be of value, and dont forget carts and stuff will be in later.

Worked well in Roma Victor, and it had SES which people rarely used because of how it was used (til much later in the game).

[Jadzia]

Barter and trade system works and it works well. Ive seen it in WURM work fine. Works in ATITD. Just like you say, if they are far away you wont trade why? Because its not worth it. Sounds perfect. Roaming traders will be of value, and dont forget carts and stuff will be in later.

In Atitd I can shout on the global chat searching for a seller of an item. If he is far from me I can use the instant travel and go to trade with him. Still, even with these features it doesn't work well there at all. If there wasn't global chat and instant travelling I would never ever run for 5 hours to find someone to sell me that stuff. I would only trade with my neighbours, and more likely I would leave the game fast because of the dead economy and because of the difficulties of buying something.

Why is it perfect if you can't trade with someone who is far from you ? In a game with low population it would be important to have the incentive to meet others. Otherwise you will only know your tribemates and perhaps the nearby tribes, let's say like 50 players ? Tribes will try everything to be self-sufficient, and as I said, economy will die.

And about carts:

There are no plans for carts. This will be added to our Suggestion List and I will consider this.

Written by Jordi, like a week ago.

[mrcalhou]

While I'm in favor of a global currency, the weight thing doesn't bother me too much, because it promotes regional, as well as, universal economies and people could even make a living as traders. It's like that in Eve: Item's have volume and you can only hold so much volume, plus, if you buy something from someone you still have to go to where it is to pick it up. The only thing is that you can't buy things that are so many solar systems away, so it's not global.

I'd piss my pants in joy if Xsyon implemented an Eve-like economy. It just works so well.

[aliksteel]

While I'm in favor of a global currency, the weight thing doesn't bother me too much, because it promotes regional, as well as, universal economies and people could even make a living as traders. It's like that in Eve: Item's have volume and you can only hold so much volume, plus, if you buy something from someone you still have to go to where it is to pick it up. The only thing is that you can't buy things that are so many solar systems away, so it's not global.

I'd piss my pants in joy if Xsyon implemented an Eve-like economy. It just works so well.

I think mrcalhou would like us to have an Eve-like economy!!!

[mrcalhou]

I think mrcalhou would like us to have an Eve-like economy!!!

What ever gave you that idea!? :3

[MrDDT]

In Atitd I can shout on the global chat searching for a seller of an item. If he is far from me I can use the instant travel and go to trade with him. Still, even with these features it doesn't work well there at all. If there wasn't global chat and instant travelling I would never ever run for 5 hours to find someone to sell me that stuff. I would only trade with my neighbours, and more likely I would leave the game fast because of the dead economy and because of the difficulties of buying something.

Why is it perfect if you can't trade with someone who is far from you ? In a game with low population it would be important to have the incentive to meet others. Otherwise you will only know your tribemates and perhaps the nearby tribes, let's say like 50 players ? Tribes will try everything to be self-sufficient, and as I said, economy will die.

And about carts:
Written by Jordi, like a week ago.

Right, but other things like pack animals or something like that were planned.

I think tribes will trade for items once they start finding out that not all resources are near them that they want. Resource control also will come into place.

Also according to your thing, I wouldnt know other tribes even with a gold type system. Because my tribe will have everything. Incentive to meet others is how resources are going to be, not if there is a lightweight money or not. With or without a lightweight money resources being limited is the key.

Now if you have limited resources, I would want trade/barter vs a light weight money system and a gold drain in game. (must have a gold drain in game or light weight money will be worthless, as said before).