A major concern.....xyson 2 carebear

[Melkrow]

Well, here is my take on this.

1. People will absolutely be crying and leaving the game if Tribe Wars feature comes out and they have a chance to lose everything that they've worked for in the last year (yeah it's probably more than a year by the time 'prelude' is over). This being a game with full local storage, people will in fact lose 'everything' (if the system doesn't change) when their tribe/town is taken/destroyed. This leads me to believe that rather than doing this Jooky will simply keep the current formula and tribes will stay protected forever, and will probably take another approach similar to Border Kingdoms in AoC where tribes can go and fight for whatever. Shame honestly, takes away from the sandbox.

2. Now what people really don't seem to get is that the current system (Prelude) greatly encourages and promotes ganking and griefing. W/out adding any meaning to PVP, without having any political implications, without having any purpose to it, the PVP that will be found in Xsyon will be a PRIME griefing gankfest type of PVP, it's gonna be pathetic. The game promotes that behavior because people will have nothing better to fight over. I can already see an entire tribe 'locked' within their protection radius by griefers who are waiting on the border for them to step out. Griefers will have more fun in this scenario while listening to the cries of others. The anti-pvp/war population will find themselves slowly leaving the game because they realize they fucked it up when they insisted on not providing a better and more meaningful outlet for PVPers to partake in.

[blake378]

i can actually see that happening just like in uo so jooky needs to sit back and and look at the potential numbers he could lose i think in this game it will be the so called "carebears" there should be some system in place to give pvp a meaning and prevent people from doing exactly what you said melkrow. excellent post +1

[Melkrow]

Also, I strongly agree that this would be a step in the right direction http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthrea...vs-Evil-or-not

To sum it up: Evil and Good tribes can fight eachother anywhere any time (even inside tribe zone). Neutrals remain as they are and can not be attacked inside their tribe. So those tribes that want some pvp action and warfare can do some good vs evil, and those that want to be left alone, they can just go neutral. It's a win win win I believe.

[blake378]

that is a very nice system do you think it should be spread into other pvp to keep smaller tribes from being perma camped and griefed anywhere they go?

[Melkrow]

Not sure what you mean, can you give an example.

[blake378]

just say for instance a 40 man tribe wants to grief a 5 man tribe whats to keep the 40man from just staying outside the tribes area and making it impossible for the 5 man tribe to leave there tribe area causing them to quit the game just because people want to be assholes. should be some mechanic in place so this wont happen

[BigCountry]

just say for instance a 40 man tribe wants to grief a 5 man tribe whats to keep the 40man from just staying outside the tribes area and making it impossible for the 5 man tribe to leave there tribe area causing them to quit the game just because people want to be assholes. should be some mechanic in place so this wont happen

why would u quit the game if that happened? it's part of playing in a sandbox.

your 5 man tribe will be surrounded by neighbors (other tribes). you use politics to decide how you want to be treated in the community. this game will be very community driven due to the mechanics. so if a 40 man tribe came into the area harrashing you. you should have backup from the community in your area i would think to push them away.

also a 40 man tribe will not camp you unless you just massively piss them off somehow (and then it's your own fault). they will be a moving herd i would think pillaging anyone and everyone that is outside his/her territory. they are there for loot/materials. they will not get anything staying in one spot camping 5 people..

this game supports a ton of scenarios. it really is a unique game, VERY sandbox. i would argue maybe the most sandbox game I have played since UO. and with teraforming it puts it beyond UO.

[blake378]

the whole uo thing is what attracted me to this game its kinda the same thing with champ spawns in uo one pvp guild preventing anyone thats in a smaller guild from doing champ spawns. any smaller tribes trying to get access to something will be denied as for the politics thing that is true and the best way to play the game imho. it works well in other games 1000 allies and having to go find pvp is better than being the small fish and getting killed all the time. but i have seen people leave games because they couldnt get access to certain things without getting ganked by bigger tribes thats where im coming from with this. something needs to be done to prevent this from happening.

[BigCountry]

if you liked UO you will love this game man.


and dont worry about being ganked. if your plant your totem in an area that ends up being 'evil' infested, just pack up and move somewhere safer.

you have lots of options in this game it seems. remember its a sandbox.

[Melkrow]

just say for instance a 40 man tribe wants to grief a 5 man tribe whats to keep the 40man from just staying outside the tribes area and making it impossible for the 5 man tribe to leave there tribe area causing them to quit the game just because people want to be assholes. should be some mechanic in place so this wont happen

I don't think you could implement such a mechanic in a free for all pvp system, I don't see a surefire hardcoded way around it, but see the suggestion at the end of the post. What can be done is give incentive to players to not do this, give them something better to do. If people are going to have to chose between camping 5 guys in their area or going out there and finding another tribe that they can fight in full force without artificial restrictions, most will choose 2nd one. But if you take that choice away (like the current Prelude system), then ALL will choose to camp those 5 players...because they got absolutely nothing else to do, no other choice (tho probably they will come up with a more creative way to grief people).

Sure you will get the occasional griefers that go above and beyond to greif certain people if they get into some sort of personal squabble, but it wont be the standard behavior (and again, I want to highlight this point, because it will be a STANDARD behavior if you don't give players any other options). In Darkfall and Mortal Online for example, you can bind camp somebody all day long, but it doesn't happen. You could go to people's cities in DF and kill them at their bindstone all day long, 24/7. But it rarely, if ever, really happens. They come in, roll the city, control the city for 5 or 10 minutes (if that) and the go about their business. Even the worst of enemies don't do this to one another because it's just a waste of time and is boring. There is always another city, another hamlet, another farmer to be killed and looted. It's really a non-issue. If you give people options to do real PVP, most will stay clear of this type of griefing.

One thing that can be done to combat this through game mechanics is with respawns. What I mean is if you respawn within your tribal area lets say 3 times in the period of 5 minutes (numbers can be changed to whatever, and only applies when killed by players), then that will trigger "anti-camp protection". Anti-Camp Protection will make it so that if you are killed in the next 5 minutes, you respawn with full HP and full Energy if you are within your tribal area. And every time you are killed within those 5 minutes (and respawn in your tribal area), the timer will reset and you get another 5 minutes. It's not a perfect solution, but it would help. The biggest problem would be when two tribes are right next to eachother so that they can both keep respawning in their own tribal areas. But since Evil players auto respawn at their totems anyway, it still gives a slight adventage to Neutrals. And also, this helps with Good tribes griefing evil ones as well. Make no mistake, there will be "Good" griefer guilds.

The thought of somebody being 100% protected doesn't sit too well with me, because it encourages shit talkers and brings forth other kinds of griefing as nobody can hold them accountable for anything because the game protects them. Most hardcore griefers usually go with the system that protects them the most so that they can hide behind bad game mechanics. People will exploit systems that gives them immunities for their actions. Accountability (to other players for your actions) is important and w/out the possibility of it, open PVP system would be better off if removed from the game.

Oh and, accountability breeds politics and civility and diplomacy.

Sorry for the typos.