To the PKers

[ifireallymust]

DF would probably drive you insane. Just a cation.

I tried DF. Boring beyond belief, very repetitive and restrictive. Getting ganked wasn't the issue, either. The issue was the hoops you had to jump through to do anything. Want a house? First, join guild. Second, take over a designated spot that is for housing. Third, hold that spot long enough to build your house. (Better make sure that guild is in a large coalition!). Utterly boring. Makes me yawn just thinking about it.

[FabricSoftener]

I tried DF. Boring beyond belief, very repetitive and restrictive. Getting ganked wasn't the issue, either. The issue was the hoops you had to jump through to do anything. Want a house? First, join guild. Second, take over a designated spot that is for housing. Third, hold that spot long enough to build your house. (Better make sure that guild is in a large coalition!). Utterly boring. Makes me yawn just thinking about it.

I like darkfall personally however with that said this community should be careful in requesting the same features as darkfall and expecting a different game then darkfall.

Just something to think about, we have a baseline we can study now.

[BigCountry]

Yeah but unlike in Darkfall, in this game, if I know I am going to get zerged next week, I can at least prepare some sort of special defense for it (AKA construction + teraforming). Not to say that would exactly work if my enemy had spies, but it would as least give me hope.

The problem with Darkfall is the attacker always knew what your city looked like, what defenses you had, etc because everything was static. The only strategic play was numbers.

[ifireallymust]

FabricSoftener: No argument from me, but waiting to see what will happen in a few months. Maybe there will be tools available to players to do something about it ourselves. I can think of several off the top of my head that might work if said players actually cared enough to take some responsibility for the defense of their own play styles.

[fflhktsn]

I like darkfall personally however with that said this community should be careful in requesting the same features as darkfall and expecting a different game then darkfall.

Just something to think about, we have a baseline we can study now.

The problem with darkfall always was, that it was only based on pvp combat, little sand in the sandbox. Yes it did make you jump through a lot of hoops to get to the sand as well.

Nobody is here requesting for any of that, we just want the unrestricted "sandbox pvp" go go with the unrestricted sandbox pve.

Gankers wont be a problem, getting your camp wrecked wont be a problem, unless your an anti-social jerk.

The pvp crowd will gladly protect other peoples pve efforts, as we need them.

Again, no one is begging for the same exact features as darkfall, that would require them removing a lot of stuff to do so. The no rules pvp can work if people have the oppertunity to do things other than just gank and destroy.

Safezones are fine for now, as no one has a means to defend, however sucking at the safe-zone teat only makes the transition into "you can lose everything" that much harder.

Do we really want a game where i can terraform once and do nothing the rest of the game because it will never be attacked?

Wheres the RP spirit? Your now an advanced pve'er but your tribe has been wiped...would it be so horrible to have to rebuild, possibly better than before and learning from your mistakes? Perhaps you need to be closer to allies...or made an error in your defenses, or had a location that was far too strategic for what it was worth.

Even with no safteynet....some out of the way...middle of no where plots of land are as good as a safe zone....

[FabricSoftener]

Yeah but unlike in Darkfall, in this game, if I know I am going to get zerged next week, I can at least prepare some sort of special defense for it (AKA construction + teraforming). Not to say that would exactly work if my enemy had spies, but it would as least give me hope.

The problem with Darkfall is the attacker always knew what your city looked like, what defenses you had, etc because everything was static. The only strategic play was numbers.

having an entire game mechanic the same as darkfall but in this game you can terraform is frankly not enough of a difference to expect a different result. I think if most people sit and think about it and are honest with themselves they can see that.

no offense but I have notice a lot of people just want to be able to trash Darkfall and then when they request the same features as darkfall they hide behind some minor difference that they claim will make all the difference in the world. Rather than being more honest with themselves or introspective to the larger outcomes of their requets be it good or bad (but I should clarify that I actually like darkfall)

Not sure if your one of those people or just simply havent fully thought thru everything

[FabricSoftener]

The problem with darkfall always was, that it was only based on pvp combat, little sand in the sandbox. Yes it did make you jump through a lot of hoops to get to the sand as well.

Nobody is here requesting for any of that, we just want the unrestricted "sandbox pvp" go go with the unrestricted sandbox pve.

Gankers wont be a problem, getting your camp wrecked wont be a problem, unless your an anti-social jerk.

The pvp crowd will gladly protect other peoples pve efforts, as we need them.

Again, no one is begging for the same exact features as darkfall, that would require them removing a lot of stuff to do so. The no rules pvp can work if people have the oppertunity to do things other than just gank and destroy.

Safezones are fine for now, as no one has a means to defend, however sucking at the safe-zone teat only makes the transition into "you can lose everything" that much harder.

Do we really want a game where i can terraform once and do nothing the rest of the game because it will never be attacked?

Wheres the RP spirit? Your now an advanced pve'er but your tribe has been wiped...would it be so horrible to have to rebuild, possibly better than before and learning from your mistakes? Perhaps you need to be closer to allies...or made an error in your defenses, or had a location that was far too strategic for what it was worth.

Even with no safteynet....some out of the way...middle of no where plots of land are as good as a safe zone....

In short you are saying (and I would agree mostly) that the darkfall combat system and pvp rule set is fine and should be used in a game like this however darkfall doesnt have much else intresting to do (like crafting, herding animals, building your own cities, dynamic mobs etc etc). On that I would agree 95%

That said, there is one change I would like to make to the darkfall/xsyon pvp engine. I would like to make it impossible to attack other people unless you are at war with them.
A war based pvp game should actually be that.

[ifireallymust]

None of the differences between DF and Xsyon will stop the giant takeover zerg if safe zones are lifted and everything else remains as it is now in the game.

However, listen up, oh hardcore pvp zerg fans, I'll post this from another thread and you can tell me why this is a bad idea (in other words, you can cry and wail about how difficult the game would become for you-as opposed to how difficult you want to make it for small tribes of crafters and solo players):

I'm not really worried about the gankers out in the world, except they're not too bright if they're slaughtering new players, unless they want an empty game world.

But what I'd love to see for pkers who kill in the territory of other tribes (after Prelude, and not counting tribes who declare war on each other) is permadeath the next time they are killed (with no way to alter that status), expulsion from their tribes and membership only in tribes of other killers subject to permadeath, and inability to trade any item or work or fight with anyone not also subject to permadeath. You might kill a hundred crafters and wipe out a dozen small tribes if you have a big enough tribe, but one death, from falling, animals, or another player, and your character is done. Reroll, starting items only, no access to that character's storage, and unless you have a tribe willing to help you out, not even a place to call home until you make one for yourself again.

I think being a pker under those circumstances would be fun, trying to see how long I could stay alive, but I'm betting the vast majority of 'hard core killers' in this game would overflow Lake Tahoe with tears if this were implemented, and it would cut way down on the number of predator players and tribes in the game.

[Zenmaster13]

Gankers wont be a problem, getting your camp wrecked wont be a problem, unless your an anti-social jerk.

The pvp crowd will gladly protect other peoples pve efforts, as we need them.

Again, no one is begging for the same exact features as darkfall, that would require them removing a lot of stuff to do so. The no rules pvp can work if people have the oppertunity to do things other than just gank and destroy.

Safezones are fine for now, as no one has a means to defend, however sucking at the safe-zone teat only makes the transition into "you can lose everything" that much harder.

Do we really want a game where i can terraform once and do nothing the rest of the game because it will never be attacked?

Wheres the RP spirit? Your now an advanced pve'er but your tribe has been wiped...would it be so horrible to have to rebuild, possibly better than before and learning from your mistakes? Perhaps you need to be closer to allies...or made an error in your defenses, or had a location that was far too strategic for what it was worth.

Even with no safteynet....some out of the way...middle of no where plots of land are as good as a safe zone....

Wow, very poor logic. First off, you are placing way to much faith in the gaming community. Do you honestly think that every good tribe or many for that matter are gonna come running across the map to defend every new player or griefed player?

Do you really think that the only reason people get ganked or griefed is because they are an anti-social jerk? How hypocritical of you. Gankers gank, and griefers grief because that is thier personality, not because of someone elses personality.

The way I see it now is: Why even bother to build, if it is just going to be destroyed. Might as well just plant baskets with gear all over the map, and go on a rampage when the safe zones are off. In other words building now is even more futile than the way the griefing crowd puts it. JCatano is the funniest though, saying if you don't build defenses, it's your own fault for being ganked/ griefed. BS. People like him just want the game to be for them, no comprimise.

Why you would want this game to be like darkfall, I don't know. Darkfall is already there. Why not let this game be different. How boring it would be to be the same as another game. I mean really, Darkfall is a game where trade-ganking is seen as a legitimate tactic.

[Chavoda]

I would like to see homesteads declaring Loyalty to tribes (game mechanic) and thus creating area of influence, tribes having to declare war to tribes (not homesteads) and being able to raid those homesteads who are declared loyal to the enemy tribe. Neutral Homesteads should be raid able by any tribes at any time as a "soft"push to say.ahem..join us or......

then tribes would have a reason to protect homesteads or they would loose influence of a area. creates politics as well...

all to soon to say anyway.. we will see in a few months when things have calm down a little.