Territorial Control and Griefing.

[outfctrl]

Why cant we all just get along? ;-)
If a wanderer comes by my scrap pile, go for it. We all need to help each other during these times of strife if we are to survive.

[FabricSoftener]

Griefing is mostly subjective, because everyone has a different definition of what constitutes "fun", both in RL and in game.

there are people who find it fun to set small animals on fire. many of them are in jail atm because the society at large doesnt agree that its fun, but they do find it fun and its real

[MrKrueak]

kill at will you cant get banned for killing people.

you can get banned if that kill at will is considered griefing or harassment. There is a difference and a limit to killing at will. for example killing people at a spawn point over and over is considered a griefing tactic as you are not there for any other reason but to kill the new players. That should be fixed though once the safe area around the starting area is working properly.

[mrcalhou]

I'm concerned that the griefing policies are 'situational' and that banning is not necessarily going to be something that is deemed in violation of the TOS. ie. it will be a subjective decision.

Primary to my concern is the concept of limted resources and territorial control.

Scenario 1: My Giant JUnk Pile.
- at launch my tribe gets its preferred spot...in the vicinity is a fairly glorious pile or three of junk. Our junk. Becaue of the relative scarcity of trash, and hte fact that it depletes, we decide this is our trash and our trash alone. All interlopers will be dealth with severely. We even post this in a tribe profile in the section below: Come into our self proclaimed area of influence and expect to me met with a high level of hostility.

So in comes the pacificist crafter. we explain to him our territorial policy and advise him to leave. he gives us the bird and says he can do what he wants. We kill him. He comes back. We kill him again. He keeps coming back...eventually we kill him 20-30 times because he is just plain hard headed. Well, he reports us for griefing. Question: are we tagged as griefers and banned for merely enforcing a territorial claim?

Scenario 2: I want your Junk.
So we've depleted our giant junk pile...but alas, no fear, we've spotted another one. So our merry band tromps over there to start a harvestin. We are met with a chilly gaze and a carebear stare! Carebear stare counter: axe between the eyes. So, we go about scroungin'. Alas, our fearless defender and his band of noobs, keep coming at us, attempting to kick us off their junk. Of course we don't let them kick us off and we kill them. Quite a few times. Question: are we tagged as griefers and banned for 'invading' someone elses territory to take their trash?

In both these scenarios, note that the person(s) dying, have a choice...they are choosing to walk into a scenario where they know they are going to meet hostile action and mostly die. What burden does the individual player have avoid being 'griefed'?

thoughts/

Not only do I think you are not the ones greifing, but in fact I believe the player that is coming back is harresing you, thus being the greifer. It can be spun both ways. And I really think it's silly that there would be rules about this at all. This isn't a silly FPS with static rez points. Like it has been mentioned, either party has a choice to avoid conflict. If niether does, then there is no greifing. Period.

[fflhktsn]

Why cant we all just get along? ;-)
If a wanderer comes by my scrap pile, go for it. We all need to help each other during these times of strife if we are to survive.

you do realize that junk piles dont respawn...right...once its gone its gone

see the need now to fight for your right to scavange?

[MrKrueak]

you do realize that junk piles dont respawn...right...once its gone its gone

see the need now to fight for your right to scavange?

you can scavenge anywhere, doesn't need to be on a scrap pile, but your point is valid as the open scrap piles will deplete but you can still scavenge for items whether it is on dirt, grass, scraps etc.

[shadowlz]

If some guy keeps running into a brick wall, should the brick wall move or the person stupid enough to continuosly run into it maybe stop? Just sayin...

The guy should call a guide to bulldoze the wall, because his playstyle doesnt include brick walls.

Also, if you get banned for PvP this game has gone from 'not just about PvP' to 'PvP is the devils work and how dare you try it!'

[Dubanka]

The responses this has generated are pretty interesting...and actually do a lot to illuminate a lot of the 'discussion' on the boards of late between the pvp epeens (guess im here) and the carebear militia.

ranging from 'KILLEMALL' to 'turn the other cheek can't we all just get along'.

I'd really like to see a dev response in here...since there is such a lack of consensus among the playerbase as to what would be deemed acceptable gameplay.

[mrcalhou]

It really saddens me that a lot of the people on this forum can't understand that both playstyles can be balanced to make them both work. It's not like it hasn't been done before...

[Dontaze_Mebro]

there are people who find it fun to set small animals on fire. many of them are in jail atm because the society at large doesnt agree that its fun, but they do find it fun and its real

i set large and small animals on fire everyday then I eat them. I'm not in jail. It's just semantics as usual.