Game Diversity

[Bridger]

yoori,

At this point I'm not sure if we're disagreeing.

I'm all for some objective information being delivered to the player. More than just a too generic to be helpful, 'junk...poor...good...etc'. (Unless from experience those generic categories begin to have an objective meaning. 'Okay, junk misses more often than it hits, falls apart after three fights and is marginally better than using harsh language when it comes to dealing damage. Good, on the other hand, increases my chances to hit, is fairly durable and does acceptable damage.') What I don't want is what has been suggested; 'Axe - +5 to hit, -5 to parry, +10 to damage'. I don't want specific, hard number statistics. As with the overall game concept, I want an element of 'figure it out for yourself.'

How that's achieved between those two extremes... Well, I'm willing to wait and see what the developers devise.

[jokhul]

<snip> Well, I'm willing to wait and see what the developers devise.

No need to wait, just login and you can see what the developers devised

The lack of any detailed stats on items is intentional. The current general quality/durability descriptions are all that's planned.

Jooky has even said that some new features, mobs, etc. would be added to the game without being announced or appearing in patch notes. The playerbase will have to discover them on their own.

[thurgond]

I like min/maxing. It's going to happen, anyway. Smart people always figure out the formula and post it.

I dispise min/max'ers.

I like Xsyon's design because game play is hard enough to learn that it keeps the idiots away, and it hides enough of the underlying mechanics that it will keep the min/max'ers away. No flavor or the month here.

[mgilbrtsn]

Hmmmm, tough, tough, TOUGH. I can see both points of view actually. Since both systems have merit (from hidden stats to detailed stats, and anything in between), I think we need to look at what fits with this game and game mechanic. To me, this is clearly not in the realm of wanting to have detailed statistics ala most MMOs out there. On the other hand, I agree with those that say statistics help with trade and such. Since you don't like the left and right side of the argument, what do you think? Well, i'm glad you asked. I think the suggestions of having general stats would be best:

Junk/poor/good/etc is already in there
Name of the crafter is already in there

The thing I would recommend, and I don't know what hidden stats are behind the items, but if it allows and makes a difference with those stats, I would add a crafter skill. for example:

A good quality weapon made by an apprentice would be inferior to a good quality weapon made by an artisan.

in this example, you would show

Good
Artisan
mgilbertsn

There are alot of assumptions with this. Different level crafters can make different level of goods (An artisan can mess up and craft a poor weapon). Another assumption would be that there is a difference between the stats quality of the product and maker of product

This may or may not work, but in the final analysis, the general type of stats work best for this game. If the economy is broken or doesn't seem to work, I'm sure it will be easy for the Devs to add more detail to the items to get the economy started.

[Raizure]

I'm all for the idea of having your own knowledge affect how you see a weapon. This gives tribes a need to have specialization in order to know what they're dealing with and know the value of their own goods. To the contrary, not having someone specialized leaves you in the dust in terms of trade. The current Superior quality is just too generic for high levels of skills. A beginner would look at it and see that it's high quality, but a veteran might see that it's very well balanced and durable.

[yoori]

yoori,

At this point I'm not sure if we're disagreeing.

I'm all for some objective information being delivered to the player. More than just a too generic to be helpful, 'junk...poor...good...etc'. (Unless from experience those generic categories begin to have an objective meaning. 'Okay, junk misses more often than it hits, falls apart after three fights and is marginally better than using harsh language when it comes to dealing damage. Good, on the other hand, increases my chances to hit, is fairly durable and does acceptable damage.') What I don't want is what has been suggested; 'Axe - +5 to hit, -5 to parry, +10 to damage'. I don't want specific, hard number statistics. As with the overall game concept, I want an element of 'figure it out for yourself.'

How that's achieved between those two extremes... Well, I'm willing to wait and see what the developers devise.

I don't think we disagree( I usually don't disagree with people, I try to add different perspective).
After reading posts in this thread, I know what would work for me.
Quality system based on 8 master degrees with more than one value behind it(weapon speed, damage, range, etc.) and visible(by numbers) durability.
Visible durability would make it easier to set price on items, particularly "second hand" items, while quality would leave something to discover.

[Dreamcrest]

Add appraising skill which helps you to get better information from different items. Or you could integrate it with already existing skills as posters before me suggested. A skilled weaponsmith can appraise a weapon, gaining more info than someone who has no skill in weaponsmithing. Or axefighter can do same to axes, because he uses them on daily basis.