If you cant lose your Totem....what's the Endgame?

[Proto]

from what i can see all ppl are talking about is a modified or varied system that they use/used ( played it at release and quit a month or so later ) in Darkfall

just jog on back to darkfall if u want that. the game ISNT RELEASED yet, so stop whining about all the pvp changes you want implemented ingame and play iot for what it is when it comes out. they haver said pvp stuff will be coming into the game eventually sao wait and see what they say is gonna happen THEN make comments about it and what u would like to see

I'm sorry but this is just a blatantly dumb post. I think you're trolling but that's okay, I'm not the sort to turn someone in.

It's absolutely ridiculous for you to posit the notion that one should wait for something to be implemented before we are allowed to have suggestions on what would make a good system. Maybe your suggestion would be less ridiculous had we some idea of the type of system the dev guy plans on but we don't, so given that and the fact that I've spent money on this game, I damn well intend to try and get the most out of it that I can which will make me the most happy.

[Proto]

Shadowbane released as a top 10 pc game in 2003...was trying to google the number, but havent quite tracked it down, but i want to say box saless were in the neighborhood of 300K copies within the first week of release. THis was good, but also horribly horribly bad since the servers/code couldnt handle the level of people that descended upon the game. From a box sale perspective the game was a hit. Free to play occurred in 2006, after the TOO expansion (puke). And the game went on to live 3 more years closing in July of 2009.

Defining the 'who' this game caters to is actually an interesting discussion unto itself...simultaneously a fundamental strength and weakness of the game.
Crafter: IT CATERS TO ME!! Look at all the crafting stuff!!
Builder: NO TO ME!! Terraforming! Walls! I can build a kingdom!!
Carebear: *sigh* cant we all just get along? I want to explore and smell the flowers, tame bambi and live a life of peaceful introspection...mmmmmmmm...The combat system is barely developed, so this game can't be about pvp.
PVPr: Uh, i'm here to kill you. FFA World, promised tribal warfare, look at all these weapon and armor options...hmm, we can build walls, that must mean we will be able to rip them down. Sweet. it's obvious this game was built for me.

We're all seeing what we want to see in the sandbox...which is fantastic.

Hopefull the devs have the skill and energy to find a balance to cater to all the audience that is projecting themselves into the game...We'll see.

as a side note, from a market standpoint...the sbemu project at 1,623 'active' members registered on their forums (over 12k total, but bots and all that so that isn't a real number). For every one of those active members, there are probably 5-7 that they have access to (guilds, etc.)/ influence with. Thats a captive audience that currently has nothing worthwhile/satisfactory to play who is WAITING for the 'game' to be made. No, those are not WoW numbers, this is not wow.

Finally

Do you have any idea how much pvp groups LOVE dedicated craft people? City builders? Farmers? And i'm not talking about as prey, i'm talking about on their own side. If you ENJOY building cities and walls and terraforming and making the ultimate indestructible, unseigable fortress...that means we can leave it to you and go out and kill stuff.

One of the misconceptions in this game, already, is the pvp and the craft elements are mutually exclusively...Your pvp tribes that are in it (hopefully) for the tribal warfare element will be just as skilled and focused on the craft element as anyone else in the game. It brings a competetive edge to have the absolute best stuff (once 'stuff' actually works ) possible.

You want all the raw materials you can get your hands on? You want tell the L337s what to do? get on board, and tell them you need x, y, and z ingredients in whatever quantities and THEN you'll be able to make them the legendary armor of uberdom. It's even better if ingredient z is only found on somebody elses land. You get to craft to your heart's content, pvprs get to kill people and take their stuff, win win. Hopefully the end result is that someone gets mad enough to come try to burn down your uber fortress (then you can laugh at their feeble skills from atop the walls you built).

If done right it will will all tie seamlessly together.

I'm so glad that you're here to answer these questions more eloquently than I'm willing to (political threads different story).

And to further point regarding SB's life and just a point to throw at Marcus...amidst SB's technical problems which was the biggest downfall of the game, we also had to contend with the release of WoW, I'm sorry but that's not something that any of the latest games out there have had to contend with. I mean the Warcraft universe was already hugely popular and the release put a good size dent in SBs population.

[ifireallymust]

I just wanna know when I can go VC on the PvPers asses? and by VC I mean Viet Cong.. I want pungee sticks.. I want gigantic log traps that spring out and impale you on a 30 foot sharpened log, I want tunnels... I want it all.. and the ability to make animals out of scrap and set them loose to do my bidding..

also it would be cool if I could enslave pvpers and gankers who come on my territory, then make them do gather quests to win their freedom..

and a fish made from bacon while im asking for stuff.

<3

This puts the whole public humiliation in stocks idea to shame. And now I want to see a pker impaled on a 30ft sharpened log.

[Proto]

<3

This puts the whole public humiliation in stocks idea to shame. And now I want to see a pker impaled on a 30ft sharpened log.

Even the PKers would love to see pkers on a pike infront of someone's town.

[Gradishar]

Even the PKers would love to see pkers on a pike infront of someone's town.

QFT

[Marcus]

I'm so glad that you're here to answer these questions more eloquently than I'm willing to (political threads different story).

And to further point regarding SB's life and just a point to throw at Marcus...amidst SB's technical problems which was the biggest downfall of the game, we also had to contend with the release of WoW, I'm sorry but that's not something that any of the latest games out there have had to contend with. I mean the Warcraft universe was already hugely popular and the release put a good size dent in SBs population.

I think that, is in fact part of my point...

before i get started, please, i don't want WoW, or anything like it.. But i also don't think a lot of people want Shadowbane, at least a lot of the folks who purchased this game reading its feature section.

If the game was appealing as most seem to say with its destructable cities, and the like, why didnt they return after trying WoW? WoW was nothing like Shadowbane, probably quite the opposite really. Not that I expect they would all return, or it would get WoW numbers by any stretch, but if it was a decent game, it should have at least survived. There were plenty of others that did.

Like i said earlier, I hope these guys can find that happy medium where both sides can enjoy it...

[Bridger]

The reason the pvpers are being loud and talking alot is because so far we haven't gotten any attention...

My reply to you depends upon what you mean by 'getting any attention.'

If by that you mean that PvP needs more substance and structure and reason for being, I'd probably agree. If you mean a more robust and dynamic combat mechanism, I'd probably agree.

But if you mean, 'the developers aren't changing their concept to fit what we want Xsyon to be versus what they want it to be' then I, for one, hope you never get any attention. That's confrontational and probably not what some folks want to hear, but there it is.

Again, read the features list. Read Jooky's interview where he states, pretty unambiguously, that PvP exists to serve the over-arching concept of rebuilding society after Armeggedon. That is; Xsyon is primarily about crafting and politics and invention and progress and all the scorned in some circles 'carebear' stuff. Not the other way around. Now to be perfectly clear; you need PvP to make all that carebear stuff ultimately have an edge and a risk. It's symbiotic. In a true sandbox game like Xsyon, either one without the other is ultimately empty. The question is; which drives the other? Which comes first?

Again - I'm pretty confident that Jooky's comments regarding his vision for the game make the answer clear.

Now there's nothing at all in any of that to say that PvP in Xsyon can't be wonderful and fulfilling and full of all sorts of genuinely marvelous opportunities to 'risk your reputation', if that's what you truly want to do. Just look at the previous posts where folks are discussing epic siege warfare and convoluted political intrigue driven maneuvering and so forth and so on. It's only to say that if the attention you're demanding is that the devs turn this into 'I can knock down shit where-ever I want, when-ever I feel like it', I think ... I hope... you're in for a long, disappointing wait.

[byrgar]

My reply to you depends upon what you mean by 'getting any attention.'

If by that you mean that PvP needs more substance and structure and reason for being, I'd probably agree. If you mean a more robust and dynamic combat mechanism, I'd probably agree.

But if you mean, 'the developers aren't changing their concept to fit what we want Xsyon to be versus what they want it to be' then I, for one, hope you never get any attention. That's confrontational and probably not what some folks want to hear, but there it is.

Again, read the features list. Read Jooky's interview where he states, pretty unambiguously, that PvP exists to serve the over-arching concept of rebuilding society after Armeggedon. That is; Xsyon is primarily about crafting and politics and invention and progress and all the scorned in some circles 'carebear' stuff. Not the other way around. Now to be perfectly clear; you need PvP to make all that carebear stuff ultimately have an edge and a risk. It's symbiotic. In a true sandbox game like Xsyon, either one without the other is ultimately empty. The question is; which drives the other? Which comes first?

Again - I'm pretty confident that Jooky's comments regarding his vision for the game make the answer clear.

Now there's nothing at all in any of that to say that PvP in Xsyon can't be wonderful and fulfilling and full of all sorts of genuinely marvelous opportunities to 'risk your reputation', if that's what you truly want to do. Just look at the previous posts where folks are discussing epic siege warfare and convoluted political intrigue driven maneuvering and so forth and so on. It's only to say that if the attention you're demanding is that the devs turn this into 'I can knock down shit where-ever I want, when-ever I feel like it', I think ... I hope... you're in for a long, disappointing wait.

+1
I totally agree.

[Proto]

I think that, is in fact part of my point...

before i get started, please, i don't want WoW, or anything like it.. But i also don't think a lot of people want Shadowbane, at least a lot of the folks who purchased this game reading its feature section.

If the game was appealing as most seem to say with its destructable cities, and the like, why didnt they return after trying WoW? WoW was nothing like Shadowbane, probably quite the opposite really. Not that I expect they would all return, or it would get WoW numbers by any stretch, but if it was a decent game, it should have at least survived. There were plenty of others that did.

Like i said earlier, I hope these guys can find that happy medium where both sides can enjoy it...

People were sick of the technical limitations of Shadowbane, if SB ran lag free without sb.exe errors during large scale fights and they had fixed item/gold duping, the game would have remained pretty active as the combat and seige systems themselves worked well and were mostly importantly, pretty balanced. Though WoW didn't have the asset destruction and whatnot, it was and remains a very polished game, the antithesis of SB.

I think the reason that many of us SBers are vocal about this is that we know the SB system was balanced, we know that it could work in this type of community. For those that didn't play SB, they hear about seiging and whatnot and probably imagine that there was just rampant fighting and it was totally uncontrolled and cities were falling hourly but that wasn't the case. It was generally pretty difficult for the offensive side to win banes, even if heavily outnumbering the defense, which is how it ought to be. None of us SBers at least want 24/7 reckless pvp with seiges every night if the week, shit most of us are too old for that sort of commitment anymore, and we also don't want the battles to be so easy that they become stagnant. I think most of us would probably even be ok with just an inventory loot system liek SB was.

We're not trying to change this game, we're just trying to let the community know that you can have a great pvp and seige system in place even though it may not be the focus of the game. Just because it isn't the focus doesn't mean that it should have crappy mechanics, ya know?

[Marcus]

I like siege and great PvP. Learning from games that have done it, can only be a good thing