PvP vs. PK and some general impressions

[Whitehawk]

I think a lot of us that came over from Darkfall arent seeing the big picture of this game. We're used to no softcap on skills, and (basically) no punishment for being "evil." Those two no-brainer ideas will make this a very different game. We wont be masters of everything and above the law here.

That being said, its not going to be carebear heaven either. Its open pvp, and despite the penalties (which will scare off most of the retards) you're still going to have dedicated pkers. Its fun to be the badguy, and its fun to fight against the odds. People will do it.

PKers will be the least of your worries though. People will pay for two accounts, pk you with one, and join your tribe with their crafter alt and pretend to be your best friend. Your tribe will have spies that give info to your enemies, steal from the clan, and sabotage you in every way they can. Its political competition, and its going to be dirty.

So, like i said in an earlier post, i think you carebear guys are gonna need to grow a thicker skin to play a game like this. I think the DF crowd is going to have to realize that this is a very different game too. Hopefully the devs will be able to force both groups to cooperate and form a symbiotic relationship in order to succeed, where tribes have armies and civilians, like a real society..... but I'd be amazed if it worked out that well.

[Crisco Twister]

True this is a different game, but a lot of people are attracted to the pvp and how good it is. The other features are definetily cool, but the pvp (and this is in like all games) draws people to or away from it.

[Lardocrul]

I am sure most players are smart enough to play a style that brings joy to PVP-Players as well as to the so-called carebears.

Extensiv PVP or "Carebearing" will destroy the fun for all players but the devs will hopefully balance it.

[VowOfSilence]

some food for thought about pvp sandboxes in general:

Maybe like a couple articles I've read at mmorpg suggested, sandbox games are doomed to failure despite the huge desire in the gaming world to have someone make a good one. It's because of the 2 distinct types of gamers it attracts, whom when they meet, clash in an unbalancable manner and so all sandboxes fail. I guess the answer could be a double server sandbox in which some simple mechanic is allowed on one but not the other. I think I've seen a couple games do that in the high grade pvp genre.

In the end such a thing may be the only way to finally make a sandbox that actually lasts. Espcially since the dislike between the two types is so venomous. 2 opposite and not very nice views could hardly ever co-exist within the same game in a successful level. This may be why no gaming company with real money at stake has even taken this genre seriously or as a possible workable gaming platform.

[Jadzia]

VowOfSilence wrote:

some food for thought about pvp sandboxes in general:

Maybe like a couple articles I've read at mmorpg suggested, sandbox games are doomed to failure despite the huge desire in the gaming world to have someone make a good one. It's because of the 2 distinct types of gamers it attracts, whom when they meet, clash in an unbalancable manner and so all sandboxes fail. I guess the answer could be a double server sandbox in which some simple mechanic is allowed on one but not the other. I think I've seen a couple games do that in the high grade pvp genre.

In the end such a thing may be the only way to finally make a sandbox that actually lasts. Espcially since the dislike between the two types is so venomous. 2 opposite and not very nice views could hardly ever co-exist within the same game in a successful level. This may be why no gaming company with real money at stake has even taken this genre seriously or as a possible workable gaming platform.

Interesting read, may I ask where did you find it ?

[Ciik]

Some additional food for thought about sandboxes in-general.

Why not? Build a proper sandbox.

The idea of freedom is where so many more recent attempts at sandbox MMOs have gone terribly wrong. A sandbox MMO is not necessarily a hardcore experience. Ultima Online could be quite hardcore, but that was the beauty of it. It was, at its root, whatever the user made of it. For some, that meant hardcore PvP. For others, that meant picking berries or begging for change. What made UO magical is that it brought everyone in. It was open, it was inclusive.

Sandbox MMOs are also about far more than combat. This is where Darkfall misses the mark for me. Yes, it has a wealth of options in its design, but fair or not, it's developed a reputation as a hardcore PvP world. It's all about killing and looting. This is not options. The beauty of UO was the ability to be a minstrel, an author, or fisherman. Not everyone wanted to be a warrior, and even those that were, could easily slip off that one persona and show off a whole new side to their personality.

In fact, UO took it even a step further. Not only did the skill system promote the mastery of skills that had absolutely no combat benefit or application, but the world itself allowed people to develop themselves even further. There were poets in UO. There was no poetry skill, but people used the books to create their own niche inside that world.

[Jadzia]

Sigh...thats what I'm trying to find in Xsyon...a game what is not built only around combat...

[sisler86]

Jadzia wrote:

Sigh...thats what I'm trying to find in Xsyon...a game what is not built only around combat...

I think this game is aiming better than most to be that balance like UO was.

[Jadzia]

I do hope so !

[Ruinous]

As a PVPer, if crafters were to have me in their tribe and kit me with the best armour, weapons, kit I'd have a ball protecting them from PKs. The PKs get someone to fight who will put up a 'challenge', I get my kicks out of being the hero and being well rewarded for my service and the Pve-orientated folks get protected.

Just food for thought... ofc I know being the sole protector is likely to get me killed, but a tribe of pve'ers could afford to have plenty warrior types around I would think. Win/Win for all concerned imho.