Thoughts about Xsyon and future

[Salvadore]

A resonable timer based on how far you respawn from your body should be in. If your unable to get you stuff back or get a friend to grab it in 45 min then your SOL and the items are destroyed, but at least you have a fair chance to get them back...

I'd imagine though that most players will make sure to get the items back or another player picks them up... To that I say there should be a system like Mrcalhou said above where equipment has a chance that they are destroyed completely. And their should be a system where a good deal of damage/decay is added to all items, so they are going to destroy much quicker than a freshly crafted one.

I wouldn't make a relative timer based on distance - If i ran across the map to pick a fight with another tribe, I wouldnt expect my body to be there forever. Should be the same timer all around IMO, and make it a longer timer.

I like the idea of *durability* on items, and losing them in combat. I think, however, there is MANY MORE other things that need proper balancing attention before that is even considered. Again, i agree with the idea...obviously if someone (in pvp) gets their head flattened by a giant hammer...their helmet probably isnt going to be salvageable ;]

Added after 9 minutes:

What I suggested wouldn't require any different programming. If a player dies, every item he has would be dropped on the ground. No matter why he died. No worries for the programmers. The bag containing all of his items would stay there for some mins, definitely not enough for a corpse run, but enough to be looted if there are players around.
Destroying items in case of PvP death is unfair, why to take the reward away from the PvPer ? If PvE death results item drop then its enough to keep the economy going.

So, it wouldnt require any other programming? You mean changing the "face down dead body" image one sees when a player died getting changed to a BAG wouldnt be any change in programming? Why not leave it as a body (as it is now) and simply adjusting the timer on it? Same thing right? Rather than a small BAG that nobody would see in grass...

Lol am I the only one who played a game where death always had the same consequences regardless to the reason of death, as in dropping all of your items when you die ? It gives a great feel of danger, encourages group PvE, and drives the economy. It works very well in a game which only has player crafted items.

No, you aren't. Many of us have played, and rather enjoyed, the "meaner" style games...say UO, DF, etc. Im a full advocate of full loot because of its risks involved, as well as the rewards that are promoted by it. I personally hate games like WoW that have virtually no real risk for dying at any time. I lol at "loss of xp on death" and similar things as a risk for death.

@Salvador: its kinda funny how many prejudices you have about me I'm a solo player now, all the safe zone I have is a homestead area and I spend 90% of my time out of it. I'm sure I'll die much more times in game due to PvE then PvP. I suggested my idea because I know it works, and not to gain any advantages.

You are mistaken - I dont have a single "prejudice" about you. In every single "idea" thread I've ever seen you post, you could simply save the spin you put on it by posting "supports the pve/carebear side". You really sound as if you are posting with goals of your own benefit...NOT of balance or advancement of the game.

Of course your idea "will work". Hell, at this point, it is technically *working* anyway. Your idea, just as i stated earlier, again "supports the pve/carebear side".

[kergan]

Well lets agree to disagree, i see your point, but I personally prefer the thrill of possibly loosing my items while pvp/pve'ing, and i'm sure your points are just as valid as mine. There's no real need to turn this into a mass debate, especially as we have no idea what will happen

Easy answer without the need to tailor the game for you. Just promise yourself that if you die, you will delete everything you have on you. Better yet, delete your toon and re-roll. Now we're talking thrilling! Actually, I wouldn't be suprised if eventually there's some tribe that adopts this playstyle. It would be very do-able in this game once all the features are in and it's stable.

[Jadzia]

@Salvadore:
1. Sure, it can be the dead body as well, it doesn't make any difference just that you have to wait for that some mins to respawn till the looting timer is on, but thats not a big thing. The different coding comment was meant to differently code on PvE death and PvP death, read mrcalhou's post and you will understand.

2. If you played that and enjoyed then whats your problem with it ?

3. You said it worked like that in UO. So how is that idea unbalanced ? I really don't understand how a harsh PvE penalty supports PvE/carebear style. All of us will PvE, won't we ? Please elaborate.

And how is the idea 'technically' working now ? You don't lose anything in PvE death.

[Salvadore]

@Salvadore:
1. Sure, it can be the dead body as well, it doesn't make any difference just that you have to wait for that some mins to respawn till the looting timer is on, but thats not a big thing. The different coding comment was meant to differently code on PvE death and PvP death, read mrcalhou's post and you will understand.

2. If you played that and enjoyed then whats your problem with it ?

3. You said it worked like that in UO. So how is that idea unbalanced ? I really don't understand how a harsh PvE penalty supports PvE/carebear style. All of us will PvE, won't we ? Please elaborate.

And how is the idea 'technically' working now ? You don't lose anything in PvE death.

1. I do understand, but why "code" any death differently? It should have the same consequences regardless of how it happens. It shouldnt favor one type of deaths over the other.

2. I didnt have a single problem with it. I thoroughly enjoyed it. All items a player carries should drop on death, just like UO. It provides rewards, the ability to recoup ones losses from an accidental death, and boost the economy. People prepare more and are less reckless involving death when there are consequences. Thus why you have nakeds running around punching people as their only form of entertainment. No risk all gain.

3. I didnt think it was unbalanced, at all, in UO. You would die to discons and accidents sometimes, but you had a chance to at least recoup your losses there. Penalties shouldnt be any different for pve as compared to any other deaths. If you add any risks or rewards to any type of death, you are simply adding more to un-balance. YES, I will pve. It is a necessity. But if I have the ability to exploit the system - knowing my death/loot will be different if i recklesly try to kill a bear as opposed to a person, I will obviously act accordingly. So will you, so will everyone else. Make it all have the necessary, and same, consequences.

It's technically working the way you are wanting it to work NOW - if a bear kills you, you lose nothing, dont have to worry about any consequences, retain all of your stuff (hypothetically speaking if you only have PO weapon equipped and proper permissions bag equipped), and respawn immediately. No risk, all gain. Ill throw myself at that bear until I kill it and gain, no risk besides time wasted on how many times i try to kill it.

Shouldnt be that way. Should have risk. Should have equivalent reward.

[Jadzia]

1. I do understand, but why "code" any death differently? It should have the same consequences regardless of how it happens. It shouldnt favor one type of deaths over the other.

2. I didnt have a single problem with it. I thoroughly enjoyed it. All items a player carries should drop on death, just like UO. It provides rewards, the ability to recoup ones losses from an accidental death, and boost the economy. People prepare more and are less reckless involving death when there are consequences. Thus why you have nakeds running around punching people as their only form of entertainment. No risk all gain.

3. I didnt think it was unbalanced, at all, in UO. You would die to discons and accidents sometimes, but you had a chance to at least recoup your losses there. Penalties shouldnt be any different for pve as compared to any other deaths. If you add any risks or rewards to any type of death, you are simply adding more to un-balance. YES, I will pve. It is a necessity. But if I have the ability to exploit the system - knowing my death/loot will be different if i recklesly try to kill a bear as opposed to a person, I will obviously act accordingly. So will you, so will everyone else. Make it all have the necessary, and same, consequences.

It's technically working the way you are wanting it to work NOW - if a bear kills you, you lose nothing, dont have to worry about any consequences, retain all of your stuff (hypothetically speaking if you only have PO weapon equipped and proper permissions bag equipped), and respawn immediately. No risk, all gain. Ill throw myself at that bear until I kill it and gain, no risk besides time wasted on how many times i try to kill it.

Shouldnt be that way. Should have risk. Should have equivalent reward.

1. Yes. This is what I've suggested. Same consequences on death regardless of the reason of death.

2. Totally agree, thats why I suggested that idea.

3. I want balance and PvE risk and a flourishing economy. Thats why I suggested that we should drop everything in case of PvE death without a corpse run. Players should lose all their items in case of PvE death just like in case of PvP death.

Lol Seems you misread my post. I suggested that PvP and PvE death should have the same consequence...as in drop everything in case of death. If a player died in PvP then the PKers should be able to full loot him/her, if the player died in PvE then he/she should lose everything he/she had without the ability of a corpse run. So why exactly are you arguing with me ?

[Salvadore]

So why exactly are you arguing with me ?

Because of:

If a player died in PvP then the PKers should be able to full loot him/her, if the player died in PvE then he/she should lose everything he/she had without the ability of a corpse run.

and:

Not corpse run We should drop everything in PvE death and all the stuffs should disappear in 1 min.

Im pseudo agreeing with parts you've said, but mainly disagreeing with these quoted things.

Should have the ability for "corpse runs" fairly, regardless of cause of death. This adds all the aforementioned and debated details. Make the timer something like 30 minutes, like UO, on the corpse decay. Make the body fair game for all, including the victim.

*Props on leaving the carebear zerg, permitting you actually "have" ;]

[Jadzia]

Ok, so you only disagree with the disappearing corpse because you want a corpse run ? Thats fine, but explain me that why did you say that losing everything on PvE death would cater to the PvE players...I still don't understand that lol. If there was a corpse run that would cater a bit since they would have the ability to get back their stuffs if they are lucky...but without corpse run ?

And Hopi is a great tribe and I love them

[Salvadore]

Ok, so you only disagree with the disappearing corpse because you want a corpse run ? Thats fine, but explain me that why did you say that losing everything on PvE death would cater to the PvE players...I still don't understand that lol. If there was a corpse run that would cater a bit since they would have the ability to get back their stuffs if they are lucky...but without corpse run ?

I thought you described the PvE player's death as an instant destruction of their assets, aka the "1 minute" timeframe you proposed. Thats basically instant imo because it is hard to actually loot someone now before the corpse dissapears. Im stating that I think it would be too "hardcore" to have a pve or accidental death insapwn all items. Too hardcore for the little guy with no massive tribe or established tribe, or the solo player that has to work hard for everything they get.

Yeah, it would obviously boost the economy, but would be more balanced to give someone the choice of trying to get their gear. Corpse runs are also a necessary game mechanic as well. Think of the new players coming in and them learning the ropes. No "bound" items or PO weapons. Im all about being "mean" with no remorse, but I do understand that there needs to be certain allowences of "nice" to keep players interested for more than 15 mins.

Example - I have to go very far from my totem to get sand. I need this for mortar and stone walls. I get pk'd along the way - they probably arent going to loot the sand (hypothetically). I should have the ability to return and get the sand, right? Think of the pvper - they (hypothetically) realize im interested in the sand. They could ambush me as im trying to get back to my corpse and get more pvp. I get pissed. I return, this time, with friends. They plan another ambush - now we have the early makings of tribal warfare!!!

Same exact issue present for pve deaths, accidental deaths. Add in the thread I supplied about cannibalism - mucho depth and content.

Im totally fine with full loot - all time. The harsher you make the penalty, the less likely people will be to risk losing their stuff. Thus, why you see nakeds all the time fisting people to death.

[Jadzia]

I agree that it would too harsh on fresh new players, so perhaps a 24 hours immunity should be given to them. But its the same thing if a very new player logs in, leaves the spawn area, gets killed and looted in the first 5 mins...would you agree with any type of immunity (can be killed but can't be looted) for PvP ?

And apart of new players, seriously, I think no one should be scared of losing pixels for now. The game is so filled with unneeded items, I wouldn't run back for 30 mins to get back my items when I have like 20 of each at home. I'm more concerned about the economy right now.

[mrcalhou]

Lol am I the only one who played a game where death always had the same consequences regardless to the reason of death, as in dropping all of your items when you die ? It gives a great feel of danger, encourages group PvE, and drives the economy. It works very well in a game which only has player crafted items.

I...Have you not read what I wrote? My suggestion is ALSO the same thing for whatever the reason of death is. It just actually removes items from the game before someone else can get them. You were the one that was talking about "If the player is killed by another then the winner gets the losers items but if a bear kills that person then they all just go 'poof' after a minute" (paraphrased).