Are contested totems the best way for land control

[Jadzia]

Mind getting me that link? I cant seem to find it.

Last I checked they were removing safe areas after prelude. Has this changed?

Yes, it has changed. Check out the Xsyon Update Archive thread, March 5 update from Jordi.

[Hanover]

Yes, it has changed. Check out the Xsyon Update Archive thread, March 5 update from Jordi.

That hardly sounds definitive. "What I imagine is"

[Dubanka]

Absolutely agree. Force a wargame on people and you will get empty server. But Jordi already said he won't force us into it, so why these worries...

i'm not sure why this position is still getting repeated....as recent history has proven it false.

currently, you have most of the game you, and those multitudes you claim to represent, desire.
- You can craft a multitude of objects.
- You can build towns to a high degree of detail.
- You can forage for raw materials.
- You do not have to participate in any non-consensual pvp (due to safe zones and most of the pvprs not playing)
- What is missing for you (please correct me if im wrong): more stuff to craft, more stuff to build, more territory to explore, more features (mining, farming, taming, etc.)

I think a lot of people actually thought they bought into this model, untill they had to play it....and then they realized something. All the features in the world, no matter how brilliantlly implimented, are of absolutely no value unless there is a point to them.
- You can craft a multitude of objects - But they have no utility, so no value, so no one cares how good your items on, so whats the point in making them?
- You can build towns to a high degree of detail - Walls that don't protect or keep people out, houses that don't house, gates that dont exist - there is no point in improving your tribal lands except for the improvement itself
- You can forage for raw materials - Mundane on its best day...but since there is no scarcity, there is no value on materials. Everything you need is right outside your backdoor. No need to fight, or trade for anything because you can get it yourself.
- You do not have to participate in any non-consensual pvp (due to safe zones and most of the pvprs not playing) - many have posted that they were looking forward to the thrill of the unanticipated spat. FUBAR mechanics notwithstanding, the complete lack of the threat of agression has made gathering activity a yawner, where it once was something you took a very high risk in doing alone.

You have your game now, or at least most of it. Players have voted with their feet and walked. I truly hope the devs turn to a vision that incorporates the pve vision as a component of a larger concept, not as the sole core gameplay element. The players need a point, the activity itself is not enough of one. Players need risk, with an element of fear, because it creates an environment that encourages group play, and group dynamics. Players need conflict...diplomatic, resource, trade, and armed...because that is what drives a game. Conflict creates drama which creates need, which creates a point...A reason to log in and do something in support of your group or against another.

Time to rewind a bit. Vision A: net players- ~50 active. whatever vision B is, it can't do much worse.

[Malivius]

i'm not sure why this position is still getting repeated....as recent history has proven it false.

currently, you have most of the game you, and those multitudes you claim to represent, desire.
- You can craft a multitude of objects.
- You can build towns to a high degree of detail.
- You can forage for raw materials.
- You do not have to participate in any non-consensual pvp (due to safe zones and most of the pvprs not playing)
- What is missing for you (please correct me if im wrong): more stuff to craft, more stuff to build, more territory to explore, more features (mining, farming, taming, etc.)

I think a lot of people actually thought they bought into this model, untill they had to play it....and then they realized something. All the features in the world, no matter how brilliantlly implimented, are of absolutely no value unless there is a point to them.
- You can craft a multitude of objects - But they have no utility, so no value, so no one cares how good your items on, so whats the point in making them?
- You can build towns to a high degree of detail - Walls that don't protect or keep people out, houses that don't house, gates that dont exist - there is no point in improving your tribal lands except for the improvement itself
- You can forage for raw materials - Mundane on its best day...but since there is no scarcity, there is no value on materials. Everything you need is right outside your backdoor. No need to fight, or trade for anything because you can get it yourself.
- You do not have to participate in any non-consensual pvp (due to safe zones and most of the pvprs not playing) - many have posted that they were looking forward to the thrill of the unanticipated spat. FUBAR mechanics notwithstanding, the complete lack of the threat of agression has made gathering activity a yawner, where it once was something you took a very high risk in doing alone.

You have your game now, or at least most of it. Players have voted with their feet and walked. I truly hope the devs turn to a vision that incorporates the pve vision as a component of a larger concept, not as the sole core gameplay element. The players need a point, the activity itself is not enough of one. Players need risk, with an element of fear, because it creates an environment that encourages group play, and group dynamics. Players need conflict...diplomatic, resource, trade, and armed...because that is what drives a game. Conflict creates drama which creates need, which creates a point...A reason to log in and do something in support of your group or against another.

Time to rewind a bit. Vision A: net players- ~50 active. whatever vision B is, it can't do much worse.

Gotta agree here...I was proving a point to a friend earlier (who loves the way things are right now - no PvP, no risk, etc).

I stayed logged in today for 4.5 hours...until the server crashed. I was in plain sight, near the lake, no tribal area around... I was wearing a full bone set and had an unlocked bag of stuff. Beside me were two baskets with tools and supplies in them...both unlocked.

My character stood there for 4.5 hours while I worked, did chores, etc around the house...NO ONE ever even came close enough for me to see, much less pose a threat to me...

[Jadzia]

No, Dub, its not the game we signed for (yet). As you said, nothing has a purpose now. There are no rare recipes, rare resources. Armors and weapons have hardly any use (they could be used in PvE too if animals were working). Buildings should have a use too, they should stop item decay and give us comfort. Crafting needs purposes, but these purposes are not necessarily PvP oriented. We need reason to trade and to craft, if items and buildings have uses and item decay gets implemented then the economy will start to work.

Warfare will be a lot of fun for a lot of people. But there are a lot who don't want to participate in it. All we need it is to make it optional, so people can choose. The option they seem to choose (warring-nonwarring tribes) is not the best imo, but better than a forced wargame. An Eve style system would be WAY better. The ones who want warfare settle down in the PvP area, the ones who want peace settle down in the safe area. Everyone gets what they like and what they paid for.

[Hanover]

i'm not sure why this position is still getting repeated....as recent history has proven it false.

currently, you have most of the game you, and those multitudes you claim to represent, desire.
- You can craft a multitude of objects.
- You can build towns to a high degree of detail.
- You can forage for raw materials.
- You do not have to participate in any non-consensual pvp (due to safe zones and most of the pvprs not playing)
- What is missing for you (please correct me if im wrong): more stuff to craft, more stuff to build, more territory to explore, more features (mining, farming, taming, etc.)

I think a lot of people actually thought they bought into this model, untill they had to play it....and then they realized something. All the features in the world, no matter how brilliantlly implimented, are of absolutely no value unless there is a point to them.
- You can craft a multitude of objects - But they have no utility, so no value, so no one cares how good your items on, so whats the point in making them?
- You can build towns to a high degree of detail - Walls that don't protect or keep people out, houses that don't house, gates that dont exist - there is no point in improving your tribal lands except for the improvement itself
- You can forage for raw materials - Mundane on its best day...but since there is no scarcity, there is no value on materials. Everything you need is right outside your backdoor. No need to fight, or trade for anything because you can get it yourself.
- You do not have to participate in any non-consensual pvp (due to safe zones and most of the pvprs not playing) - many have posted that they were looking forward to the thrill of the unanticipated spat. FUBAR mechanics notwithstanding, the complete lack of the threat of agression has made gathering activity a yawner, where it once was something you took a very high risk in doing alone.

You have your game now, or at least most of it. Players have voted with their feet and walked. I truly hope the devs turn to a vision that incorporates the pve vision as a component of a larger concept, not as the sole core gameplay element. The players need a point, the activity itself is not enough of one. Players need risk, with an element of fear, because it creates an environment that encourages group play, and group dynamics. Players need conflict...diplomatic, resource, trade, and armed...because that is what drives a game. Conflict creates drama which creates need, which creates a point...A reason to log in and do something in support of your group or against another.

Time to rewind a bit. Vision A: net players- ~50 active. whatever vision B is, it can't do much worse.

/applaud

[Salvadore]

It is pretty obvious that "happy craft land" is a fail, simply log in and see. There were HUNDREDS of people flocking to these forums and enduring the launch when everything was open. Now, with NOTHING to do but craft, there is hardly anyone logged in to the game or the forums. A portion of those people are also the ones that are "hanging on" hoping the system will be improved pvp-wise. Craft-Land is a proven failure. Face it.

Consider allowing these changes to happen involving tribal warfare. It actually creates politics, an economy, and gives people a reason to log in NIGHTLY.

Losing all of your assets isnt necessarily a "bad" thing. You can always rebuild quite easily with tribe help. You can always re-take your land, that is rightfully yours, BACK! You can even politic to help prevent the loss, or assure the regain. Hell, you can even join another tribe if yours is unwilling to stand up for themselves. The majority of the time, it's the crybaby whiners that say "I QUIT" when they lose and /logout. They are usually the ones that are just looking for a reason to quit anyway...whereas the ones that are actively fighting are who stays constant with activity.

In regards to zerging (whoever said it):

Ive seen a plethora of times where this has happened. Thats what the "politics" forum is used for and in-game relationships are forged. In ALL of the cases (yes, ALL) that ive seen of the uber-zerg attacking the small, the majority of the server polices it. Hell, some even pride themselves on fighting only the zerg type tribes.

Case in point - Hopi (as mentioned earlier). They've already got a super negative reputation simply due to their forum banter. I highly doubt all of the pvp-centric players (whom they've constantly argued with on the forums) would allow them to show up 100v10 to conquer a small tribe. I know, for a fact, that my guys would /log in and try to help the little guy out. Simply assuming the largest guild always wins is simply false, especially if balanced combat mechanics are in game.

Id gladly take 1 elite tribe over 1 huge zerg any day. The whole tribal system seems to prefer the average -> smaller tribes anyway...Being in a huge tribe seems counterproductive.

[Hanover]

But there are a lot who don't want to participate in it..

Oh really...where are these people? I love how you people "speak for the masses".

[Salvadore]

Oh really...where are these people? I love how you people "speak for the masses".

Last I checked, a vast majority have "left" after the launch, when they crafted all they needed to, and saw no hope of improved pvp. A portion of that seems to keep saying the line "Ill check back in a few months...maybe...when pvp is addressed." Rarely do they say "Ill check back later when there is more to build."

Of course, add the ones of their tribes who they are speaking for, multiply that number by...A LOT...

I think it is pretty obvious that the "masses" need pvp/tribal warfare, weather they want to admit it or not!

[Jadzia]

Oh really...where are these people? I love how you people "speak for the masses".

Come on. None of us can prove any numbers, can we ? If you read my post again I said that warfare would be a lot of fun for a lot of people. So I speak both side of the masses.

But what is wrong with giving people choices ? Want to warfare ? Settle in the PvP area. Don't want to ? Then stay in the safe one. Everyone wins.