War, taking towns & forts

[Jadzia]

High sec space is everything in Eve but a starting zone, and thats why it works well there. Just read CCP's report about it, it says that 80% of the population live in the high sec area: http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=892

I dont know anyone that stays there, even the most carebear people I know always going out into 0.0 space because of it being more fun and rewarding.

According to the QEN you are wrong.

[MrDDT]

High sec space is everything in Eve but a starting zone, and thats why it works well there. Just read CCP's report about it, it says that 80% of the population live in the high sec area: http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=892


According to the QEN you are wrong.

I dont see how that proves me wrong unless you believe I was saying that people move out of the safe areas to live? I believe the report is just telling me that more people would love to stay in safe areas. We already knew this.
You also know that most people dont want PVP? Most people want ONLY PVE?

I think you took my statement wrong as when I said that people do go out into 0.0 space. I didnt mean to live or to stay, I meant they do go out there for the fun to be had and come back. That's what I meant. I didnt mean that they stayed out there.
Nor did was I saying that most people dont want safe areas. We all know that safe ares IS the most common type of player.

[MrDDT]

High sec space is everything in Eve but a starting zone, and thats why it works well there. Just read CCP's report about it, it says that 80% of the population live in the high sec area: http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=892


According to the QEN you are wrong.

I dont see how that proves me wrong unless you believe I was saying that people move out of the safe areas to live? I believe the report is just telling me that more people would love to stay in safe areas. We already knew this.
You also know that most people dont want PVP? Most people want ONLY PVE?

I think you took my statement wrong as when I said that people do go out into 0.0 space. I didnt mean to live or to stay, I meant they do go out there for the fun to be had and come back. That's what I meant. I didnt mean that they stayed out there.
Nor did was I saying that most people dont want safe areas. We all know that safe ares IS the most common type of player.

[xyberviri]

I think the elitest at both ends of pve and pvp are what are ruining all the games.

I dont consider my self a elitest pvper that has to kill everything that moves because the rules allow it which is basically border line greifing to some.
I also dont consider my self a carebear pve crafter that likes to rp while digging in the trash and crafting by my self while paying 15 bucks a month to talk to other people that are also playing the same game.

With out either of those groups the game could be full loot full pvp no safe zone since normal players dont run around being a bunch of jack asses.

[Phatkat]

There just needs to be a pve server and a pvp server so players know what they are getting themselves into.
Different people look for different things, this way everyone can be satisfied. Maybe even a half pvp/pve hybrid server where the system is similar
to the current one.

[xyberviri]

The way i see the whole pve versus pvp argument is that pvp players do pve, yes there are players that only pvp, but most pvp players do also pve or at some point did pve, while most pve players have never pvped and dont want to pvp and wish they would just get rid of all pvp in all games ever made ever and that all games could become hello kitty happy island fun time online.


Its like here where i live, im in a boarder state with mexico, i know english and spanish, how ever if i speak english im offending people who are visiting from mexico, because they are traveling and shouldn't be subjected to english. even though this is in a walmart with every thing in english.

[Jadzia]

The way i see the whole pve versus pvp argument is that pvp players do pve, yes there are players that only pvp, but most pvp players do also pve or at some point did pve, while most pve players have never pvped and dont want to pvp and wish they would just get rid of all pvp in all games ever made ever and that all games could become hello kitty happy island fun time online.


Its like here where i live, im in a boarder state with mexico, i know english and spanish, how ever if i speak english im offending people who are visiting from mexico, because they are traveling and shouldn't be subjected to english. even though this is in a walmart with every thing in english.

I believe you are wrong, its not PvP vs PvE players, most of the players do like to PvP. The difference is that most of them don't like forced PvP. Optional PvP is what they want and like, to go to fight when they feel like.

Phatkat is right, but I think a pure PvE server is not a very good idea, but a server without forced PvP would be very popular imo.

[Book]

I believe you are wrong, its not PvP vs PvE players, most of the players do like to PvP. The difference is that most of them don't like forced PvP. Optional PvP is what they want and like, to go to fight when they feel like.

Phatkat is right, but I think a pure PvE server is not a very good idea, but a server without forced PvP would be very popular imo.

I think this does describe a fair number of people. Just as Xyberviri points out, a lot of people who enjoy pvp also enjoy pve. The difference is, the pve experience is not really forced upon the pvp player at any given moment.

I guess that's kind of what safe zones do though, it's saying "no, you cannot pvp with me right this second." Some people seem to find that really annoying, and so should probably understand why it's annoying to have it the other way around as well.

Imagine logging on looking forward to some PvP and having PvE-centric players say, "nope, we're not going to let you do that today. We've chosen your playstyle for today regardless of what you actually felt like doing." Probably doesn't sound very enjoyable and wouldn't be put up with very long. That's precisely what can happen to folks who might just feel like chilling out without PvP when they logged on, this time around. Doesn't mean they never want to PvP, they just like having a choice or say in the matter seeing as this is their chance to have some downtime too. Not having a choice in the matter can be a real buzzkill for me. I don't really like buzzkills.

As far as the 50% 50% thing allowing warring tribes to exploit having a peaceful alt tribe to circumvent the spirit of the law, I've mentioned before something that might help. I like my little idea so I'll say it again Have specific areas to trade between the two zones limited so that the PvP tribe exposes itself to ambush, or needs to hold the trade outpost to access PvE goodness. They've already mentioned something about trade routes... similar idea. More chance to PvP on the given side.

[MrDDT]

I believe you are wrong, its not PvP vs PvE players, most of the players do like to PvP. The difference is that most of them don't like forced PvP. Optional PvP is what they want and like, to go to fight when they feel like.

Phatkat is right, but I think a pure PvE server is not a very good idea, but a server without forced PvP would be very popular imo.

I agree with this 100%, this is why the system I pointed out does just this. Both sides are happy.

Like Book is saying you are putting in a system which hurts PVPers (and really PVEers too). 50% 50% does not work for PVPers, so that system doesnt work.
Just like a no safe area doesnt work for PVEers.

My system clearly states, you want PVE and safe areas great. Stay in the limited preset safe areas, with your limited resources and able to build whatever you like. If you want PVP, come on over to the other areas and have at it.
I dont see a problem with this system. You still havnt given a reason why you cant have that system. Ive told you why you cant have the 50% 50%. Yet you didnt tell me why you cant have it my way?

[Book]

I agree with this 100%, this is why the system I pointed out does just this. Both sides are happy.

Like Book is saying you are putting in a system which hurts PVPers (and really PVEers too). 50% 50% does not work for PVPers, so that system doesnt work.
Just like a no safe area doesnt work for PVEers.

My system clearly states, you want PVE and safe areas great. Stay in the limited preset safe areas, with your limited resources and able to build whatever you like. If you want PVP, come on over to the other areas and have at it.
I dont see a problem with this system. You still havnt given a reason why you cant have that system. Ive told you why you cant have the 50% 50%. Yet you didnt tell me why you cant have it my way?

Because it relegates a substantial number of customers to second class citizen in a "limited" playpen

Homey won't play that, yo.

Edit: one thing where I wasn't clear, sorry. I'm not opposed to the 50% thing. I do understand the concern though so I was proposing the 50% idea, but with specified areas where trade would be possible so warriors can hinder their enemy's access to stuff from the PvE side, thereby cutting off the alt tribe. Hope that makes more sense...