If you are serious about player testing...

[ocoma]

...we need the tools to do so properly.

I'm glad there is a test server available to let players test patches before they go live and help with feedback and bug reporting. That said without the tools to really test with, the test server will not truely be of any use.

DAoC had a test server for players to use before a patch went live as well. They also had many testing features available to the players which allowed them to be thorough in their testing. Below are 2 examples.

Stat and skill resetting: This is is quite possibly the single most important feature needed for complete testing. On the DAoC test server players could make their toon any level, reset their stats and respec their skills at any time. This is extremely important for testing min/max differences and to see if things are scaling correctly. Additionally this let players test the effectiveness of various builds before spending large amounts of time and money changing their toons around on the real servers.

Static Mobs: There were 3 different melee damage types in DAoC, crush/slash/pierce. The test server had stationary mobs placed for players to use that each did a specific type of damage to test the effects of each damage type against avaliable armors. Additionally these mobs could be configured in various ways when testing. You could set them to be passive and not fight back to test positional attacks, defensive to test the ability to bypass parry and block abilities or aggressive. With the current work on mob AI and the addition of new mob types the ability to be able to test the effectiveness of the mobs would require ready access to the mobs so players dont have to hunt for an hour to find a mob to test on.

The above are just some simple examples of tools the players need for any real testing to be done. I personally have no problem jumping on a test server before new patches to help with player testing. But if you dont give us the tools required to test properly there really is no reason to have a test server imo.

[MrDDT]

I agree with this.

Also dont just copy the database over make it a whole new server. That way people cant use the test server to exploit info in the live server. Like check out another villages while their defenses are down on the test server etc.

Making skills min max quickly and maybe even cutting down the action times of stuff would be good.

All great points Ocoma.

I agree with this.

Also dont just copy the database over make it a whole new server. That way people cant use the test server to exploit info in the live server. Like check out another villages while their defenses are down on the test server etc.

Making skills min max quickly and maybe even cutting down the action times of stuff would be good.

All great points Ocoma.

[ocoma]

You bring up a valid point MrDDT. With these upcoming contested totems players should not be able to log onto the test server in order to precheck a tribe's defenses before they attack.

Anyone with any other testing tools/suggestions please post them so we can hopefully make the test server actually used and maybe help the game develop smoothly.

[Yzandor]

/signed

good point both of you

[temur]

Stat and skill resetting: This is is quite possibly the single most important feature needed for complete testing. On the DAoC test server players could make their toon any level, reset their stats and respec their skills at any time. This is extremely important for testing min/max differences and to see if things are scaling correctly. Additionally this let players test the effectiveness of various builds before spending large amounts of time and money changing their toons around on the real server.

**********
yeah test the shit on one "test"(min/max my toon)server , and later make a pwn toon on real one...thats your actual idea right? This is all you folks care bout ...your benefit.

"Additionally this let players test the effectiveness of various builds before spending large amounts of time and money changing their toons around on the real server."
specialy this is sad imo

[ocoma]

Stat and skill resetting: This is is quite possibly the single most important feature needed for complete testing. On the DAoC test server players could make their toon any level, reset their stats and respec their skills at any time. This is extremely important for testing min/max differences and to see if things are scaling correctly. Additionally this let players test the effectiveness of various builds before spending large amounts of time and money changing their toons around on the real server.

**********
yeah test the shit on one "test"(min/max my toon)server , and later make a pwn toon on real one...thats your actual idea right? This is all you folks care bout ...your benefit.

Quite obviously you've never been an active tester before. I've helped with player testing on multiple games. You can't tell if shiet is outta control unless you can test both the high and the low values for things, and see if the scaling is accurate inbetween. FYI my toon is 47 STR(3 pts statloss), 50 Fort and 50 Agi. Maybe get a clue about someone before you start saying shiet about them. I have no desire to "make a pwn toon" as you so moronically put it. Dont start posting about the objectives of people you know nothing about.


"Additionally this let players test the effectiveness of various builds before spending large amounts of time and money changing their toons around on the real server."
specialy this is sad imo

Well that is you opinion and you're welcome to it. If there is not going to be an easier stat reset option other then let your stuff decay then macro bricks for weeks to raise str or whatever stat you are working on, and a skill cap down the line with no easier way to respec skills that doesn't take weeks than its entirely valid IMO to let players try and TEST stuff out on a TEST SERVER so they don't get stuck into something they cant enjoy cause they messed up their build. This is more about down the line when addition skills are added and players are actually forced to make tough decisions on what skills they want and what they will have to skip on cause of the softcap.

^^^See bold for my reply

[temur]

quote up and and down as you like , and ive been in betas(not for having free game time btw)for mmos , youre arguments are imo weak and selfish and wont provide any valuable help to the overall state of the game .

[cbowsin]

I agree with Temur. If you think those are "simple examples of tools the players need for any real testing to be done." then it is clear to me you don't know what real testing is. I did lots of testing during the Beta of Xsyon and submitted lots of feedback and bug reports and it was all possible without any special tools. So if you want to be a tester, then that is great. There plenty of things to test. When doing a variety of actions make sure; the server doesn't crash, the client doesn't crash, the client/server doesn't lag. When performing a variety of tasks make sure; bugs don't appear, the results are as expected. When killing animals make sure; they are visible, they are killable, they produce the correct type of loot. With every patch, test everything all over again. The only thing you really need to test the game or any software application is the application itself. If NG truly wanted Min/Maxing in their game I'm sure they would have included statistic data visible to all.

[MrDDT]

I agree with Temur. If you think those are "simple examples of tools the players need for any real testing to be done." then it is clear to me you don't know what real testing is. I did lots of testing during the Beta of Xsyon and submitted lots of feedback and bug reports and it was all possible without any special tools. So if you want to be a tester, then that is great. There plenty of things to test. When doing a variety of actions make sure; the server doesn't crash, the client doesn't crash, the client/server doesn't lag. When performing a variety of tasks make sure; bugs don't appear, the results are as expected. When killing animals make sure; they are visible, they are killable, they produce the correct type of loot. With every patch, test everything all over again. The only thing you really need to test the game or any software application is the application itself. If NG truly wanted Min/Maxing in their game I'm sure they would have included statistic data visible to all.

What you are talking about and what he is talking about isnt the same thing.
You are talking about bugs crashing etc, and some of the basics.
He is talking about balancing.

Both are needed for testing.

Im sure you did a lot of testing for Xsyon in the past, but dont forget that the game is live now. That means you have to split your testing time with your playing time. Few people are willing to put = time into testing, or more than playing. Many people wont even log into the test server because of the live server is already out and there is lots to already test on the live server. Things like "make sure they are visible" for animals and stuff. What about the balance testing? How fast are they attacking, are they giving resources that are worth the time to kill, how fast do they respawn, are they breeding fast enough or slow enough.

If these tests were done on a test server you wouldnt have these issues on the live server where trees dont respawn, and animals are not breeding.

As right now, you can submit bugs, and feedback based on whats in the live server, however, without tools it will be slower and harder.

Thats the point he is trying to make which is a valid point. More tools = more testing can be done.

[cbowsin]

The tools he talks about doesn't identify balance issues that you mention. If you want to test the respawn rate of a tree, chop one down and sit around until it grows back. Want to test if animals breed, follow a pair around and see how long it takes for a little baby to pop out. Don't need any special tools to figure out that those features are either not ingame or are really really slow. My point is simple, if the developers want us to test min/maxing, scaling, balancing of skills then they will provide the means to do so. Since they have not, I am stating there are plenty of things that can be tested. If the OP was a "true tester" he would spend more time focused on the things he can test and less time on the things he wants to test. Which if were possible would make me totally uninterested in this game.