PvP does NOT have to mean combat.

[krimara]

You've just described everything wrong with the developers view of pvp.

Also, all the systems in game right now were NOT pvp players ideas they all came from scrubby carebears so if you are going to blame anyone for the game being dead, blame them.

Might as well take all combat out if there isn't going to be any sieging or anything of the like because without it the game is so many different levels of pointless.

Also you know what game has EXACTLY what you're asking for???? "A Tale In The Desert", you know why nobody plays it?? because it's BORING AND POINTLESS.

Really funny posts here though, so many people and yet so few braincells between them, no wonder the simplest points seem to elude them.

made the key points easier to read for the downies on the forums.

Ok, PvP is the only thing that will save this game. Go ahead and program the fixes and we shall all see the greatness....Oh wait you aren't the developer of the game. You don't have the vision they do of the future content for the game. So quit trolling, be constructive instead of destructive, have a cookie. It will all be ok.

[Dubanka]

that was a very constructive and a complete non-trolling post. snicker doodle please.

[krimara]

that was a very constructive and a complete non-trolling post. snicker doodle please.

I'm glad you seen the humor in the post.

*gives Dubanka two snicker doodles*

[Shrimps]

Gonna take a hell of a lot more than a cookie to make everything okay. Maybe a cupcake, or a brownie...NO a pie, mmm a chocolate pie.... BRB gonna make a pie.

[Trenchfoot]

Armed combat will not resolve anything in this game. It will ONLY serve to make a player feel a bit better that he "got it over" on a fellow player.

The reality is this...

Let's say you come over to show your amazing power and strength against me. I walk out to meet you, you kill me... AND.... what? I didn't even try and fight, I just stood here and let you kill me. You loot me and get a few easily replaced items, then I respawn back at my totem safe and sound.

What exactly have you resolved? regardless of how unreasonable you or I am, what has actually changed? You cannot take anything I cannot replace very easily. You cannot harm anything inside my tribal area, and the best you can do is remove trees in my area. None of that will change my ability to play whatsoever.

Well if egotism is the only prism thru which you view a motive for armed conflict then you would be right there.

Even if there were a few items I could actually lose that would be important to me, a bit more time and I can have them back or decide I don't need them after all.
The games mechanics are all there is to work with, and xsyon does not allow anything that would provide what you suggest.

Also what you guys seem to want, sieges, destroying structures that took months, and forcibly taking over other tribes is not on the table for here nor has it been.

So you're saying everything in the game currently that is inherently combat oriented are simply bait and switch marketing tools, and that they have no plans to give them purpose? Interesting.

I just cannot understand why you guys troll the forums and try to convince everyone that crush and destroy is the only viable pvp options when there are indeed many others. I think the issue is not so much that you don't understand, but more that you believe that if you say a thing loud enough and often enough it will become fact.

How do you propose we throw off lawlessness, oppression, and tyranny? By picketing or asking them nicely? When you remove the repercussions of peoples behavior you give them license to treat you as poorly as they wish and at the same time ties your hands so that your only recourse is to lay down and take it.

Lack produces need. Fulfilling need creates purpose. Without instability there is no need, and therefore no purpose. Now if you said that combat isn't the only instability that inspires purpose I would agree with you. I would also point out that the following things flourish under the umbrella of the threat of instability that combat provides. Things like, trade, diplomacy, mutual respect, common decency, civility, and peace.

Other things (like a dance off) do not inspire any of the above. Enjoy the game without them.

[MrDDT]

No clue when you played ddt, but I would have to bet is was not long at all. But with this subject you are not just off base but totally wrong.

In horizons, you could not interact directly with any player or npc. In fact you could walk right through them. Because of this, the ONLY way to pvp was to do some of the things mentioned. And YES folks did view those things as the only form of pvp. I was the leader of the longest running guild there, well know by all players and well respected. You sir, I'm sure nobody remembers at all.

And I agree with Severin, you have to try and spin things to your liking and are very willing to hijack threads to suit your purpose.

COMBAT is not the only way pvp is done. You don't get that and that's ok.

Shoot, even in Xsyon I compete with other players everyday. Just ask any other guild leader if they don't agree when I successfully recruit another new player. And where as I will never denude an area of trees or cut trees on any other tribes land, I will cut felled trees and craft with the logs IF ... notice I said IF, they are totally inactive. I will never roadover a junk pile like you have done, or nuke trees or structures when a tribe is moving their totem like you have.

Let's face it. Your style of play, although allowed, is certainly NOT liked or respected by other players. It is small minded and childish, and against your own interests, as can be seen by the many people you have run off from the game. Who you gonna pvp with now? OH!, that's right you can't because folks just don't want to put up with your antics when Xsyon is in this state.

Now that combat does not give YOU the advantage, it is what you cry about the most.

I played for a few months but got bored due to nothing else to do. Been there done that.

I never said there was PVP in Horizons. So dunno where you think Im "wrong" at. You should reread my post if you cant understand that.

Combat isnt the only way PVP is done, just so happens to be one of the best, if not thee best way its done. The stuff in your OP, is more like griefing than anything, and really I dont think it would be fun for anyone but a few griefers. Even then only for a short time til everyone (the last 200 people) quits.


I think non combat tactics are valid, however, they should be used WITH combat options not as the ONLY real choice.

You dont see me crying about it, in fact you should see me posting less on the forums dont you? You know why? Its getting to the point I just dont care. This game is moving so slow and in the wrong direction because of carebears that its pointless. Even when its proven how these wrong choices are messing up the game, they still cant admit its that.

I dont see how "combat" ever gave me an advantage in this game, advantage over what? Winning all the PVP events? For crappy rewards? I have more crafting skills than just about everyone I know, I dont see how "combat" gave me an advantage of anything.

Ok, PvP is the only thing that will save this game. Go ahead and program the fixes and we shall all see the greatness....Oh wait you aren't the developer of the game. You don't have the vision they do of the future content for the game. So quit trolling, be constructive instead of destructive, have a cookie. It will all be ok.

I love how people like this go from one extreme to the next.

I dont see anyone saying "PVP will save this game" however, I do see people saying that its a darn good start.

When you promise something in a game, you should have it for the people that bought it based on that promise. PVP isnt like saying "oh you can have pink hair" its a full system, which needs support systems to go with it. It would be like removing skills from the game completely.

This is what they did to the PVPers. Combat is broken, its not fun, no value, and not even close to being ready for "balancing".

Carebears made this game a sim, and guess what they are not happy with it. They are crying for it to change, its too funny.

[Liquidblade]

as much as I hate to say it.....this game needs people like MrDDT. There has to be a balance between the good and the bad.....with out it people will be bored. Like Trenchfoot said "Lack produces need. Fulfilling need creates purpose. Without instability there is no need, and therefore no purpose. Now if you said that combat isn't the only instability that inspires purpose I would agree with you. I would also point out that the following things flourish under the umbrella of the threat of instability that combat provides. Things like, trade, diplomacy, mutual respect, common decency, civility, and peace."

I know that MrDDT may have pushed some people to quit....but where was the good guys? We have a mentality of " My neigh boor is getting raped, but this does not concern me, cause is not happening to me" We should have brought the fight back to MrDDT. Now that he doesnt play people have nothing to worry about and get bored! Just a thought.

[aliksteel]

To the OP, Just to clear up if anyone is thinking I'm for this type of game play. No I'm not, I never posted to this point because I feel people should be able to share there idea's here. No mater how I like them or not.

Now to the rest of this de-railed post that went to shit!!!

Let' blame the Carebears!!!
From almost the start of the Xsyon forums, People that wanted FFA PVP has said that carebears are killing the game. I've read forum members post that said at first the game was going to be FFA PVP. I have never read anything from Jooky saying this. Mater-A-Fact I don't think I would have joined the game if I had read that.

Am I a Carebears, Fanboy, Sim Player? You damn straight I am,
I play the way I enjoy playing, Just like YOU ALL DO!

Do I want FFA PVP? HELL NO!!!

Do want it to be all PVE? HELL NO!!!

I do want PVP,
But do I want it to be unsafe 100% of the time? HELL NO!!!

I do want safe area's to a point, There will be very few tribe(At lest at the start) that can have a 24/7 PVP team in-game. And I damn sure don't want to log in one morning and find that some asshat has come to my town over night when no one was logged in and trashed it so bad that we would have to rebuild everything. How the dev team works out the way medieval siege type play will work, Well thats up to them, And I'm all for it. Do it in a way I like, I stay playing. Do it wrong and I walk. I have no problem with having to fight to keep what I want. I just don't want it to be in a way that people can take my city out when we are not online.

Don't blame the carebears for something they did not do, Jooky said from the start it would never be a Darkfall game, Stop trying to tell everyone it was and the carebears stopped Jooky from doing that. From the first time I read the front page of the website I have never read anything anything that said it would be FFA.

And when it comes to people saying there is nothing to do in the game, And it has no meaning. What do you think will be that meaning? The game will be run by the players, Value is the monetary worth of something, We say what that worth is. What the dev team has to do is slow down how fast we level and how much we all can do across the board. This is already started, and being worked on as well. But for the most part we will be the ones running the nut house. And if you can't come up with something on your own, Maybe you need to start recruiting poeple that can.

God willing, This will be my only rant for the month.

[Mactavendish]

3 of the last few posts have been nothing but trolls spinning things like they always do.

Take trenchfoot's comments. It is obvious that you have not read everything posted here by the owner and developer of the game, you have been listening to the other trolls to much. Even the last answer to the questions about sieges was NO from Jordi. I am decidedly NOT saying anything was bait and switch at all, thats what you and your fellow trolls say. I am saying it was never promised to be what you think. And to be sure you fully understand, I am NOT against combat at all. I have been saying it is not the ONLY form of pvp, maybe that's just too complex a sentence for you and I am sorry about that.

I fully agree with you that lack produces need, and that this game currently has no real needs. I have said this myself many times. ( again you don't read anything but fellow troll posts do you? ) There are many ways need can be developed. You just happen to think that combat is the only "real" method to accomplish it. And this I disagree with. Lack of resources create need as well, as does rarity, difficulty of getting the resources and how fast things need to be replaced. Slowly they are working on all that.

Shiimp and ddt believe carebears ruined this game. Blame who you feel is responsible, but remember the developer makes the choices, NOT the players. At best we can suggest and complain, then they in turn will decide if an idea has merit or not and whether it fits their vision of the game. So far, I have NOT seen them change from what THEY wanted to do based on player input if it goes against what they have always been working towards. It it true they have added a few nice things at the request of players, but they have also taken away things the pvp'ers wanted and made systems function in ways none of the players asked for. So really fellas, your claims that the carebears killed or modified the game to their vision is not only totally false, it again it's selfs-serving and not in the best interest of the game at large.

Liquideblade, I agree with you totally about the good need to rise to the challenge that evil players create. The only exception I would take to you comments is the fact that we really don't have the mechanics to stop some kinds of evil. For example, if an evil player came over and paved over your junk piles, how do you stop him? If you are a homesteader you move, if a tribe you attempt to kill him over and over till he stops. Another example, an evil player comes and clear cuts you area and destroys the logs as well. We all know that you need a tree to sprout a tree. How are you going to have resources close by? You are not, so you have to leave your camp and attempt to drag logs back to camp. just for the sake of argument, is that something any of us find fun? Even ddt realizes that is a very bad mechanic that needs fixing. Or how about the crafter type players that do not want to pvp. How can they exist in this world along side crush and dominate players without some form of safe zone?

Aliksteel, I don't want pve only either. And in actuality I am not a carebear either. I am not blind to any of the issues here, and keenly feel the problems these issues create for all players everyday. Having a very active tribe, I hear all the time what players like and dislike and how it affects them. Combat changes have not made any of them happy. If anything it has made doing some things MUCH more tedious in an already over tedious game. I do applaud the developers for adjusting some things to be less tedious, but also have no delusions that they will make it all easy peezy for me. Lack of animals is of great concern to me personally as its the best source of bones and we all need better armor if they fix combat. I love to build, and feel if should take effort, but the lack of simple things like ramps make 2-3 story buildings a long and laborious JOB, not a fun form of entertainment. ALL these things are being worked on, and we see them making progress, albeit slow.

Folks.. This entire game is a work in progress. It has been restated many times by the developer he wants all types to play in the same world, and that he wants safety for those that are not interested in pvp, BUT that he wants pvp as well to exist here. HE is working out how that will happen. Slowly we are moving there, and one day I'm sure we will see something unique and amazing here. IN THE MEAN TIME.... I suggest we all play if we enjoy it, move on if we don't and ALL try and get into the idea of what the game is trying to do, and see what you can help make.

[Yuyito]

The funny thing is: same people keep arguing about "pvp" vs "carebear". Meanwhile, the game keeps circling the drain. Another victim of over promised, under deliver, and a complete lack of vision. It's like the slowest train wreck in history. Enjoy the ride... chooo, chooo!!!