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  1. #51
    Why do you say that? Do I need to make a video to prove it?

    It's really sad that you will never fix this game if you do not recognize its flaws.

    I've put more hours into this game than most people, likely more than anyone currently playing, saying to ignore me is really said. I've also updated the wiki likely more than any non guide.

    Fact, you can get 300$ in 10 mins or less in this game as a new player with 5 skill scavenging. You don't have to get "lucky" to do it either. Dollars are extremely easy to get.

    On the topic of death, a new player losing all their gear is not a major issue as it is very easy to replace that level of gear. Having said that, I also believe there needs to be more goals and direction for people to want to do things. Like building a village.

  2. #52
    yeah I'm just gonna restate this isn't a economy discussion its a revive discussion

    you as a player of years may/may not be finding hundreds of dollars but the rest of us are not so its a invalid search - I'm talking the average normal player

    this is why I wanted the damaged equipment is fine but it needs low level (30ish) with only resource requirements to repair and mid level and high level with money - this really won't effect the economy since low levels will not be buying high grade stuff for a week or more so by then they will be making 40+ stuff by then and needing the cash so without them feeling over whelmed early game increasing both supply / demand on the trade system

    also as for giving people stuff I've only gotten 1 helmet because I helped kill the coyote and showed the hunter where several others were - I did get offered a cart ( low level basic one) simply cause my neighbor was grinding them and I'd helped him with some stuff - any high level items were sold to me (buying a high grade cart for 2500 bricks) not handed to me

    I'm assuming your server is war since I've never seen you so the rules / info may differ


    however this still is about the revive system not the other systems being working / broken

    so in simplest terms my suggestion was

    10% durability of a item lost with resources being used for under Quality 30 - over 30 resources + cash used
    5% cash lost in pve 10% lost in pvp unless stockpiled somewhere like a town bank
    10min stat reduction (figure 25% stat reduction)
    20% exp loss

    also to help even out early game to help newer players there could simply be buffs that reduce food/water requirements as well as death penalties - this will give them say 7 days to get used to the game before they start losing gear letting them learn a bit before having to worry

  3. #53
    I understand you are new to the game might not understand some of the systems in the game. Like new players can not die from lack of food and water. So they already have that system in that you are asking for.

    Again losing gear that is next to worthless is very easy to recover. Getting new gear is very very easy and fast. It's not going to rain free items easy, but I could wonder the world for an hour and likely find 100s of gear sets that new players can use. Sadly, there is no reason as a new player to even use gear other than tools. It even hurts you to have the gear not help you. Which is another topic.

    The problem is lack of understanding of what new players need to do, and their drive to do it. If wearing clothing was needed (as one might expect) then I can understand your concern. However for new players wearing ANYTHING (or having anything on them) that is not 100% needed at that moment in time or for whatever they are looking to currently due, is not a good idea. You A)can lose it, and B) it weighs you down greatly.

    Back to the main topic about death. Death should be a punishment and it should be felt. Using resources is a good idea to repair, expect the fact that again you are promoting solo only play and people to just do whatever and get it for free. Instead of driving players to survival and banding together to achieve great things.

    PS. I can play on both servers the rules are the same with that type of scav system. However, I did the test on PEACE server.

  4. #54
    no the systems pretty similar to ultima online / star wars galaxies / and wurm online and is simpler then The Repopulation (no crafted towns mostly prefab structures sadly in repopulation) pretty simple to grasp to be honest once you have played similar games and since I've been playing sandboxes around 18 years since before the name of sandboxes the systems pretty easy for me to grasp - however also having been a volunteer and paid admin / gm for games as well as training several thousand players I know what to expect about peoples wants / what they are willing to do early game before rage quiting

    as the system goes scaving different piles have different rates of materials and after scaving everything within 2-4 hours jog from me and my cart I've still not found 500$ in 2 weeks of spending 1-2 hours a day scaving - the people in the game I've spoken to also don't find this amount - and since carts are 200$ for a basic one and take more then 10mins to build why would they sell them? why would you waste time making anything if you can just earn thousands a hour? my only concept is either you are using some way different way of scaving or are using some exploit or just making up numbers

    its like we are talking in different languages cause what I'm writing and what your responding to isn't quiet the same

    this is your response
    Back to the main topic about death. Death should be a punishment and it should be felt. Using resources is a good idea to repair, expect the fact that again you are promoting solo only play and people to just do whatever and get it for free. Instead of driving players to survival and banding together to achieve great things.

    this was what you responded to
    this is why I wanted the damaged equipment is fine but it needs low level (30ish) with only resource requirements to repair and mid level and high level with money - this really won't effect the economy since low levels will not be buying high grade stuff for a week or more so by then they will be making 40+ stuff by then and needing the cash so without them feeling over whelmed early game increasing both supply / demand on the trade system

    so if you read this you will see the initial low level tools are resource only - but as progression of higher quality tools go they need more and more help - thus to maintain large amount of good gear you need a large tribe as they will need to replace parts if its broken or damaged over X%

    2nd I was more worried about stamina then death for new players

    3rd after around 12-24 hours of wandering I've scavenged a few items from towns mostly resources for construction - have not seen hundreds of barrels of tools / cloths

    and I'm pretty sure a multi staged death penalty is a punishment your losing item quality - xp - skill points - temp skill loss - and money - I mean other then perma death or sucker punching a character I don't see how much more punishment you can get - I mean compared to your response of item loss with cash insurance this is a far larger punishment.
    Last edited by Darkkmercy; 10-02-2015 at 06:53 AM.

  5. #55
    Don't you think making it resource to fix your items then changing it to $ to fix them would confuse people? Plus cash later as a vet is next to worthless and resources are much more of value. So really, you are costing the new player more than you end up costing the vet which seems really backwards to me. Which I understand that at the time the cash is harder for a new player to get than resources, but resources are harder to get for a vet.

    But yes, your system will work other than the confusing part and making it seem backwards to me.

    Why I say it's backwards is that vets use 1000s of resources a day, and very little cash at all.

  6. #56
    once again

    not cash OR resources
    CASH + resources at higher levels

    however if you want simple - drop a item 1 level per repair meaning people have to buy / build new tools if they want the shiny bonuses

    also items lowered to broken status will need a replacement piece randomly selected

    also while people might use less cash long term - if a new player has zero access to money till they randomly find a stack of cash they can't repair a tool - and since many tools need 5 other tools to make that most players won't have access to for 1-3 weeks depending on how much they play it can handicap a new player very quickly

    also I'm looking at similar games for repairs such as wurm online - the repopulation - and even some more standard games for ideas

    for instance in wurm online you could improve completed tools which upon repair degrade the quality of the tool then it has to be improved again - this is a viable idea but requires much more coding and work so while good its a bit of a distance coding wise

    the repopulation uses generic repair kits for each part - and has a chance to lower the quality per use of one - so you can quickly make your favorite item worthless if you over use it without a replacement nearby - you then have to take it apart toss the bad pieces and remake it with new parts - once again a fun viable system fair for all levels but very code intensive

    other games generally use a more generic specific resource is used in repairs - such as the forest uses tree sap to repair things - or diablo's full money system

    now while all these are good ways of doing it - its all about is it good for THIS game and how viable is it for a small team to make quickly and implement

    I think the biggest problem is the death penalties is without knowing repair systems / improve tools functions / will broken tools be fixable? / and how much work is the dev willing to put into a idea its a bit of a snowball of confusion

    I think the big question is - what systems do we need in place to make a viable death penalty system - I mean I'd start with basic xp loss - as it seems the easiest to code - then move into a decay of tools function which of course would need a repair system (a big big needed thing) - also you could do a cash loss but once again a brand new system needs to be placed

    in the end I think so many new systems will have to be made we need to decide which is needed FIRST over which is the best / most fitting for xsyon

  7. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkkmercy View Post
    yeah I'm just gonna restate this isn't a economy discussion its a revive discussion

    so in simplest terms my suggestion was

    10% durability of a item lost with resources being used for under Quality 30 - over 30 resources + cash used
    5% cash lost in pve 10% lost in pvp unless stockpiled somewhere like a town bank
    10min stat reduction (figure 25% stat reduction)
    20% exp loss
    10% Durability loss - I presume you are referring to equipped armor ?

    and I presume you mean quality rather then durability ?

    High end armor is very very difficult to replace, so any loss of quality would have to be 100% repairable.
    (Im talking about armor made with 100 quality and 100 power mats)

    So im not really infavour of having armor reduced in effectiveness.

    Besides armor is already being reduced in quality each time it is hit.
    So that idea is in game already, so much so that players who have really
    good armor dont even wear it now because it cannot be replaced.

    5% cash - you mean cash carried on the player rather then the hoard the player will have back at their tribe ?
    so players will carry little or no cash around with them to avoid this

    10 min stat reduction ? this one is quite bad because no one will want to wait 10 minutes after being killed to go hunt again so I am not in favor of this idea at all. I wont go back to hunting with a 10% stat loss.

    20% exp loss? I presume you mean the green points bar. not bad, its easy to replace (if you dont keep dieing, and doesnt affect the players ability to get right back to hunting. ie no stat
    loss or gear damage. The last thing Xyson needs is a mechanic that stops players from wanting
    to play.


    I have referred to armor for the quality loss but in some of your posts you are talking about tools or are you referring to ingame mechanics as tools rather then say a ingame tool like a hammer ?

    Sark
    Last edited by chojinuk; 10-06-2015 at 06:26 PM.

  8. #58
    To stop deathporting you need to make using a cart more attractive in the first place.

    Not penalise people for deathporting.

    Make a loaded cart weigh a set amount regardless of whats in it
    or if that is to much carrot.

    make a fully loaded cart thats really heavy slow your run speed down 50%
    a light cart say 10% and the weights inbetween can be % incremental upto 50% slower

    so players will want to run a full cart rather then deathport as it only lets you
    move 2 baskets worth.

    Sark
    Last edited by chojinuk; 10-06-2015 at 07:12 PM.

  9. #59
    I agree with you Sark, its a multi issue subject. Removal of deathporting IMO is the start but before you do that you also need to have other things in place with that patch. Like better working cart/mount system.
    Anothing thing I would like to see is maybe a rail system around the lake. Faster travel. Make it toll use only (1000$ per trip).

    There are lots of ways to do it, but punishing deathporting needs to be in place without breaking other systems. Making it too hard on newer players and making it too hard on vets is not the answer there needs to be ideas and balances in place.

  10. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by chojinuk View Post
    10% Durability loss - I presume you are referring to equipped armor ?

    and I presume you mean quality rather then durability ?

    High end armor is very very difficult to replace, so any loss of quality would have to be 100% repairable.
    (Im talking about armor made with 100 quality and 100 power mats)

    So im not really infavour of having armor reduced in effectiveness.

    Besides armor is already being reduced in quality each time it is hit.
    So that idea is in game already, so much so that players who have really
    good armor dont even wear it now because it cannot be replaced.

    5% cash - you mean cash carried on the player rather then the hoard the player will have back at their tribe ?
    so players will carry little or no cash around with them to avoid this

    10 min stat reduction ? this one is quite bad because no one will want to wait 10 minutes after being killed to go hunt again so I am not in favor of this idea at all. I wont go back to hunting with a 10% stat loss.

    20% exp loss? I presume you mean the green points bar. not bad, its easy to replace (if you dont keep dieing, and doesnt affect the players ability to get right back to hunting. ie no stat
    loss or gear damage. The last thing Xyson needs is a mechanic that stops players from wanting
    to play.


    I have referred to armor for the quality loss but in some of your posts you are talking about tools or are you referring to ingame mechanics as tools rather then say a ingame tool like a hammer ?

    Sark
    going down the list

    first armor reduction wouldn't be as big of a deal since repair would be in place BEFORE this was implemented - so your armor will be temp reduced by death then repaired

    5% cash would need a new cash system where dropping it in a container is not available only a deposit in totem bank for say for a 0-5% fee

    10mins is pretty standard mmo timers in most games of this type

    and exp loss at 20% while not bad and replaceable is still better then other options such as permanent skill loss like other sandboxes

    also they really just need 2 things to stop death porting - fix it so you can not carry over your max weight - stopping 2500 bricks from being ported - and carts with animals on them so they can move around with large amounts of supply's easily - same would go for some kind of raft that you could sail to waters edge to pick up goods and move them down rivers to carts on shore removing a large run around the lake for players and letting shops on shore become more viable

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