One Giant PEACE Server

[Aethaeryn]

Well the peaceful also likely will have the benefit of being trade hubs and will end up richer than a warring tribe (wars cost money, you need equips). I mean for me tech always seems to get better with competition and if the peaceful have a way to risk their stuff but in a peaceful way, maybe through trading or other big things that doesn't necessarily mean fighting then I totally agree with peace getting other game mechanic benefits. If not, they don't deserve rewards just for being peaceful.

Well maybe they should just get vendor stalls

Of course there is nothing from stopping a Pandemic Craft tribe that is full of recruited carebears. . has trade stalls and is right beside Pandemic KLLZJU tribe. You also would have the advantage or selling what you loot there. Well. . loot is mostly going to be garbage though I suppose. Have the warriors in the war tribe. Honestly that is what a large tribe should be looking at. Hopi for example might benefit from that and then you could duke it out all you want and tear down each others war factions.. . . man that makes it no risk for anyone and is already possible given what we expect to happen. I think I just argued against having safe tribal areas at all. Stream of thought that changed my own mind FTW.

[wolfmoonstrike]

Well maybe they should just get vendor stalls

Of course there is nothing from stopping a Pandemic Craft tribe that is full of recruited carebears. . has trade stalls and is right beside Pandemic KLLZJU tribe. You also would have the advantage or selling what you loot there. Well. . loot is mostly going to be garbage though I suppose. Have the warriors in the war tribe. Honestly that is what a large tribe should be looking at. Hopi for example might benefit from that and then you could duke it out all you want and tear down each others war factions.. . . man that makes it no risk for anyone and is already possible given what we expect to happen. I think I just argued against having safe tribal areas at all. Stream of thought that changed my own mind FTW.

Yup my same thoughts and problems with safezones. I honestly don't think peace should be given but should be earned. Either through diplomacy or by force. IF you want peace, be the best defensive minded tribe in the game and enforce peace in your cities. I honestly think safezones may make it where people don't have to take accountability for their actions by abusing the safezones. Though I also believe their should be harsher penalties for death, and everybody should be included in those penalties. People should have to pay for both their actions and inactions.

[river111]

Well, I'm fine with this under one condition. There need to be some major benefits to declaring as a warring tribe. It should not just be for shits & giggles. There should be some big juicy carrot to tempt the crafter tribes to declare for war. I'm thinking rare resources only available to tribes that declare for war, or something along those lines. No tribe should be able to have full access to everything without some element of risk involved.

I'm very happy with the decision but yes I agree about the carrot. there needs to be MASSIVE rewards to be had on non safezone territory, risk vs reward baby.

I'm completely missing this one here, you chose to engage in a particular play style. By choice, and you expect a reward for chosing it?

Let me see if I get this one right. If the game has some carrot for the war tribes, lets say this rare crafting mat or something. Does this not FORCE the peopel who craft to be a part of the war tribes even if they do not want to in order to get that rare crafting mat?

So while you actively chose to go to war, you want a carrot that forces those that do not want to go to war, to have to go to war. Is that what I'm seeing here?

I'm fine with risk vs reward yes, but allowing one to chose and others having no choice is not acceptable to me. Any reward put in must NOT be something that those on the other side of the choice need as well to play the way they chose.

This idea you have here is similar to the rare mats in WoW dungeons and raids. Which forces people who like to craft but do not like doing raids to have to do raids to get the mats and recipes so they can play as a crafter. Yet in reverse, there is no requirement for a raider to have to craft in order to do what they like, raiding. It has to go both ways. If your reward, your carrot is only usable by those who chose your path thats fine and good to go, but I will not go for a carrot that forces people to play a style they do not want to play.

[wolfmoonstrike]

I'm completely missing this one here, you chose to engage in a particular play style. By choice, and you expect a reward for chosing it?

Let me see if I get this one right. If the game has some carrot for the war tribes, lets say this rare crafting mat or something. Does this not FORCE the peopel who craft to be a part of the war tribes even if they do not want to in order to get that rare crafting mat?

So while you actively chose to go to war, you want a carrot that forces those that do not want to go to war, to have to go to war. Is that what I'm seeing here?

I'm fine with risk vs reward yes, but allowing one to chose and others having no choice is not acceptable to me. Any reward put in must NOT be something that those on the other side of the choice need as well to play the way they chose.

This idea you have here is similar to the rare mats in WoW dungeons and raids. Which forces people who like to craft but do not like doing raids to have to do raids to get the mats and recipes so they can play as a crafter. Yet in reverse, there is no requirement for a raider to have to craft in order to do what they like, raiding. It has to go both ways. If your reward, your carrot is only usable by those who chose your path thats fine and good to go, but I will not go for a carrot that forces people to play a style they do not want to play.

The peaceful aren't being hampered in their play style by rewarding the warriors, but the warriors are accenting the peaceful players. See the peaceful chose to be peaceful and thus are being rewarded by not having to fight or even defending themselves and trading for what they want. The warriors are risking their land to gain more land and thus are rewarded by having better resources and technologies derived from those resources.

No Risk means No Reward imo. If you want something you should risk something to get it, which the warriors are.

[river111]

The peaceful aren't being hampered in their play style by rewarding the warriors, but the warriors are accenting the peaceful players. See the peaceful chose to be peaceful and thus are being rewarded by not having to fight or even defending themselves and trading for what they want. The warriors are risking their land to gain more land and thus are rewarded by having better resources and technologies derived from those resources.

No Risk means No Reward imo. If you want something you should risk something to get it, which the warriors are.

Thats fine yes, as long as the reward you get for going to war is NOT something needed by those who do not chose to go to war. Not sure your understanding what I'm saying here. Its not that the peaceful deserve no reward or that the ones taking the risk deserve one, its WHAT that reward is.

If you make that reward anythign that places a significant margin between the two types over time you risk a complete imbalance in the game. Lets say for instance you give the war tribes access to a rare resource that allows them to make a type of armor that normal crafted weapons can't hit. That the only way to hurt someone wearing this armor is to craft a weapon that also requires this rare resource to make. Now, add 6 months to the timeline.

In 6 months time all the war tribes have become completely invulnerable to all the peaceful tribes. And any peaceful or 'new' tribe that just entered the game will never be able to compete on the same level with the existing war tribes. Sure this is great if your in the game called EvE where if you have been in it since launch, your corp is basically untouchable by anyone who just enters the game today. But is that what you really want here?

And on the other hand, if that rare resource you get for becoming a war tribe allows for something to be crafted that lets you build a special building which decreases the decay timers on everything stored in it. Now you give an unfair advantage to the war tribes, and if the peaceful tribes want that building they would be forced to become a war tribe to get it, even if they really do not want to.

Hopefully you can see my point on this carrot issue. Its not that I dont think there should be one, and I do not think there shouldnt be a risk/reward added, but you have to be very careful on what that reward is.

[baka77]

Thats fine yes, as long as the reward you get for going to war is NOT something needed by those who do not chose to go to war. Not sure your understanding what I'm saying here. Its not that the peaceful deserve no reward or that the ones taking the risk deserve one, its WHAT that reward is.

If you make that reward anythign that places a significant margin between the two types over time you risk a complete imbalance in the game. Lets say for instance you give the war tribes access to a rare resource that allows them to make a type of armor that normal crafted weapons can't hit. That the only way to hurt someone wearing this armor is to craft a weapon that also requires this rare resource to make. Now, add 6 months to the timeline.

In 6 months time all the war tribes have become completely invulnerable to all the peaceful tribes. And any peaceful or 'new' tribe that just entered the game will never be able to compete on the same level with the existing war tribes. Sure this is great if your in the game called EvE where if you have been in it since launch, your corp is basically untouchable by anyone who just enters the game today. But is that what you really want here?

And on the other hand, if that rare resource you get for becoming a war tribe allows for something to be crafted that lets you build a special building which decreases the decay timers on everything stored in it. Now you give an unfair advantage to the war tribes, and if the peaceful tribes want that building they would be forced to become a war tribe to get it, even if they really do not want to.

Hopefully you can see my point on this carrot issue. Its not that I dont think there should be one, and I do not think there shouldnt be a risk/reward added, but you have to be very careful on what that reward is.

Your scenario is too extreme. The margin should not be to the level of invulnerability, but it should be to the level of advantage. The carebears should have to decide if having combat capability on equal footing is worth giving up their precious safe zones. It's all about choices. I think it would be silly to allow only one side to have their cake & eat it too.

[Maciver]

Personally, I would prefer no safe zones. Mainly because it's artificial, and dumbs down the game.

On the other hand. Theres entirely way to many people who wont see the bigger picture, what this game can actually become. These are the people that run around, grief, kill for no reason, and be an immature pos. They are the ones we can thank for the need of artificial boundries in gaming.

PvP is alot of fun. I love it, which is why I wouldnt want the safe area. The mechanics that are in mind now, make the game less appealing.

If it were me, I would make a simple compromise. On server open, turn pvp off completely for a week or two. Enough time for people to get a peice of land and throw a wall up. Then turn it on fully. No magic safe area. Griefers are bricked for the open, then its up to the player to protect his community/town/area. Just my opinion.

[Burnt]

Personally, I would prefer no safe zones. Mainly because it's artificial, and dumbs down the game.

On the other hand. Theres entirely way to many people who wont see the bigger picture, what this game can actually become. These are the people that run around, grief, kill for no reason, and be an immature pos. They are the ones we can thank for the need of artificial boundries in gaming.

PvP is alot of fun. I love it, which is why I wouldnt want the safe area. The mechanics that are in mind now, make the game less appealing.

If it were me, I would make a simple compromise. On server open, turn pvp off completely for a week or two. Enough time for people to get a piece of land and throw a wall up. Then turn it on fully. No magic safe area. Griefers are bricked for the open, then its up to the player to protect his community/town/area. Just my opinion.

Thats basically what is planned anyway, just replace "two weeks" with 6-9 months, and "throw a wall up", to build walls, gates, defense and so on. The 6-9 months is time for development of features that are needed before there are no safe zones, such as pvp, alignment, tribal warfare etc. etc.

[river111]

Your scenario is too extreme. The margin should not be to the level of invulnerability, but it should be to the level of advantage. The carebears should have to decide if having combat capability on equal footing is worth giving up their precious safe zones. It's all about choices. I think it would be silly to allow only one side to have their cake & eat it too.

I think it would be silly to give one side their cake % eat it too, and thats exactly what I'm saying just form the other side. How about we reverse your statement a little. Lets give a rerward to those that can successfully foster diplomacy and a healthy polical structure, and NOT to the warmongers. Still in favor of a level of advantage? The way I see this argument is simple, you believe the advantage should go to those who foster war, and only those that foster war, and that if you dont foster war, then you shouldnt' get a level advantage. I say no. I think the warmongers should have to try and play poletics, I think they should have to decide it having to maintain peace is worth getting an equal footing with the carebears.

I know your going to twist this all around and say its stupid, I expect nothing less to be honest. Fact remains though, you want it your way, to your advantage, because you chose to play one style, and you feel anyone who doesn't chose your style of play should either get on bored or get lost. I agree, I think you should get on board with my chosen play style or get lost. I think all PvPers should be forced to become carebears or they wont get the advantages they get.

Still think its a fair argument?

[Bear5732]

You people complaining about homesteads need to get out of your comfort zone and explore. There are tons of junk piles in and around the mist, where very few tribes settle (if any) - there are junkpiles in the mountains, there are resources everywhere. Hell, you can live in a junkpile in the mist, near water/trees and animals, and no one will ever even know you are there.