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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Salvadore View Post
    I cant really figure out if you just like to blindly argue in a delusional fashion or really have no idea what keeps people logging into an MMO.
    I honestly believe its just trolling at this point.

  2. #162
    I am in favour of capturable expansion totems, but NOT destructible buildings. The cost in time and resources to build things makes them not worth building if they can be gone in an hour. Capture the totem - capture the surrounding buildings, but they can't be destroyed for a week - to give a chance to win them back.

    Added after 6 minutes:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jadzia View Post
    I wonder if you really don't understand it, or you just like to argue. Economy is not driven by risk/loss...its driven by demand. And there is no demand for anything in the game now. NOTHING. Since nothing has any purpose. You can gather thousands of armors by PvP...but why ? To sit, stare at them and be proud ? Because they have no other use right now.

    The problem with the economy is not that people have secured resources. The problem is that there are no rare resources. I have a homestead which has no junkpile, no water, no wood. I live beside a huge junkpile though. I gather without safety but still that doesn't boost the economy, does it ? We have so many junkpiles, so many resources, why would anyone fight over a land if there is a better one 5 minutes away ? Thats why there is no tradeing. I can craft everything by myself, I can gather everything by myself, why would I trade ?
    Why would I fear the PvP system ? There is nothing to lose. NOTHING. And nothing to gain either. Whatever you loot from me I have dozen of it at home, and probably you have dozens of it at home too. PvP is totally pointless if items have no use. Owning an item is pointless if that item is pointless itself. We need an economy first to give purpose for crafting and PvP. Till then none of them has any use.
    I think meaningful (costly) PvP would be worse than pointless PvP. It takes too much to build up things in Xsyon, to risk losing them. Face it, this game is pretty brutal WITHOUT PvP. Losing a house that took me a week to build would be a considerable incentive to quit.

    I have no objection to losing some items on death, but not my needed tools. It's enough that we are fighting the GAME for survival.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Azhul_NS View Post
    I am in favour of capturable expansion totems, but NOT destructible buildings. The cost in time and resources to build things makes them not worth building if they can be gone in an hour. Capture the totem - capture the surrounding buildings, but they can't be destroyed for a week - to give a chance to win them back.

    Added after 6 minutes:



    I think meaningful (costly) PvP would be worse than pointless PvP. It takes too much to build up things in Xsyon, to risk losing them. Face it, this game is pretty brutal WITHOUT PvP. Losing a house that took me a week to build would be a considerable incentive to quit.

    I have no objection to losing some items on death, but not my needed tools. It's enough that we are fighting the GAME for survival.


    Not sure what youre talking about! Things are far too easy to get and build in Xsyon... You've been playing what 2-3 days and youre going on about how costly things are? (time/resources)

    In what way is the game brutal? (other than boring) You want for nothing, have no real opposition and are 100% safe in your bubble

    To your comment about PvP... Ummm Wow??? Btw, Have you even experienced PvP yet?

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Jadzia View Post
    I wonder if you really don't understand it, or you just like to argue. Economy is not driven by risk/loss...its driven by demand. And there is no demand for anything in the game now. NOTHING. Since nothing has any purpose. You can gather thousands of armors by PvP...but why ? To sit, stare at them and be proud ? Because they have no other use right now.

    The problem with the economy is not that people have secured resources. The problem is that there are no rare resources. I have a homestead which has no junkpile, no water, no wood. I live beside a huge junkpile though. I gather without safety but still that doesn't boost the economy, does it ? We have so many junkpiles, so many resources, why would anyone fight over a land if there is a better one 5 minutes away ? Thats why there is no tradeing. I can craft everything by myself, I can gather everything by myself, why would I trade ?
    Why would I fear the PvP system ? There is nothing to lose. NOTHING. And nothing to gain either. Whatever you loot from me I have dozen of it at home, and probably you have dozens of it at home too. PvP is totally pointless if items have no use. Owning an item is pointless if that item is pointless itself. We need an economy first to give purpose for crafting and PvP. Till then none of them has any use.
    you're partially right, but your dot connecting is off.

    an economy is driven by demand, which is in turn driven by need, which is driven by scarcity and necessity.

    Players have to need something. THen there has to be an inability for them to obtain that which they need.

    PVP is an integral component in creating need.
    Need for armor
    Need for weapons

    Territorial warfare is integral to creating a need for tribal area improvements
    Need for walls
    Need for gates

    crafting is a means to produce goods that fill a need. crafting itself is not a need.
    raw materials --> crafted goods --> goods get destroyed through use --> need for new goods

    Currently there is no need for goods, since they have no real utility.

    SO to bring this back on point:
    Without pvp, a large portion of the crafteable items are merely for vanity.
    Without territorial conflict, a large portion of the crafteable structures and terraformed improvements are merely playing house...they have no purpose.

    Create the utility, you create the need, you create the economy.

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by Azhul_NS View Post
    I am in favour of capturable expansion totems, but NOT destructible buildings. The cost in time and resources to build things makes them not worth building if they can be gone in an hour. Capture the totem - capture the surrounding buildings, but they can't be destroyed for a week - to give a chance to win them back.

    Added after 6 minutes:



    I think meaningful (costly) PvP would be worse than pointless PvP. It takes too much to build up things in Xsyon, to risk losing them. Face it, this game is pretty brutal WITHOUT PvP. Losing a house that took me a week to build would be a considerable incentive to quit.

    I have no objection to losing some items on death, but not my needed tools. It's enough that we are fighting the GAME for survival.
    Are you a solo player?
    If you are, this is why it's not a happy time to build houses and things. Tents are fairly easy, but there is a lot of architectural stuff in the game that can make a solo player's eyes bleed. I was going to load my place up with spiked walls, but those take 10 logs per wall (if I remember?). It would look cooler, but I decided to just use the 3 long log walls. For a solo player, if it looks like a huge challenge, it's probably meant for a larger amount of commitment. Work smarter and not harder... ask a friend to help ...trade for mats . This will be much better for the game if it is possible to do this. By possible, I mean encouraged to the point that it's almost needed.

    But I don't have the luxury of having any architecture houses/tents.... Yet.

  6. #166
    It is the construction, crafting, and survival that makes Xsyon special.

    There are plenty of PvP games out there.

    PvP done wrong will drive away the builders and crafters.

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by Azhul_NS View Post

    PvP done wrong will drive away the builders and crafters.

    and?

    Btw, Most avid PvPers are also the crafters and builders and often have much more invested in their games.

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by orious13 View Post
    Are you a solo player?
    If you are, this is why it's not a happy time to build houses and things. Tents are fairly easy, but there is a lot of architectural stuff in the game that can make a solo player's eyes bleed. I was going to load my place up with spiked walls, but those take 10 logs per wall (if I remember?). It would look cooler, but I decided to just use the 3 long log walls. For a solo player, if it looks like a huge challenge, it's probably meant for a larger amount of commitment. Work smarter and not harder... ask a friend to help ...trade for mats . This will be much better for the game if it is possible to do this. By possible, I mean encouraged to the point that it's almost needed.

    But I don't have the luxury of having any architecture houses/tents.... Yet.
    Currently solo, yes. Certainly willing to join a small tribe.

    LOL. Indeed. I built ONE spiked wall. 10 logs (all the SAME type, BTW), and 20 nails. NOT CHEAP at all. Switched to masonry for building, but the nearest sand is a ten minute run away.

    I would prefer more interaction between players, for sure. In addition to PvP, I mean. It appears Xsyon made the same mistake Fallen Earth did in letting everyone craft everything. Human society is based on specialization. People trade with each other because they have different skills. Nations trade with each other because they have different resources.

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by Azhul_NS View Post
    Currently solo, yes. Certainly willing to join a small tribe.

    LOL. Indeed. I built ONE spiked wall. 10 logs (all the SAME type, BTW), and 20 nails. NOT CHEAP at all. Switched to masonry for building, but the nearest sand is a ten minute run away.

    I would prefer more interaction between players, for sure. In addition to PvP, I mean. It appears Xsyon made the same mistake Fallen Earth did in letting everyone craft everything. Human society is based on specialization. People trade with each other because they have different skills. Nations trade with each other because they have different resources.
    If the systems were working correctly it wouldnt be an issue, as skills are supposed to degrade if not used...so while everyone may be able to craft everything, unless you're actually doing it regularly you shouldnt be horribly proficient at it. Skill degradation and/ or a soft cap is necessary.

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Dubanka View Post
    you're partially right, but your dot connecting is off.

    an economy is driven by demand, which is in turn driven by need, which is driven by scarcity and necessity.

    Players have to need something. THen there has to be an inability for them to obtain that which they need.

    PVP is an integral component in creating need.
    Need for armor
    Need for weapons

    Territorial warfare is integral to creating a need for tribal area improvements
    Need for walls
    Need for gates

    crafting is a means to produce goods that fill a need. crafting itself is not a need.
    raw materials --> crafted goods --> goods get destroyed through use --> need for new goods

    Currently there is no need for goods, since they have no real utility.

    SO to bring this back on point:
    Without pvp, a large portion of the crafteable items are merely for vanity.
    Without territorial conflict, a large portion of the crafteable structures and terraformed improvements are merely playing house...they have no purpose.

    Create the utility, you create the need, you create the economy.
    The problem is that PvP can't create a need if th items themselves are useless. Why would you need an armor ? They do nothing. Why would you need a weapon? Your PO weapon is better than anything. You took over a land ? How nice. Why did you do that though ? To gain more absolutely pointless and useless buildings ? They are only for vanity even with PvP.
    This is what I'm saying. With the current system (as in items have no use) PvP wouldn't have any use either, just as crafting has no use. Why would you fight over useless things ? Just because ?

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