Law vs Chaos

[Zenmaster13]

Jail is still a horrible idea. PvP is playing the game. Jail is not. Just because this is a sandbox doesn't mean every crappy idea will get implemented. So no, you'd don't get to put people in jail just because they get to kill you.



This post, with NPC guards, is one of the best ways to handle city security outside of walls/gates. They don't need to be ubertastic, and there doesn't need to be hordes of them. Just enough to discourage 1-2 people from waltzing in and killing people near the tribal totem once safe zones go away. Other than that, if you just want to sit there and weave buckets in peace then make sure you recruit some people who are going to use the armor and weapons you make to your tribe for defense.

PvP is a part of the game. Sieges will be a part of the game at some point as well. Jails are not. Read that a few times until it sinks in.

To the OP: Yes there should be a punishment system in place. It should be severe enough to discourage the type of behaviour that all these Shadowbane rejects seem to live for. However, the SB rejects do not want to be punished, they want a little slap on the wrist, so they can say "there we were punished, now i can grief you more".

According to SB players, no one else in the world knows anything about siege mechanics. It's funny watching these guys come in here and argue. They have a really hard time letting go of that dead game.

It's pointless to try and reason with these people. They only see one way, and that is their own way.

Oh and a big lol to all you idiots who think the game will die if mechanisms are put in place to stop griefing. It is one of the most used arguments here "the game will lose sooo many subs, if you don't allow us to force our will upon the non-fighters". You guys are more worried about people not wanting to play your style, than finding people who do.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

In Starquest the only way to escape jail is to die of starvation, sickness, or lure a guard into your cell and grab his gun. Then you can either try to fight your way off the ship, or just clone yourself. It does work great. It's great for RP. It's great as a deterrent for criminals. It also woudl be great for evil tribes to ransom off players. I know that people complain that jail takes away their time, but so does surrounding a homestead that has no resources, and not allowing the person to leave. Kidnapping Fleet officer is still the most fun I've had in an MMO to this date(Even if the devs let them out as soon as they cry). I've been captured and stayed there for a week till i finally died of starvation. Never complained once. Unfortunately word had gotten around that no matter what I said NEVER go in the cell with me.

[Soulwanderer]

In Starquest the only way to escape jail is to die of starvation, sickness, or lure a guard into your cell and grab his gun. Then you can either try to fight your way off the ship, or just clone yourself. It does work great. It's great for RP. It's great as a deterrent for criminals. It also woudl be great for evil tribes to ransom off players. I know that people complain that jail takes away their time, but so does surrounding a homestead that has no resources, and not allowing the person to leave. Kidnapping Fleet officer is still the most fun I've had in an MMO to this date(Even if the devs let them out as soon as they cry). I've been captured and stayed there for a week till i finally died of starvation. Never complained once. Unfortunately word had gotten around that no matter what I said NEVER go in the cell with me.

That requires player interaction. Many players in fact. If multiple players are camping outside of a safe zone (while those are still around), most likely the person sitting inside has done something to warrant them wasting their time twiddling their thumbs. I don't really buy that this happens with any sort of regularity and it's mostly just a straw man argument so advocates of this will feel that they have ground to stand on, but whatever. In any case, that is player interaction that is not preventing anyone from playing. The homesteader can make a break for it and try to get away. If the people camping his totem follow for a ways and manage to kill him, he just respawns behind them and heads off in a different direction. The camped homestead has choices that they can make on how to deal with the situation i.e. play the game.

Using a ridiculous jail system that just lets you throw a player into it and forget them does not require player interaction. It's a proposed game mechanic preventing a player from playing the game for a set period of time (or for as long as the jailer wants according to maelwydd's earlier posts on this).

Punishment for actions should largely be player driven. You don't like what I do, you don't trade with me or mine. Later, maybe you come tear down my house. Maybe the Devs introduce other game mechanics that will let you invest time to make your displeasure known. In none of that should a player's ability to act within the game be taken away.

As since the first time this was posted, this is a horrible idea.

[Dontaze_Mebro]

It seemed to work better in Face of Mankind. It was mostly a grieving tactic used by the "good guys" in Starquest. Face of mankind your jail time was related to the amount of crimes you'd committed, but you still had to be subdued by the police to be arrested it was never automatic, and there were even jailbreaks by factions or a crooked guard could let you out. Not to mention people who smuggled in weapons to jail made a fortune. So my point is even jail is not preventing you from playing it is simply preventing you from playing how you want which is always the cry of the carebear.

I would like to be able to capture players for the economic gain of ransoming them back to their tribe.

[xyberviri]

Sniped

You know most of this is just something that is just way out there, also you can't attack some one currently on territory so basically your whole post has been thrown out the window.

when they remove the protection zones how ever its going to be a different story.



but anyways most of this reads as a bunch of stuff that comes from a care bear, just join a tribe that can protect you. stop tring to ruin the game for others. This is a FFA Full Loot PVP game. go try UO and see how far you get.

[Soulwanderer]

It seemed to work better in Face of Mankind. It was mostly a grieving tactic used by the "good guys" in Starquest. Face of mankind your jail time was related to the amount of crimes you'd committed, but you still had to be subdued by the police to be arrested it was never automatic, and there were even jailbreaks by factions or a crooked guard could let you out. Not to mention people who smuggled in weapons to jail made a fortune. So my point is even jail is not preventing you from playing it is simply preventing you from playing how you want which is always the cry of the carebear.

Done right, there is possibility that it might not be completely game breaking. I can't say I'm certain of how it was done in those games and how much player interaction was cut out or left in. For the most part though, in a game like this I don't think it would be an addition that would add enough fun to the game to warrant the amount of time that would be needed to first plan out a reasonable system, then code it, then debug it. Especially when the tools to achieve the same results (punishing people who do things you don't like) are already planned for implementation.

[xyberviri]

Oh and a big lol to all you idiots who think the game will die if mechanisms are put in place to stop griefing. It is one of the most used arguments here "the game will lose sooo many subs, if you don't allow us to force our will upon the non-fighters". You guys are more worried about people not wanting to play your style, than finding people who do.

Its not our style its the style of the game, its called natural selection, if you dont want to be a figther join a guild/clan/tribe that can protect you. the lonely hermit is going to be in danger once the protect zones go down. This isn't wow you can't RP your a care bear man up dude. learn to deal with the fact that you going to get hurt and killed and looted some time. the loot rights i read were something like you only loose one item if they attacked you i think.

but seriously grow some, its about time a game had some balls and didn't spoon feed you.

[Sirius]

To the OP: Yes there should be a punishment system in place. It should be severe enough to discourage the type of behaviour that all these Shadowbane rejects seem to live for. However, the SB rejects do not want to be punished, they want a little slap on the wrist, so they can say "there we were punished, now i can grief you more".

According to SB players, no one else in the world knows anything about siege mechanics. It's funny watching these guys come in here and argue. They have a really hard time letting go of that dead game.

It's pointless to try and reason with these people. They only see one way, and that is their own way.

Oh and a big lol to all you idiots who think the game will die if mechanisms are put in place to stop griefing. It is one of the most used arguments here "the game will lose sooo many subs, if you don't allow us to force our will upon the non-fighters". You guys are more worried about people not wanting to play your style, than finding people who do.

On a related note, we're now accepting applications for a new fanboy who's not a raving idiot. Housebroken, vaccinations current, must not froth at mouth upon mere mention of PVP.

[xyberviri]

the OP Jail mechanic is just a excuse for people that want to pvp with out pvping, its also something that will be abused by people who do pvp.

You laws are already in game, you see some one you tell them to leave and if they dont you kill them. your tribe mates are your guards. there are way too many ways to exploit this suggestion.

instead of suggesting ways to impose law on some one else go and enforce it.

to be honest it sounds like some one killed you near your land and now you want some way to punish people with out having to kill them your self.

Imagine if you will i put down a totem on a spawn point and make a jail, then every noob that spawns in is automatically flagged for trespassing and killed/jailed. Watch subscriptions go down.

put a totem down on the only road in the mountains person traveling though crosses into totem range goes to jail, gets exploited kill and teleported.

If you could knock some one out and drag there corpse back to camp and put them in a room you can open close that's one thing. when they add death and some one has to go revive you it will be a chance to setup traps and ambushes.

Anything that does something for you is open to exploit and abuse, and anything that can be abused will be abused, esp in a mmo.

Never played SB btw.

[Jadzia]

Personally I believe that jails will never be implemented in Xsyon, so my opinion about jails is supposed to be meant in general.

I think a jail system if implemented properly could be very fun. Let's say a PKer is caught and players can choose to kill him or send him to jail. The jail could be implemented like this:

The player is teleported to a cell. He has to figure out how to make a shovel (the needed parts are hidden in the cell and he needs to find and craft it). After getting the shovel he has to picklock the lock (should be a puzzle-like thing, something that requires to use his brain). Outside of his cell he needs to kill the guard then he can start to dig himself out by digging a tunnel (getting terraforming exp for that). Through his tunnel he gets into a big tunnel filled with animals/zombies/whatever, he has to fight his way through (getting combat exp). He could loot and cook the animals' meat to get food and to heal himself. He may find valuable stuffs left there by former, less lucky prisoners. If he gets killed he goes back to his cell and starts over, but it should be balanced as in not impossible to get out, with proper preparation and cautiousness he should be able to get out without dieing. At the end of the tunnel he should dig again and find himself beside his own totem.

The big tunnel should be a maze, a place where its easy to get lost or run in circles. Getting out of the jail could take like 2-3-4 ingame days.

A system like this would be much more fun imo than loosing stat/skill points when dieing.