PvP with extreme consequences: Would you enjoy it?

[Salvadore]

Personally, I'd like permadeath, but I can't see it happen.

Many of the PvPers play these games for combat activities alone, when you take that away they will leave. Permadeath is a great RP-tool in that it makes sure that combat takes place in the context of the game, for a cause. But that also means that combat will happen infrequently - and since many people (I'm not one of them) enjoy combat above all they will just leave the game.

What about the hardcore crafter that ventured out and got killed by a bear? No combat there really, but permadeath? Said crafter may have totally avoided pvp in any facet but still is permadead...

I just dont think it could work.

[ifireallymust]

I want permadeath and pvp. I'm all for it. Tear down the safe zones, that's fine with me, but for those who want to kill inside what used to be a safe zone, you should be under threat of permadeath from then on, and unable to trade with or associate with anyone who isn't, so that even if you zerg and torment your neighbors for miles around, you'll always live in some fear, because you'll know that all it takes is one death, and that character is finished.

Oh, and I would play as a tribal area PKer under permadeath.

It would actually be a challenge, instead of the sorry excuse for lame no challenge you PKer zergs have now. I feel sorry for any of you who think the pvp mechanics in any game are challenging or fun. It's all watered down wuss play. You want a real challenge, know that when you screw up, you're starting over from scratch. Every time.

[NexAnima]

What about the hardcore crafter that ventured out and got killed by a bear? No combat there really, but permadeath? Said crafter may have totally avoided pvp in any facet but still is permadead...

I just dont think it could work.

It could be coded so that npcs just knock you out, while players kill you. If it became the norm to have perma-death players would adjust and play carefully, and all these artificial checks and balances would no longer be needed. If we were to ever have another server I would really like to see them test this theory out. The thought of losing all your hard work is scary, but at the same time would change your entire gaming experiance.

[wolfmoonstrike]

I want permadeath and pvp. I'm all for it. Tear down the safe zones, that's fine with me, but for those who want to kill inside what used to be a safe zone, you should be under threat of permadeath from then on, and unable to trade with or associate with anyone who isn't, so that even if you zerg and torment your neighbors for miles around, you'll always live in some fear, because you'll know that all it takes is one death, and that character is finished.

Oh, and I would play as a tribal area PKer under permadeath.

It would actually be a challenge, instead of the sorry excuse for lame no challenge you PKer zergs have now. I feel sorry for any of you who think the pvp mechanics in any game are challenging or fun. It's all watered down wuss play. You want a real challenge, know that when you screw up, you're starting over from scratch. Every time.

I honestly believe if permadeath is to be included we need a watered down perma death and it apply equally to all those killed by players. I'll explain.

Lets say player A dies due to player B, well I think he should have the choice to be reincarnated which will knock down his current skills to half of what they are now (but not below 5 per skill) or wait for a tribe member(or nice guy) to revive him with magic. It keeps things strict and has consequences, but not to the point where you can't earn back what you've lost.

The reason why you should apply equally to all players is so that way crafters will take their defenses more seriously and hire mercenaries to protect them. Believe it or not crafters and those who are peaceful should be punished for being foolish. If you're caught alone w/o protection you deserve to die in a PA world.

[ifireallymust]

I honestly believe if permadeath is to be included we need a watered down perma death and it apply equally to all those killed by players. I'll explain.

Lets say player A dies due to player B, well I think he should have the choice to be reincarnated which will knock down his current skills to half of what they are now (but not below 5 per skill) or wait for a tribe member(or nice guy) to revive him with magic. It keeps things strict and has consequences, but not to the point where you can't earn back what you've lost.

The reason why you should apply equally to all players is so that way crafters will take their defenses more seriously and hire mercenaries to protect them. Believe it or not crafters and those who are peaceful should be punished for being foolish. If you're caught alone w/o protection you deserve to die in a PA world.

Nope. This is just more ways for a zerg to bully smaller groups and solo players and force them to move where they are told to move and do what they are told to do. It can't be watered down, and no, it can't apply equally. It has to be only a consequence for PKers, in this case, only a certain type of PKer, otherwise, it's just more food for the disgusting, lame, and wussy zergs that are no challenge to create, no fun to play, and can not be combatted effectively.

[wolfmoonstrike]

Nope. This is just more ways for a zerg to bully smaller groups and solo players and force them to move where they are told to move and do what they are told to do. It can't be watered down, and no, it can't apply equally. It has to be only a consequence for PKers, in this case, only a certain type of PKer, otherwise, it's just more food for the disgusting, lame, and wussy zergs that are no challenge to create, no fun to play, and can not be combatted effectively.

So the foolish should be rewarded for their foolishness? If you're caught alone or solo it's your fault. If you were caught from behind its your fault. Risk should apply to everybody or you don't feel danger. I know Fire that you're huge soloer/ homesteader type but you also need to remember that this is a PA world and if you want to be protected you need either be more alert, be a hermit, or make loads of friends. The alone and the weak get crushed by the powerful in a barbaric world, its not fair and it sucks but its the path you wish to choose.

Btw I'm against zergs as well but if they are truly naked/weak/ inferior just massive in numbers then you can either run away with your massive and more experienced running skill or stand and fight and more likely win. I do not believe 10 newly ressurrected, naked characters should be able to take on a fully armored, experienced character and come close to winning.

Now if you got a lot of superior troops killing everybody they're not zergs.....

P.S. I got called you Fire because for the first few days of reading your name my mind split your name "I fire ally must" (didn't make much sense but I found it interesting) only recently did I put the spaces in the right place.

[ifireallymust]

So the foolish should be rewarded for their foolishness? If you're caught alone or solo it's your fault. If you were caught from behind its your fault. Risk should apply to everybody or you don't feel danger. I know Fire that you're huge soloer/ homesteader type but you also need to remember that this is a PA world and if you want to be protected you need either be more alert, be a hermit, or make loads of friends. The alone and the weak get crushed by the powerful in a barbaric world, its not fair and it sucks but its the path you wish to choose.

Btw I'm against zergs as well but if they are truly naked/weak/ inferior just massive in numbers then you can either run away with your massive and more experienced running skill or stand and fight and more likely win. I do not believe 10 newly ressurrected, naked characters should be able to take on a fully armored, experienced character and come close to winning.

Now if you got a lot of superior troops killing everybody they're not zergs.....

P.S. I got called you Fire because for the first few days of reading your name my mind split your name "I fire ally must" (didn't make much sense but I found it interesting) only recently did I put the spaces in the right place.

Whatever, don't care anymore. This change is all for the fraternity and soriety crowd who wouldn't know an original thought, much less the true meaning of the word 'freedom' if it bit them on the big toe. You guys got everything you wanted. So be it. I'll kill you every chance I get, every where I find you, every day. If a solo player can only be a PKer to survive, then I guess that's what I'll be.

But I have nothing but contempt for any of you, just so you know. Your play style is easy mode and pathetic. You risk nothing, not even in the game. It's all about numbers, and blame 'reality' for that, in a game. A large minority of this player base soloes, and the majority doesn't want to be in a tribe, they'll be homesteader groups, and now groups called clans. That majority is being forced to choose between quitting or killing to get what we need, since tribes will hog all the resources and push us around and bully us so that we get nothing.

Well, those of us with backbones will stay and make you pay for it. I aim to be one of them.

[pendergraft]

Battles need to be decisive. If you die in a battle, you should not be able to rejoin it. There's nothing worse than killing one player in a battle only to have him show up again a minute later. You've just been taken out of the fight; your character should be temporarily crippled, not heading off once more into the fray. This gives you incentive not to be completely reckless, but without being paralyzed by fear of losing your character.

[wolfmoonstrike]

Whatever, don't care anymore. This change is all for the fraternity and soriety crowd who wouldn't know an original thought, much less the true meaning of the word 'freedom' if it bit them on the big toe. You guys got everything you wanted. So be it. I'll kill you every chance I get, every where I find you, every day. If a solo player can only be a PKer to survive, then I guess that's what I'll be.

But I have nothing but contempt for any of you, just so you know. Your play style is easy mode and pathetic. You risk nothing, not even in the game. It's all about numbers, and blame 'reality' for that, in a game. A large minority of this player base soloes, and the majority doesn't want to be in a tribe, they'll be homesteader groups, and now groups called clans. That majority is being forced to choose between quitting or killing to get what we need, since tribes will hog all the resources and push us around and bully us so that we get nothing.

Well, those of us with backbones will stay and make you pay for it. I aim to be one of them.

Good I'm glad. Many heroes in comic books/legends and even reality (possibly tempered with a story being retold a lot lol) Started this way fighting for what they feel is right. If you honestly believe that I'm trying to take the easy way out, I'm not. I believe in paying for your actions and inactions. Fight the tribes and become a hero in name, others will join your cause. Just because you ally with someone doesn't mean you lose your independence and freedom.

Btw I love difficult games and would very much like to have permadeath or a harsh cost for death against a player but permadeath just isn't viable unless done from the beginning for an mmo. So I was offering a compromise so we could see some harsher penalties for death. I just believe foolishness should be punished just as much as actively fighting. My idea stemmed from demon souls (with alterations) if you get the chance play the game. Their are appropriate punishments for foolishness and being evil as well as proper rewards.

[pendergraft]

So the foolish should be rewarded for their foolishness? If you're caught alone or solo it's your fault. If you were caught from behind its your fault.

Yes, blame the victim. I suppose rape victims had it coming, eh? EH?