why dont we start with great skills stats?

[FabricSoftener]

I think you misread the intention of my post friend

It was meant to start a different agnled discussion over the whole who starts with what conversation.
But in anser to your question....no i would prefer if we all started at skill level 1 in every skill, even totem making i prefer to do things the difficult way to be honest. i hate anything in games that makes mechainics easier...like headstarts for tribes!

Hey heres an idea!
Let tribes have thier headstarts to get thier favoured patch of land, but give the solo player immunity to pvp untill they are allowed to plant thier totems...that way they are not left vulnerable to losing everything before they have chance to start!

Had anyone thought of the fact that by not allowing homesteaders to plant at the start...they are also left very vulnerable to lose everything they own, as they have no place to set up home.

homestead aside for a moment it is true that you could lose all your tools and within an hour of game play find yourself requiring the assistance of others. Having said that, that can happen as a member of a large tribe too.

But even with that point aside the more important point I want to make is that its not realistically possible to create a game that allows solo players to do everything while at the same time having a system that is interdependent, regardless of what the developer might have stated or thinks.

The two forumlas are in direct opposition from each other and creating a balance between the advantages of group play with solo play is never an easy task.

Now, with that said, you do understand that homesteads actually provide a stronger advantage per person then tribes do, correct? Or have you thought that part thru?

[shukes]

homestead aside for a moment it is true that you could lose all your tools and within an hour of game play find yourself requiring the assistance of others. Having said that, that can happen as a member of a large tribe too.

But even with that point aside the more important point I want to make is that its not realistically possible to create a game that allows solo players to do everything while at the same time having a system that is interdependent, regardless of what the developer might have stated or thinks.

The two forumlas are in direct opposition from each other and creating a balance between the advantages of group play with solo play is never an easy task.

Now, with that said, you do understand that homesteads actually provide a stronger advantage per person then tribes do, correct? Or have you thought that part thru?

I have thought about a lot to be fair, but thats not to say i am not missing some important point! The only advantage i can see is that it is easier for them to find a patch to lay down thier totem. Where as for us players in a tribe we need to find a much larger pitch. But on the swing of things as a tribe member, once we have a patch our general gameplay becomes much easier......and thats our choice! as it is the homesteaders choice to take the harder solo route. So each has a advantage and a disadvantage.

As for your comments about setting up two seperate systems for each style.....i didnt think that one through did i haha! your 100% correct. i kind of popped that in as i was writing the post without thinking

[FabricSoftener]

I have thought about a lot to be fair, but thats not to say i am not missing some important point! The only advantage i can see is that it is easier for them to find a patch to lay down thier totem. Where as for us players in a tribe we need to find a much larger pitch. But on the swing of things as a tribe member, once we have a patch our general gameplay becomes much easier......and thats our choice! as it is the homesteaders choice to take the harder solo route. So each has a advantage and a disadvantage.

As for your comments about setting up two seperate systems for each style.....i didnt think that one through did i haha! your 100% correct. i kind of popped that in as i was writing the post without thinking

1. I didnt say we should set up two systems. I said the two systems are in direct opposition to each other and balancing is always going to be hard.

2. homestead provide more advantage than a full tribe totem per person in more than one way

[shukes]

1. I didnt say we should set up two systems. I said the two systems are in direct opposition to each other and balancing is always going to be hard.

2. homestead provide more advantage than a full tribe totem per person in more than one way

Sorry friend i meant i agreed with everything you said about having two different systems. It was me who didnt think that through.

2 How does a homestead provide more advantages? most threads just turn into a slanging match once they are about to shed light and trail of the important info.

[FabricSoftener]

Sorry friend i meant i agreed with everything you said about having two different systems. It was me who didnt think that through.

2 How does a homestead provide more advantages? most threads just turn into a slanging match once they are about to shed light and trail of the important info.

You have more land per person.
You have more flexiablity per person (because you dont have to go thru tribe approvals to build things like tents)
You are much more mobile to go from junk pile to junk pile both in when you want to move and how you move (these large tribes will be stuck in the location they select).

when you think about it if you want to be a strong pvp clan its painfully clear to me that the best approach is to have all your clan members have homesteads. You gain more overall land mass that way, you are much more mobile so you can travel from junk pile to junk pile and all your members have creative reign over their own land. It is the power player way to go

[shukes]

You have more land per person.
You have more flexiablity per person (because you dont have to go thru tribe approvals to build things like tents)
You are much more mobile to go from junk pile to junk pile both in when you want to move and how you move (these large tribes will be stuck in the location they select).

when you think about it if you want to be a strong pvp clan its painfully clear to me that the best approach is to have all your clan members have homesteads. You gain more overall land mass that way, you are much more mobile so you can travel from junk pile to junk pile and all your members have creative reign over their own land. It is the power player way to go

1; you may have more land per person, but you also only have your own resources to build with, so that land is mainly obsolete.

2; your assuming a tribe has strict regs...mine for instance gives free reign to do whatever you want. Thats simply the persons own choice for getting into a limiting tribe!

3; your not likely to have a junkpile in your safe area and are just as vulnerable as any other player when travelling to one out of your zone....being in a tribe or homestead makes no difference to this mechainic. Yes you are more mobile in moving your totem...but why would a tribe want to once they have set up?

and i am yet to find a land mass open enough to fit more than 4 homesteads that a tribe cant settle in. so if there is land untaken that is big enough for seperate homesteads to be set up close by...then there is already a tribe there.

I'm not saying i'm right or your wrong friend this is just my understanding of how it works and what i have experienced so far.

[FabricSoftener]

1; you may have more land per person, but you also only have your own resources to build with, so that land is mainly obsolete.

2; your assuming a tribe has strict regs...mine for instance gives free reign to do whatever you want. Thats simply the persons own choice for getting into a limiting tribe!

3; your not likely to have a junkpile in your safe area and are just as vulnerable as any other player when travelling to one out of your zone....being in a tribe or homestead makes no difference to this mechainic. Yes you are more mobile in moving your totem...but why would a tribe want to once they have set up?

and i am yet to find a land mass open enough to fit more than 4 homesteads that a tribe cant settle in. so if there is land untaken that is big enough for seperate homesteads to be set up close by...then there is already a tribe there.

I'm not saying i'm right or your wrong friend this is just my understanding of how it works and what i have experienced so far.

1. it takes the same amount of cloth to build a tent regardless of if you own a small part of land or the entire server. As it stands right now tents are just fluff anyway so its not like 'oh my god I need to build a tent for each homestead or I will lose the game!'

2. if your tribe doesnt have some level of rules on what structures can be built once the game goes live in short your little town is going to end up like a crack heads nightmare.

3. organizing the move of a medium to large clan is a nightmare compared to moving or leaving your 4 bins filled with cloth scraps you used to level up tailoring whenever you personally feel like it.

never the less, if you think the power gamers way to go for a clan is not to have homesteads all over the place then I suppose you have the right to that view point. I on the other hand....

[mindtrigger]

I apologise for baiting here...but that was the answer i was waiting for.

So really at release every person who plays the game should be alone! they cant have a selective memory can they? you know the ones that forget all thier skills etc, but somehow seem to remember that they have nine other members of a tribe with them and also remember where thier home town is, so have a divine right to it.

Sorry for starting yet another tribe v homesteader thread up lol, just wanted to know what people thought of the argument when they considered the lore of the game.

To me the lore of the game is important and not just an afterthought. The lore of the game is the origonal vision of the game.

Think of it this way:

You are a teen or fairly young adult. Your parents, or whoever raised you simply "survived" and kept your ass alive. They were not concerned with rebuilding society, they were concerned exclusively with food, shelter and protection. Most skills from the old world were no longer relevant in this situation, and so they were not practiced or passed on to you. Even if they had some relevant skills, there were usually no tools and very few resources available to facilitate their use.

Small groups of people began banding together and forming Tribes, for strength lies in numbers. Tribes happened across other Tribes, some friendly, some not and it has become necessary for people to establish some sort of order to keep the criminal tribes, the ones who are willing to take away your basic human rights to serve their own purpose, in check.

Having established some semblance of tenuous order, at least on their Tribal lands, it is now time for your generation to rebuild the human race. You know how to survive through hunting and foraging, but now you are going beyond survival and seeking advancement and evolution. Leaders and laws of the land will emerge, as well as those who will ignore both. Society will slowly begin rebuilding, and it will feel a lot like the wild west for decades to come. We are all starting over. Let’s hope we do a better job this time.

[mrcalhou]

I apologise for baiting here...but that was the answer i was waiting for.

So really at release every person who plays the game should be alone! they cant have a selective memory can they? you know the ones that forget all thier skills etc, but somehow seem to remember that they have nine other members of a tribe with them and also remember where thier home town is, so have a divine right to it.

Sorry for starting yet another tribe v homesteader thread up lol, just wanted to know what people thought of the argument when they considered the lore of the game.

To me the lore of the game is important and not just an afterthought. The lore of the game is the origonal vision of the game.

You could go watch the show Jeremiah to see how people can form communities while not knowing much after an apocalypse.

[mindtrigger]

Having made the above post, I'll ask you to think about this as well. In your own neighborhood, how many people do you think you could instantly transport into the wilderness, and they would survive? How many people who live on your street have skills that transfer into a survival and bushcraft scenario? In modern Western society, you probably mostly have people who work in offices or other non-industrial jobs. You will have a construction worker or two, maybe someone who can plant a garden, perhaps an auto mechanic or hobbyist, and maybe even an authority figure like a police officer.

Point being, most of the skills we use here in the west are useless in the woods. The percentage of people who would have transferable skills, along with the will to survive in such a scenario would be tiny at best. If you happen to be one of those people lucky enough to survive and you banded together with a group, you would have a seriously random group of people who's most likely reason for survival was not their skill set, but their mindset. Psychology is king in survival situations.