Questions for the players

[Vandal]

1) Normal resources, including scavenged resources, are distributed by areas. This will make even some common scavenged resources scarce in some areas.

I vote yes. How are you going to do that for trees?

2) Rare resources will be distributed by area as welll.

I vote yes.

3) The frequency of rare resources will be higher on undeveloped land and land claimed by expansion totems. I could even set it up so that once scrap pile is claimed by a town totem, it will no longer yield rare resources at all.

I vote yes, specially for the scrap pile totem part.

[Jadzia]

Enforcer Dezgard!

We shouldn't be able to place safe totems on rare resources, but safe totems should be possible to be placed in the new land, not close to these resources. With this system there is the possibility to fight over valuable stuffs, still the new land won't be empty. If Xsyon didn't allow players to place safe totems in the new land who would go there ? Established tribes won't, since they put a lot of time in to build up their base. New players won't, because they won't get any safety till they build some defense. Since there are no gates, they can't even build it. With your system the new lands would be deserted for no reason, only because of the fact that YOU personally hate safe totems.
Safe totems have always been promised for the time while the built safety structures are not in game. They are still not here.

Players should be able to place safe totems in the new area but not close to rare resources, and they should be able to place expansion totems (when they get in game) on rare resources. There should be a distance where a safe totem can't be placed nearby a rare resource hub (like we have with tribe totems now, we get the message that a totem can't be placed since there is a tribe nearby). This way players can settle in the new zones and fight over the resources till expansion totems get in game, and after that they can fight over expansion totems.

Reading this discussion gives me an idea regarding resources that would be fairly easy to implement.

1) Normal resources, including scavenged resources, are distributed by areas. This will make even some common scavenged resources scarce in some areas.

This is already implemented for plants and fish and somewhat for creatures who should be defining their own areas by avoiding or chasing off other creatures and selecting home locations.

2) Rare resources will be distributed by area as welll.

3) The frequency of rare resources will be higher on undeveloped land and land claimed by expansion totems. I could even set it up so that once scrap pile is claimed by a town totem, it will no longer yield rare resources at all.

I think this will give more incentive and meaning for players to trade and create quests (which I plan to improve as well, by adding XP gain and additional quest variables).

Any opinions on this?

#1 and #2 is a good system if there is some way to transfer goods faster and and with bigger amount than we have now. If we have to run 2-3 hours (or even much more since the player is overweighted by goods) to trade regional resources that won't encourage players to trade. With the new 50 zones opening up the land will be huge....right now it takes like 1 hour to run from north to south. This will be like 2-3 hours from the new lands. We need some form of fast travel...

3. If every normal scrap pile gives rare resources in the new lands then its a good idea that town totems reduce the yielding rate of it. If the town totem is lifted then the rare resources should appear again in the normal yield rate, this would make exploiting harder ( as in dropping a town totem on scrap piles to destroy the rare resources).
If there are dedicated rare resource hubs ( like 3-4 in a zone) then we shouldn't be able to place a town totem on it at all. Players would just drop a totem on it to destroy the resource.

Plus I suggest to increase the time when a town totem can be dropped again. Right now its 6 hours, and there is no reason for that, its only good for exploiting. Every players' first totem should be freely moveable for 2 days ( to help them settle down) but after that we should only be able to drop totems in like every 2 weeks. So if I placed a town totem, I'd have to wait 2 weeks to be able to place it in another place. When placing a totem its should work like when placing a building, a ghost totem which I can move around and a green circle showing the area border, and the totem is only dropped when the proper place is found.

[MrDDT]

Enforcer Dezgard!

We shouldn't be able to place safe totems on rare resources, but safe totems should be possible to be placed in the new land, not close to these resources. With this system there is the possibility to fight over valuable stuffs, still the new land won't be empty. If Xsyon didn't allow players to place safe totems in the new land who would go there ? Established tribes won't, since they put a lot of time in to build up their base. New players won't, because they won't get any safety till they build some defense. Since there are no gates, they can't even build it. With your system the new lands would be deserted for no reason, only because of the fact that YOU personally hate safe totems.
Safe totems have always been promised for the time while the built safety structures are not in game. They are still not here.

Players should be able to place safe totems in the new area but not close to rare resources, and they should be able to place expansion totems (when they get in game) on rare resources. There should be a distance where a safe totem can't be placed nearby a rare resource hub (like we have with tribe totems now, we get the message that a totem can't be placed since there is a tribe nearby). This way players can settle in the new zones and fight over the resources till expansion totems get in game, and after that they can fight over expansion totems.



#1 and #2 is a good system if there is some way to transfer goods faster and and with bigger amount than we have now. If we have to run 2-3 hours (or even much more since the player is overweighted by goods) to trade regional resources that won't encourage players to trade. With the new 50 zones opening up the land will be huge....right now it takes like 1 hour to run from north to south. This will be like 2-3 hours from the new lands. We need some form of fast travel...

3. If every normal scrap pile gives rare resources in the new lands then its a good idea that town totems reduce the yielding rate of it. If the town totem is lifted then the rare resources should appear again in the normal yield rate, this would make exploiting harder ( as in dropping a town totem on scrap piles to destroy the rare resources).
If there are dedicated rare resource hubs ( like 3-4 in a zone) then we shouldn't be able to place a town totem on it at all. Players would just drop a totem on it to destroy the resource.

Plus I suggest to increase the time when a town totem can be dropped again. Right now its 6 hours, and there is no reason for that, its only good for exploiting. Every players' first totem should be freely moveable for 2 days ( to help them settle down) but after that we should only be able to drop totems in like every 2 weeks. So if I placed a town totem, I'd have to wait 2 weeks to be able to place it in another place. When placing a totem its should work like when placing a building, a ghost totem which I can move around and a green circle showing the area border, and the totem is only dropped when the proper place is found.

Enforcer Dezgard!

#1,#2 we agree on.
#3 I dont see why you would want to reduce nor the reasoning why it would reduce the rare resources. This is only a problem if you allow safe totem areas. Which 0 should be near rare resources at all. Rare resources could be random how they grow, also why would someone drop a totem only to destroy the rare resource? That makes no sense. They would harvest the resource. If the resource can be destroyed then there are more problems with the system than that. Heck I can destroy resources right now without dropping a totem.


I agree on the totem dropping issue. 6 hours is very short, its easy to exploit. I also think they should remove the safety to it. Meaning it should have a timer based on when you removed your last totem, not when you dropped it. So 2 timers.
1)Based on when you dropped it you must wait 2 weeks (I think 1 week is better avg)
2)You cant redrop a totem for like 1 hour after you pick up your old totem.

Reason for #2 is because this shouldnt be something you really want to do. So you would be risking your stuff. 1 hour isnt all that long, but if you are in the middle of a battle it can be a long time, which is how this can be used for exploiting the system.

Love the idea with the green/ghost radius.

[Jadzia]

Enforcer Dezgard!

From Jordi's post its clear he will allow safe totems on the new land. That's why he mentioned #3.
Players would destroy rare resource hubs to make them even more rare. I know a player who do that regularly...don't you ?

I don't agree with waiting 1 hour to drop a new totem after you lifted your previous one. There is no risk in it, people would just stand around naked for an hour, their containers are safe anyway on the ground, they would log out and log back in after an hour. Its only waste of time.

[Trenchfoot]

The end game (figuratively) for the conquest of rare resources should be in the conquest of your competition for said resource. Conquest of the rare resource itself should simply be the first step, not a treadmill.

Imagine two cities fighting over a rare resource that could never eliminate one another from the fight. You might as well make 'zones', because that's what this is anyway if you can't attack your competition for a rare resource directly. It's a player created pvp zone where no one is allowed to 'win'.

And by win I mean 'pacify' by:

a. keeping your competition so busy rebuilding/re-equipping at their home, that they don't have time to contest the resource anymore.
b. literally driving their totem so far away from the resource that it's no longer practical for them to contest it.
c. capture their totem and ransom it back in a treaty.

In these ways a tribe can firmly establish that a rare resource belongs to them, and thereby enter into a 'victory'. If they can't, then I see rare resources being nothing more than 'the pvp arena', where the benefit of winning is more of the same.

[Dubanka]

Reading this discussion gives me an idea regarding resources that would be fairly easy to implement.

1) Normal resources, including scavenged resources, are distributed by areas. This will make even some common scavenged resources scarce in some areas.

This is already implemented for plants and fish and somewhat for creatures who should be defining their own areas by avoiding or chasing off other creatures and selecting home locations.

2) Rare resources will be distributed by area as welll.

3) The frequency of rare resources will be higher on undeveloped land and land claimed by expansion totems. I could even set it up so that once scrap pile is claimed by a town totem, it will no longer yield rare resources at all.

I think this will give more incentive and meaning for players to trade and create quests (which I plan to improve as well, by adding XP gain and additional quest variables).

Any opinions on this?

I'd like to respond to this and not the jad vs. ddt show

1. Great.

2. What kind of 'rare' resources...ie. if you only made chalk availble in the north, the folks in the south wouldnt be able to tailor. If you are going to introduce more rare resources to populate new patterns/recipes, great...just be careful about how it's implemented.

3. It would be nice to have static spawns of 'rare resources'...not just the randomly occuring model (like chalk, flint, etc)....like harvesting granite/limestone. Its rare because of its limited locations, not because of some timer. To keep from being overharvested it needs to have a 'respawn' timer on it...10 per hour, or whatever. Again, you do it this way because it pulls people to that spot...it creates a conflict node.

3b. The scrap pile thing, while great in concept is also horribly abuseable.

To go way back to the original point of the post...the content i want to see is that which drives a reason for doing this.
- I want a reason to craft different items...i want them to do different things, have different strengths, weaknesses, benefits.
- I want a reason to fortify a town
- I want a reason to patrol an area to keep interlopers out
- I want to have to trade with other people to get things that I don't have the abilty to make.
- etc. etc. etc.

[dezgard]

Re-opened & re-enforced by your local enforcer Dezgard!

Keep it on topic please.

[VeryWiiTee]

I vote yes. How are you going to do that for trees?



I vote yes.



I vote yes, specially for the scrap pile totem part.

I vote yes to @ll those things too. (Some of my keys died yesterd@y hench the signs :P)

[MrDDT]

Thanks Dez, and sorry Xsyon and Jadzia.

Another thing about rare resources is that making them useful is needed. Why would I care if metal buckles are rare or not in the north? vs the south? So I wouldnt have a few items that take them. Not a big deal.

I like the idea that some ideas will be swappable with others of the same family to yield different results for bonuses and stuff. Also can we see the bonuses? Right now I wear tribal colors and I have no idea how its effecting me if any at all. Yet you say its in game. I dont need it saying "You gained .01 crafting success" but a message saying that I didnt fail because of tribal colors would be nice, or maybe when I put the tribal colors on it says something like "You feel more focused while wearing these colors" or something like that.


Also these resources being rare in the north vs south or east vs west etc. but without a transport system it will be very upsetting. Plus another problem is how training a craft is done. So you make metal buckles hard north vs south, but for me to train up leather crafting I dont need metal buckles so I will only need maybe like 20 of them to make a set of armor here or there. Its not really going to be traded all that much.
Giving rewards to people crafting higher level type stuff will help here causing people to train using more resources and harder to get ones. (Balance in the recipes need to be done too based on the mats used in them).
Take tool crafting. I can make a scrappers lasher 10000 times, and I will be 100 in tool crafting.
Or bone crafting, I can make 10000 bone stakes and I will be 100 in bone crafting. Without ever making a single piece of bone armor. So making deer rare in the north wouldnt effect me at all, because I would never craft something with deer bones being needed unless its 1 or 2 items for armor set I wanted to use.

[Liquidblade]

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