Global Currency or Item for Item Barter?

[Jadzia]

Right, but other things like pack animals or something like that were planned.

I think tribes will trade for items once they start finding out that not all resources are near them that they want. Resource control also will come into place.

Also according to your thing, I wouldnt know other tribes even with a gold type system. Because my tribe will have everything. Incentive to meet others is how resources are going to be, not if there is a lightweight money or not. With or without a lightweight money resources being limited is the key.

Now if you have limited resources, I would want trade/barter vs a light weight money system and a gold drain in game. (must have a gold drain in game or light weight money will be worthless, as said before).

I didn't mean resource trading at all. It will be a nightmare anyway, no matter what, because of our limited carrying capacity.

What I meant was trading items. Jordi said that we will be limited of how many recipes we can learn. So high level cratfmen will have different recipes. Let's say I want a weapon that the blacksmith of my tribe can't make. Or a pretty dress, since I'm a woman I'm willing to travel for hours to get it I want to be able to run around and to pay for it when I find it. I don't want to pay with resources because it would be impossible to carry a big amount of resource there. Since the item is for me only, to fill my vanity, I won't ask my tribemates to run for hours to help me pay for it. If the price is another rare item I most likely won't have it so can't pay again.

That's why I said barter trading would kill the economy, not the resource trading, but the crafted item trading. The most fun of being a crafter is selling the crafted items to others....otherwise whats the point of it. You craft everything what your tribe needs then you can retire

The problem is that buying items from a crafter who lives far will be kind of impossible. That is stupid in a game which has heavy crafting and hundreds of different items.

I don't insist to have money. Give me any other solution which makes item trading possible and reasonably easy and I'll be happy with it.

[mrcalhou]

The thing that I don't like about an item-for-item trading system is that it's a pain in the fracking arse to make it possible to trade things when one party is offline. Sure, you can set up a "quest" where you are looking for xX, yY, and zZ but if you don't have everything just right, then no deal. A credit/money/gold/etc. system allows people to already know what one of the trade items would be since it would be programmed to be the "item" that is used by the tradee for the transaction. It's also not like adding this type of system makes it impossible for people to trade item-for-item. Every MMO that I've played, even Entropia Universe, where devs made money through taxing the ingame currency that people buy with real money, allowed for an item-for-item trade system in addition to the auction houses and player-run stores.

Please don't take this mean that I'm in favor of global storage and global buying/selling, because far from it. There needs to be regional trade and resources should be limited to certain areas. It'd be extremely foolish not to do that.

This really is beating a dead horse though, because we just keep saying the same shit over and over. And Xsyon already said that they are adding NPCs to trade with, thus giving us a currency sink/generator.

[MrDDT]

I didn't mean resource trading at all. It will be a nightmare anyway, no matter what, because of our limited carrying capacity.

What I meant was trading items. Jordi said that we will be limited of how many recipes we can learn. So high level cratfmen will have different recipes. Let's say I want a weapon that the blacksmith of my tribe can't make. Or a pretty dress, since I'm a woman I'm willing to travel for hours to get it I want to be able to run around and to pay for it when I find it. I don't want to pay with resources because it would be impossible to carry a big amount of resource there. Since the item is for me only, to fill my vanity, I won't ask my tribemates to run for hours to help me pay for it. If the price is another rare item I most likely won't have it so can't pay again.

That's why I said barter trading would kill the economy, not the resource trading, but the crafted item trading. The most fun of being a crafter is selling the crafted items to others....otherwise whats the point of it. You craft everything what your tribe needs then you can retire

The problem is that buying items from a crafter who lives far will be kind of impossible. That is stupid in a game which has heavy crafting and hundreds of different items.

I don't insist to have money. Give me any other solution which makes item trading possible and reasonably easy and I'll be happy with it.

Doesnt matter what you are looking for its going to be a resource or a finished product.
If you have need for items another tribe has they should have a need for something your tribe has or your tribe is going to die.
No tribe should have everything due to resources need to be limited.

If they can make dresses because they are near silk, and your tribe cant because you DONT have the resource (silk) then you should have a resource they dont have like say iron. Now you can make swords while they cant make dresses. So you bring swords, they bring dresses and POOF you are trading.

If they DONT have any resources that anyone else needs they will need to figure out another way to live, maybe they are in a good spot to raid, or in the middle of everyone so they are good trades for the middle ground.

But if Tribe A has everything, and Tribe B has everything. Then what would it matter WHAT type of game monies are there light or heavy if no one would need to trade?

[MrDDT]

Please don't take this mean that I'm in favor of global storage and global buying/selling, because far from it. There needs to be regional trade and resources should be limited to certain areas. It'd be extremely foolish not to do that.

This really is beating a dead horse though, because we just keep saying the same shit over and over. And Xsyon already said that they are adding NPCs to trade with, thus giving us a currency sink/generator.

Trading to NPCs isnt the samething as a sink for money.

Also markets will be set up for people to bring goods and barter/trade their goods with others. You could trade me leathers, for my bones, and guess what I might need leathers BUT I know I could get a good deal from Sammy over here because he wants leathers and has gems which is what I want.

[Tybalt]

Doesnt matter what you are looking for its going to be a resource or a finished product.
If you have need for items another tribe has they should have a need for something your tribe has or your tribe is going to die.
No tribe should have everything due to resources need to be limited.

If they can make dresses because they are near silk, and your tribe cant because you DONT have the resource (silk) then you should have a resource they dont have like say iron. Now you can make swords while they cant make dresses. So you bring swords, they bring dresses and POOF you are trading.

If they DONT have any resources that anyone else needs they will need to figure out another way to live, maybe they are in a good spot to raid, or in the middle of everyone so they are good trades for the middle ground.

But if Tribe A has everything, and Tribe B has everything. Then what would it matter WHAT type of game monies are there light or heavy if no one would need to trade?

Trading to NPCs isnt the samething as a sink for money.

Also markets will be set up for people to bring goods and barter/trade their goods with others. You could trade me leathers, for my bones, and guess what I might need leathers BUT I know I could get a good deal from Sammy over here because he wants leathers and has gems which is what I want.

Great Points there MrDDT. Without Regional resources, there is no real need for trade in the first place. And also a good point on the way a trade route is established. =)

[mrcalhou]

Trading to NPCs isnt the samething as a sink for money.

If it's designed in a way that it takes money out of the game, then it's a sink. Personally, I'd love to see all sorts of money sinks added to the game that have different functions.

[MrDDT]

If it's designed in a way that it takes money out of the game, then it's a sink. Personally, I'd love to see all sorts of money sinks added to the game that have different functions.

I would rather not see any "MONEY" sinks because I dont want money.

Sinks Im looking at is decay and degrade. So you use a bat 100 times on a mob, it should break.

[Jadzia]

Doesnt matter what you are looking for its going to be a resource or a finished product.
If you have need for items another tribe has they should have a need for something your tribe has or your tribe is going to die.
No tribe should have everything due to resources need to be limited.

If they can make dresses because they are near silk, and your tribe cant because you DONT have the resource (silk) then you should have a resource they dont have like say iron. Now you can make swords while they cant make dresses. So you bring swords, they bring dresses and POOF you are trading.

If they DONT have any resources that anyone else needs they will need to figure out another way to live, maybe they are in a good spot to raid, or in the middle of everyone so they are good trades for the middle ground.

Do you really not understand my post, or you simply don't read it ? What I'm trying to say is that me buying a dress is not a tribe issue in any way. Its between me and the seller. And I can't craft it not because of lack of resources but because of lack of recipes. When I want to buy an item for myself, I don't want to ask favours from my tribe. I personally want that item, and I personally want to be able to buy it without any help. And what I pay for it will be the personal property of the seller, not his tribe's.

But if Tribe A has everything, and Tribe B has everything. Then what would it matter WHAT type of game monies are there light or heavy if no one would need to trade?

They do need to trade because of the different craft recipes they have. But they can't.

[mrcalhou]

I would rather not see any "MONEY" sinks because I dont want money.

Sinks Im looking at is decay and degrade. So you use a bat 100 times on a mob, it should break.

Well, I kinda wrote stuff to that affect multiple times in this thread, except I'd much rather have a currency, in addition to what you want, to make tradeing more streamlined.

We are not going to come to an agreement on whether or not there should be a programmed currency system in the game, because you don't want it and I don't want just an item-for-item trade system. I think that what you want, as the sole means of trade, is too cumbersome. Does it work? Of course. But I still don't see why players can't have more options in how they wish to trade.

[MrDDT]

Do you really not understand my post, or you simply don't read it ? What I'm trying to say is that me buying a dress is not a tribe issue in any way. Its between me and the seller. And I can't craft it not because of lack of resources but because of lack of recipes. When I want to buy an item for myself, I don't want to ask favours from my tribe. I personally want that item, and I personally want to be able to buy it without any help. And what I pay for it will be the personal property of the seller, not his tribe's.


They do need to trade because of the different craft recipes they have. But they can't.

Well cant you give your tribe items (sell) for the swords you would need to trade for a dress? Maybe Im missing your point. Sounds like a crappy tribe if you have to do something like that, but hey thats just me.

Tribe A cant have all the crafts? You think only 1 person is going to craft something in the whole tribe? Im pretty sure that if they get someone that is capped out on what they can learn they would start having others learn it.

Again still, having money or barter in the game isnt going to change the need to trade, only limited resources would.

See why not just have vaults in the game? Or better yet a mail system too? Thats easy right?

If you want "easy" you are looking at the wrong game, its meant to be fun. If you have a mail system it would fix your problem wouldnt it? So lets just have mail boxes that can export items all around the world. Haha why? Because it would break the econ system of what you have now. Limited resources and trading.

If you cant pay someone for your dress because x items they want are too heavy, well tell you what, you sound like you need to pay someone to export it for you. Now you have a great working economy. Sounds like real shipping in the world now. I have items I want (car) that I want from Europe, but if I buy it from there, Im going to have to pay shipping costs because for me to buy a boat and move it over here myself would be very hard. So I pay a 3rd party to transport it over here for me.

Even better would be if I could say, do that 3rd parties taxes so he doesnt have to pay a 4th party for that with the money Im going to give him.

Im not saying having a barter system now would be better than the credit card system we have (haha). Just saying that you can use 3rd party trading and good selling and you dont have to use your tribemates, and maybe use others. It makes a better working econ when you can do that.